Trying to create "ultimate" tobacco vape with minimal coil gunking
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My juices steeped about 8 days now and I sampled the non-tobacco ones 5-7 days after mixing them. I keep sniffing the tobacco ones. I noticed that within a week Virgina transformed from having a just caramel like aroma to more Burleyish like aroma. Cigar Passion has a very strong florally scent, let's see if it'll become more tobacco like. Virginia, Burley and Cuban Supreme all have some common notes, like the main one in the Burley. Desert ship is interesting, it has pickle like aspects to it 
Here are my impressions so far
Hazelnut 1.5%
Very realistic flavor, good contender as a tobacco mixer. Needs flavor boost. Remixed to 2.5%
Honey 1.5%
Same as above. Realistic taste, enjoyable and will go well with tobaccos. Needs flavor boost, Remixed to 3%
Cocoa 3%
Realistic pure and simple chocolate flavor like dark ones, non sweet an no milk, will go well with tobaccos. Needs flavor boost. Remixed to 5%.
Coconut 3%
I don't get much coconut from this one yet. A slight musty flavor...Promising, maybe? Remixed to 5%
Caramel 4%
This one I have problem with. Very chemically so far, almost like burning/melting plastic.. Remixed it to 6%
Pineapple 4%
Not much pineapple, more like the peel of a green apple. Remixed it to 6%
I'll let these steep three more days and resample them...
I've been doing some more flavor research. The ones next in my list are:
Blackcurrant
Maple Syrup
Fresh Cream
From couple of reviews I read that, Fresh Cream mixed in about 1% gives a good roundness and light creaminess to tobacco mixes.I'm thinking like the creaminess one gets from some of the cigars. I think it'll be worth to try it...
I also hear that FA's Blackcurrant flavor makes a very good vape. That's why I added it here. The reviews are very good as a fruit and tobacco mixer. Can somebody please describe its flavor to me? I don't have a "good picture" of it in my head at this point...
Here are my impressions so far
Hazelnut 1.5%
Very realistic flavor, good contender as a tobacco mixer. Needs flavor boost. Remixed to 2.5%
Honey 1.5%
Same as above. Realistic taste, enjoyable and will go well with tobaccos. Needs flavor boost, Remixed to 3%
Cocoa 3%
Realistic pure and simple chocolate flavor like dark ones, non sweet an no milk, will go well with tobaccos. Needs flavor boost. Remixed to 5%.
Coconut 3%
I don't get much coconut from this one yet. A slight musty flavor...Promising, maybe? Remixed to 5%
Caramel 4%
This one I have problem with. Very chemically so far, almost like burning/melting plastic.. Remixed it to 6%
Pineapple 4%
Not much pineapple, more like the peel of a green apple. Remixed it to 6%
I'll let these steep three more days and resample them...
I've been doing some more flavor research. The ones next in my list are:
Blackcurrant
Maple Syrup
Fresh Cream
From couple of reviews I read that, Fresh Cream mixed in about 1% gives a good roundness and light creaminess to tobacco mixes.I'm thinking like the creaminess one gets from some of the cigars. I think it'll be worth to try it...
I also hear that FA's Blackcurrant flavor makes a very good vape. That's why I added it here. The reviews are very good as a fruit and tobacco mixer. Can somebody please describe its flavor to me? I don't have a "good picture" of it in my head at this point...
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The closest I can describe black currant is along the blackberry line with a slight bit of tartness. If you are getting a chemical flavor from Caramel, it might help if you bring it down a bit. Sometimes less is more.
Thank you! I thought the same caramel. I possibly way overshoot this time...
Honey 3%
I'm getting 60% floral + %40 honey notes now. It's not sweet "tasting" on the tongue at all. Though on the exhale it gives some sweet sensation. I'm surprised since some reviews called it very sweet. I'm not too fond of the floral part of it. It's more like floral scents of dryer sheets. I might try the Maple Syrup instead in tobacco mixes for some sweetness and flavor. I'll let it steep more and see it changes. It's been 11 days since the initial 1.5 % mix.
Hazelnut 2.5%
This developed some sweet notes to it. It's somewhat candy like than what I'd prefer. It might be too strong at 2.5% by itself. But it'll be interesting to see what it brings at 1% to the tobacco mixes.
