toronto wants to ban vaping..

[Fergie]

So ... if it is deemed as evil as cigarettes, and a ban is put in effect, where do vapers go to vape? Are we to go to the designated smoking areas?
Will we be forced to breath the same smoke we've come to hate, if we are to be lumped in with smokers?

 

[Captainlady]

I vape at home, when I'm outside perhaps walking down the street or at work. At home, I vape inside sometimes when I would only smoke outside. Walking down the street I'd normally be smoking anyways and at work, I vape outside with the other smokers and vapers. I'd love it if I could vape inside but then I would have to find some other excuse to leave my desk frequently because I'm bored out of my skull.

Other than in my own place, I don't vape where I wouldn't smoke. However, I did vape without the guilt at a Starbucks today... Outside on the patio where pre-vaping and by-laws aside I would have ignored any dirty looks, no smoking signs and lit up anyway.

 

[Towmotor]

afaik toronto might be the only city to treat vaping as to smoking analogues, feel free to correct me if im wrong

The story on CityTv stated that two cities (Red Deer and ???) already had imposed cigarette style vaping restrictions.

 

[Poli]

Sounds like it's going to happen.

 

[RebeccaX]

CTV's Canada AM had a so-called "expert" on this morning, Monica Sarkar, from the Ontario Lung Association, who stated that 15% of young people are trying e-cigarettes. I have no idea where she is getting this information (pulling it out of her ....?), but I was yelling at my TV this morning, listening to her.

Canada AM | Video - Watch Canada's Most Watched National Morning News Program - Canada AM

 

[moralizer]

stated that 15% of young people are trying e-cigarettes. I have no idea where she is getting this information (pulling it out of her ....?

We need to ask better questions. Its not where she pulled the numbers from, But:
1. What is the sample size? Anything fewer than 2500 is too few.
2. How many of these kids had smoked analogs? (I'll bet over 90%)
3. How many smoked analogs first?
4. What is the error rate?
5. Was there any surveyors bias? (Give me any answer you want and I can design a questionnaire which will produce the desired effect)
6. What other sampling errors are there?

There are a lot of legitimate ways to disqualify these random studies. If these details are not mentioned without being asked that most likely hints at the error rate being extremely high, probabilistically speaking.

Most live news segments, reporters etc. take questions on Twitter. Direct all responses to them, it reduces the chances of getting into flame wars with people who know little but want a say.

Create enough noise on twitter and we will be heard.

That said:

I was at a convenience store a few weeks ago that I visited often when I used analogs. Was surprised to see he had some brands of disposable ecigs on display. Spoke to him, he had 'em for quite a few months maybe longer. Here's the kicker though, he did not quite know what they were.

There were no warnings on the box, he was unaware that they contained nicotine. He is not dim either. He was immediately concerned as he did not know if he sold 'em to the younger folks, he discarded them immediately.

There are some concerns here. Some of these need to be fixed asap. Unfortunately a handful of people (albeit very small) trying to capitalize on the vaping opportunities are doing stupid things because of the lack of regulations.

I do not want regulations, but when stupid people do stupid things, I am forced to step back and ask is this what is needed?

 

[Ayce]

The biggest problem I have with that "report" is the way they go on about kids using them. Kids will get into booze as well, but that isn't mentioned as it would undermine their fear mongering report. I agree some regulation is welcome and warranted, but an outright ban because it "normalizes smoking behaviors" and "is a gateway to "real" tobacco products" is bogus. As far as the "heated propylene glycol turns into formaldehyde" statement, how high does the temp have to be, and how much is created? Same thing for the other contaminates found, mainly, how many ppm compared to an analog? These are things not being reported, and no sources of research are given, just the "BAN IT! SOMEBODY THINK OF THE CHILDREN" (aka, I don't like it, so nobody else should either) reaction. It's all about the $$$.

 

[vincom]

can we start an email campaign to the person inhead of the toronto health board and the ontario miinstry of health
whos onboard......and what are their email addresses

 

[fourtytwo]

New CBC report. go here and vote on the bottom.

Ottawa Public Health wants more e-cigarette research, regulations - Ottawa - CBC News

 

[Ayce]

I voted, but I think it's a skewed poll.