Cocoa 5%
Very dry dark chocolate like, not sweet. The kind you smell when you break a piece of average quality dark chocolate. I got some burning taste from the coils after about 0.5 ml of vaping. Then it was OK but the flavor got dimmed somewhat. I checked my wick and coil (kanger T2 tank) and a part of the coil had some accumulation on it but both of the flavor and coil wick had no burns on it. I think some coils got partially covered with gunk. It might still be OK to mix it 1-2 % to tobacco mixes.
Virginia 2%
At 11 days of steeping, it developed a dry leathery and earthy flavor to it. The juice itself has a pleasant dark yellowish color. The taste is very reminiscent of a light colored (Connecticut maybe?) aged cigar wrapper flavor. I'm very glad with it so far since this will be a very good component in a tobacco blend. As standalone it's nice vape so far. But I'd prefer some other notes in it as well for a more complex tasting blend. From what I read, it'll develop more with more steeping. I'll retry it at 20 days.
I'm getting 60% floral + %40 honey notes now. It's not sweet "tasting" on the tongue at all. Though on the exhale it gives some sweet sensation. I'm surprised since some reviews called it very sweet. I'm not too fond of the floral part of it. It's more like floral scents of dryer sheets. I might try the Maple Syrup instead in tobacco mixes for some sweetness and flavor. I'll let it steep more and see it changes. It's been 11 days since the initial 1.5 % mix.
Hazelnut 2.5%
This developed some sweet notes to it. It's somewhat candy like than what I'd prefer. It might be too strong at 2.5% by itself. But it'll be interesting to see what it brings at 1% to the tobacco mixes.
Cocoa 5%
Very dry dark chocolate like, not sweet. The kind you smell when you break a piece of average quality dark chocolate. I got some burning taste from the coils after about 0.5 ml of vaping. Then it was OK but the flavor got dimmed somewhat. I checked my wick and coil (kanger T2 tank) and a part of the coil had some accumulation on it but both of the flavor and coil wick had no burns on it. I think some coils got partially covered with gunk. It might still be OK to mix it 1-2 % to tobacco mixes.
Virginia 2%
At 11 days of steeping, it developed a dry leathery and earthy flavor to it. The juice itself has a pleasant dark yellowish color. The taste is very reminiscent of a light colored (Connecticut maybe?) aged cigar wrapper flavor. I'm very glad with it so far since this will be a very good component in a tobacco blend. As standalone it's nice vape so far. But I'd prefer some other notes in it as well for a more complex tasting blend. From what I read, it'll develop more with more steeping. I'll retry it at 20 days.
Hey guys/gals,
How does FA Maxx Blend compare to 7 Leaves? Is Maxx Blend more "unlit" cigarette like than 7 Leaves? From what Exchaner described, 7 Leaves sounds like more pipe like light pipe tobacco than a cigarette?
How does FA Maxx Blend compare to 7 Leaves? Is Maxx Blend more "unlit" cigarette like than 7 Leaves? From what Exchaner described, 7 Leaves sounds like more pipe like light pipe tobacco than a cigarette?
Chinook, I actually describe 7 Leaves more like a roll your own tobacco than pipe. They have a similar profile as Parliament cigs. Not aromatic at all. As for Maxx, I will let others chime in since I've already mentioned it above. It has a bit of caramel in it. BTW I am steeping FA cocoa at 1.5 %. won't dare go any higher I understand from what I've read that it needs a long steep. There is a chart somewhere that lists manufacturer's recommended percentages as well as user's opinions. It could be very helpful. Will see if I can find it. But in general FA has very concentrated flavorings and most of them are recommended below 3%.
I understand from what I've read that it needs a long steep. There is a chart somewhere that lists manufacturer's recommended percentages as well as user's opinions. It could be very helpful. Will see if I can find it. But in general FA has very concentrated flavorings and most of them are recommended below 3%.Thanks Exchaner! I got it on the 7 Leaves.
From some other discussions, I found this spreadsheet.
https://spreadsheets.google.com/spr..._hQ6Fu8HdEwwR2dLRUJlVjlabEN1NG1ucktuUVE&gid=0
For FA Cocoa, I initially mixed it at 3% and tasted it after one week. It didn't taste as strong as I'd like it. At 5% tasting, it definitely had enough flavor If I mix it in tobaccos, I was thinking, I'll do 1-2%. Let us know how it changes after a long steep.
I'm thinking of getting Maple Syrup, Fresh Cream and Blackcurrant as tobacco additives next.
From some other discussions, I found this spreadsheet.
https://spreadsheets.google.com/spr..._hQ6Fu8HdEwwR2dLRUJlVjlabEN1NG1ucktuUVE&gid=0
For FA Cocoa, I initially mixed it at 3% and tasted it after one week. It didn't taste as strong as I'd like it. At 5% tasting, it definitely had enough flavor
If I mix it in tobaccos, I was thinking, I'll do 1-2%. Let us know how it changes after a long steep. I'm thinking of getting Maple Syrup, Fresh Cream and Blackcurrant as tobacco additives next.
Chinook, you might also consider Billberry as an additive to tobacco. It is similar to blueberry but more flavorful. Just ordered it yesterday along with chocolate cream from HS. Also ordered TFA double chocolate. Keeping my fingers crossed that one of them might turn out right. Any ideas what type of tobacco to use with chocolate? I am thinking perhaps Cuban Supreme.
Exchaner, thanks on the Billberry suggestion. I also read about that one... I also put an order last night. I got all FA Maple Syrup, Fresh Cream, Blackcurrant, 7 Leaves and Maxx Blend. So far I only tasted the Virginia from the tobaccos and I'm pleased with it.
In terms of additives, I think FA Hazelnut and Cocoa will work OK. I just need to see the results mixed with tobacco. I'm not sure yet about the honey, coconut, pineapple and caramel. I need to let them steep little bit more.
Let me know how the TFA double chocolate works. In terms of matching that with tobacco, I think it should work OK with most medium to full bodies tobaccos. I just don't know yet though how it'll taste in the mixture together.
This brings me to another question.,,, How to adjust the percentages in the tobacco mixtures. Let's say, by themselves I enjoy
Tobacco A 2%
Tobacco B 3%
Cacao 4%
Blackcurrant 4%
Let's say I'd like to make a juice by using all of these four with more upfront tobacco taste and more subtle taste of Cacao and Blackcurrant flavor. What would be a good starting point? Something like this maybe, tobaccos cut by 33% and others by 50%?
Tobacco A 1.3%
Tobacco B 2%
Cacao 2%
Blackcurrant 2%
In terms of additives, I think FA Hazelnut and Cocoa will work OK. I just need to see the results mixed with tobacco. I'm not sure yet about the honey, coconut, pineapple and caramel. I need to let them steep little bit more.
Let me know how the TFA double chocolate works. In terms of matching that with tobacco, I think it should work OK with most medium to full bodies tobaccos. I just don't know yet though how it'll taste in the mixture together.
This brings me to another question.,,, How to adjust the percentages in the tobacco mixtures. Let's say, by themselves I enjoy
Tobacco A 2%
Tobacco B 3%
Cacao 4%
Blackcurrant 4%
Let's say I'd like to make a juice by using all of these four with more upfront tobacco taste and more subtle taste of Cacao and Blackcurrant flavor. What would be a good starting point? Something like this maybe, tobaccos cut by 33% and others by 50%?
Tobacco A 1.3%
Tobacco B 2%
Cacao 2%
Blackcurrant 2%
I read in the other thread that you should not let your total % go above 4-5% with FA. In your particular case you might go a bit higher since you seem to like more flavor. Another factor is how one flavor dominates another. For example I mix Maxx Blend at 3%, and TFA blueberry wild at the same % as stand alones. But when mixed together the Maxx over-powers the fruit. Therefore I cut the Maxx to 2% and left the fruit at 3%. It is now much better. The hard part about tobaccos is the long steeping time - up to 6 weeks sometimes, especially with 7 Leaves. I finally decided to buy a high quality Thermos that keeps the heat for seven hours. Currently experimenting with it. So much more convenient than a crock pot.
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Yes, indeed I also took some notes that with FA total shouldn't be over 6% most cases. I think I have some experimentation to do with these ratios. I'm still doing the single flavor tastings these days.