Option 1: Yes, I'm worried about them being used where cigarettes aren't allowed.
Well, not really. I don't mind if people don't want us vaping in certain areas, but it's O.K. if they allow it.

Option 2: No, I believe they're safe and don't want to mix e-cigarette smokers with tobacco smokers.
(I voted for this one.) While not proven 100% save, I believe they're 99.9% safer than analogs. Being segregated into the smoking section won't help keep us off.
IM(nsh)O, the idea is to do just that. Get us back on analogs so they can alienate us and tax the life out of us.

 

[vincom]

38% r worried about them being used where cigarettes aren't allowed.
maybe the govt can do a education campaign like what they did w.analogues
problem being the govt needs to get educated first, hence the general public
my sig below is proof of what vaping is all about, to me anyways

 

[Fergie]

CONSUMER RELEASE
Re: TORONTO PUBLIC HEALTH POSiTION STATEMENT ON ELECTRONIC CIGARETTES

http://media.wix.com/ugd/2d4e8a_26c355846e2e4ea6be98b9e69b9eaea5.pdf

 

[aggo]

There's a petition out. https://www.change.org/en-CA/petiti...e-and-use-of-electronic-cigarettes-in-toronto

 

[Ryedan]

Thanks for the heads up, Ryedan. I threw in a quick blurb on the comments as well:

My comment disappeared from both sites. I re-tried just now without a link to the CASAA vaping info page. Maybe that will help.

 

[Ryedan]

There's a petition out. https://www.change.org/en-CA/petiti...e-and-use-of-electronic-cigarettes-in-toronto

Seems to be from a group of e-cig shops in the GTA. It's too bad they only focus on issues affecting their bottom line, but it's better than nothing.

 

[Talyon]

Our lazy government needs to create new laws regarding vapeing and not lump us with combustibles.

They also need to use proper science to achieve this.

The sad thing is that many smokers may not choose to switch if these proposals go forward as the city wishes.

Fords past time is in, vape is ???

 

[Ryedan]

CONSUMER RELEASE
Re: TORONTO PUBLIC HEALTH POSiTION STATEMENT ON ELECTRONIC CIGARETTES

http://media.wix.com/ugd/2d4e8a_26c355846e2e4ea6be98b9e69b9eaea5.pdf

Just wanted to mention, this is from CAVR. It lists Toronto councilors and public health email addresses too. I live in Brampton. Does anyone know if there is any point in me writing to councilors or speaking to the Board of Health in Toronto on Monday?

 

[Talyon]

Just wanted to mention, this is from CAVR. It lists Toronto councilors and public health email addresses too. I live in Brampton. Does anyone know if there is any point in me writing to councilors or speaking to the Board of Health in Toronto on Monday?

Canadians Advocating Vapers Rights

Correct. Ryedan.

All help is of course great, and what your doing is probably enough IMHO. But since this will affect all In Ontario sooner then later it may be a good idea for u to do so, I'll leave that mainly up to yourself and perhaps those that would know better then I.

 

[Vanisle]

Someone correct me if I am wrong but I recall Victoria Health authorities tried this same move not too long ago and the City Council shot it down. Vaping is still allowed in public parks etc.

For those that say you can't fix stupid you just need to try a bigger hammer.

 

[aggo]

Seems to be from a group of e-cig shops in the GTA. It's too bad they only focus on issues affecting their bottom line, but it's better than nothing.

Personally, I agree with their position and with what SoftSell said earlier. I hate to say it, but I think the cloud-chasing phenomenon might in some way be posing a bit of a problem for getting vaping more accepted. Some people probably watch them blowing massive dragon plumes and think, "Whoa, I don't want that going on in my establishment". I've gone to vape meets at bars and restaurants where the whole place was fogged up in no time. Really makes me wonder if many people are going to be cool with this. Even if they're not cloud chasing, it can cause some confusion and irritation in bars, restaurants and workplaces, though I think most vapers are courteous and mindful. It's a real slippery slope. Of course, I totally disagree with banning sales on liquids (except to minors). It would be great if there were "vaping lounges".