Indeed, the downside about this is steeping for a log time. 6 weeks is a long time! I gave myself until new years to come up with a satisfactory vape. I have about 3 months to dial it in -- we'll see.
I think Thermos is a great idea! They say this heating step adds about 2 weeks of steeping time, not bad
I'm constantly reading about all these long steep times for tobaccos. My favorite tobaccos from Hangsen & Inawera are pretty much good to go from the start. I'll sometimes drop them in the CP for a few hours. I have a bunch of tobacco mixes that have been ageing anywhere from 2 days to 6 months. I don't taste any significant difference in any of these mixes to warrant fretting over a certain amount of time set aside to blend/age/steep. I mix my Inawera's around 2-3%, Hangsen 4-7%
I think it depends on what type of tobacco. Perique black for example does not need any steeping. HS Turkish on the other hand has no taste for me for nearly two weeks - none whatsoever, even at 6%. According to Danny45, one of those tobaccos will not even steep in an UC. It must be steeped naturally for a minimum of 5 weeks. Perhaps Danny will chime in. I know he reads these threads.
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Hi all,
I'm starting to experiment with DIY tobacco juices. I do extract my own NET juices, although they are pretty tasty, they do gunk the coils even after 2 ml.
I decided to experiment with vendor non-NET tobacco flavorings and decided on the following. The non-tobacco flavors below are the nuances I think I'd like in a vape along with the main tobacco taste.
I'll first mix these flavors in a 60/40 PG/VG 10mg/ml nic base and test them as stand alone. The percentages are what I compiled from the forums for stand alone flavors...
I'm looking for a complex and interesting tobacco taste without being too "smokey" like Latakias or campfire smoke. I'd like to have some faint nuances of caramel, cacao, nuts and a touch of tropical taste (hence pineapple).
My ultimate vape will be like American Spirits Organics + some cigar wrapper nuances
FlavorArt Tobacco:
7 Leaves 2%
Desert Ship Blend 2%
Cigar Passion 3%
FlavorArt:
Cocoa 5%
Hazelnut 2%
Capella:
Caramel 8%
Chocolate Coconut Almond 13%
Coconut 13%
Pineapple 13%
Liquid Sucralose as sweetener
Are any of these flavors in these percentages coil gunkers? How about sucralose in terms of coil gunking.
Do these FlavorArt tobaccos give some sense of real tobacco experience: 7 Leaves, Desert Ship Blend, Cigar Passion ?
Any comments will be appreciated!
Chinook,
Try this on a 10ml sample:
FA Desert Ship 3.2% or 15 drops
FA Cocoa 1.7% or 8 drops
Kurt
Thanks Kurt, I'm making a note of this!
By the way, I sampled Desert Ship at 2% tonight after 12 day steep. It reminded of Ahlusion's Sahara Blend which is about $0.50 per ml. With $4 10 ml FA Desert Ship one can make 500ml of eliquid
BTW, I just sampled Burley at 2% and 12 days steeped. It's quite reminiscent of toned down FA Virginia with its leather and earthiness but also with a touch of anise/licorice sweetness to it. I'll see how it evolves over time. As it is, it's more like a light cigar + pipe "component", not the full version of the real thing. Very clean taste as it is.
I've been reading about FA Black Fire as a smokey/ashy helper to other tobacco flavors in small doses. If I think what Black Fire tastes like is right, it can be added to Burley to make a pretty realistic tobacco vape.
I need some more time experiment to see if one needs both FA Burley and FA Virginia in the mixing cabinet since so far, they seem pretty complementary to each other.
I've been reading about FA Black Fire as a smokey/ashy helper to other tobacco flavors in small doses. If I think what Black Fire tastes like is right, it can be added to Burley to make a pretty realistic tobacco vape.
I need some more time experiment to see if one needs both FA Burley and FA Virginia in the mixing cabinet since so far, they seem pretty complementary to each other.
Burley is one of those flavors that comes out rather quickly without too much steeping. I use it at 1%. One of the veterans on the ECF has a recipe mixing Burley + Cardamon. Sounds yummy.... How is black currant at 4%? I personally use it at 1.5% and very pleased.
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