UNICORN MILK by Cuttwood

[AmandaD]

I believe PG is used in asthma inhalers.....just sayin

 

[JmanEspresso]

Show us two examples where a vendor has changed their juice formula because of excessive coil buildup. Ever try a juice from Vapetrik? That stuff is hell on coils and carto's.

So because it hasn't been done, it means the vendor did it for other reasons?


I doubt you have vaped this liquid, Im vaping it currently. Its the most unique liquid Ive ever seen. Milky, thick.. Its like condensed milk, honestly. I have vaped some coil gunking juices in my time(havent had Vapetrik, plan too eventually), and this one takes the cake. It also happens to be delicious.

 

[JmanEspresso]

I believe PG is used in asthma inhalers.....just sayin

Yes, it is. I have mine right here next to me.

 

[ccwaters]

I would certainly think any juice maker would jump on a rumor like this and deny it, if it were BS, I'm sure they are very aware of what is hammering ECF, Instagram, Facebook, Reddit, and all the other sites. Silence certainly does not help.. the old cliche? Any press is good press? or whatever it is.

 

[JmanEspresso]

Look my whole thing is, there is proof. Not one iota of proof that says using a food colorant in eliquid, which contains titanium dioxide, is bad for us.

I mean.. There is A LOT of juice which has coloring. Im not of the opinion that its a bad thing. I actually find it to be a cool thing, especially when its done to highten the marketing effect of the juice. Radiator Pluid being a neon green, just makes its cooler. Unicorn Blood being the blood red color it is, is just cool.

PLENTY of juices use coloring. But we dont know whats in them either. And no one has pointed and undue blame on those vendors...





There is also no PROOF, that Titanium Dioxide is in the liquid.
-Is there suspect information? Yea, Ill give you that.

But there isnt any proof. At all.



If it turns out that unicorn blood is something that is going to give me cancer, ill be the first in line to point blame. But right now, all we have is conjecture and outrage, based on nothing substantial other than assumptions.

 

[Kropotkin]

No one has even proven that Titanium Dioxide is:

A- in the juice

B-assuming its in the juice, that in its state, is harmful.

The juice maker could easily clear all this up by simply issuing a statement. Instead, he's making up silly stories, which - as others have pointed out - doesn't bode well in any circumstance.

Somebody above suggested a movement to encourage venders to list their ingredients, just like food venders do. That makes a lot of sense to me, since people aren't free to make choices if they've no idea what they're buying.

Would others support labeling as a way to prevent stuff like this happening in future?

 

[suspectK]

^have you asked a vendor like Alice in vapeland what their ratios are?

 

[Jay-dub]

Please remember to "attack the post, not the poster." BE NICE!

Information about this is all over the internet now. Hopefully, everyone who could be affected will have the information they need to make the proper and correct decision for themselves on how to handle this situation. I personally, would be very, very irritated to find this information if I'd ordered that particular ejuice. One tends to believe juice makers research ingredients before adding them to their products, or at least we hope they do.

As suggested earlier, this is all supposition at this time. There's no need to get mad at anyone in here as we're all concerned with what's best for our health and vaping in general.

You've just posted the most level-headed, non-dismissive, concise statement I think I've ever seen anyone of your position post. I haven't looked up your sex or orientation. Wanna get married?

 

[Vagabondnurse]

So because it hasn't been done, it means the vendor did it for other reasons?


I doubt you have vaped this liquid, Im vaping it currently. Its the most unique liquid Ive ever seen. Milky, thick.. Its like condensed milk, honestly. I have vaped some coil gunking juices in my time(havent had Vapetrik, plan too eventually), and this one takes the cake. It also happens to be delicious.

So you admit that you've never seen a vendor change their formula due to coil buildup. Good. Now we have a vendor, the first either of us have seen, change their formula just as questions arise regarding its components. Right after a seller of the product questioned the maker about its ingredients. And finally a vendor that has done nothing to refute any of the negative press he's receiving.

With coincidences like that someone needs to buy a lottery ticket or two.

Edit: I was actually just trying to find a vendor for this juice this morning when I happened upon this thread. I wanted to compare it to my Suicide Bunny "Mother's Milk" and Mt. Baker's "Moo Juice," two strawberry milk juices I have had.

 

[BooBoo888]

No one has even proven that Titanium Dioxide is:

A- in the juice

B-assuming its in the juice, that in its state, is harmful.


The only thing I can find out about Titanium Dioxide being harmful, has to do with the nanoparticles of the substance. Titanium Dioxide is approved for use in food coloring, pharmecuetical drugs, cosmetics, etc etc.


IN ITS nanoparticle form, there is the POSSIBILITY, OF ITS BEING A POSSIBLE CARCINOGEN. There is no definitive proof.


--

There is no prood Titanium Dioxide is in the juice. Thats number 1.

But assuming it is..

Is it in the juice in nano particle form? Probably not. Why? Well, again, based on nothing but conjecture, as this whole thread has been so far, the idea is the the juice contains iciing whitener. Iciing whitener, a food colorant, is fully able to use titanium oxide, because titanium dioxide has been approved for that use. The nanoparticle form of TD, is not what you would use to make a food colorant.

People hear vapor and they're going to automatically assume that vapor and nano particles go together. There is no dust in vapor.



BUT.. ASSSSSSUMING ALLLLL OF THAT. iT STILL HAS TO BE PROVEN SAFE FOR INHALTION.



But wait.

Propolyene Glycol
and
Vegetable Glycerin

have not been PROVEN SAFE for inhalation. They are labled as GRAS. Which means, GENERALLY REGARDED AS SAFE, furthermore, that is not specifically speaking to inhalation, just its use for consumption.

-----------



Titanium Dioxide sounds like a scary word. And without ANY PROOF on either side of the table, the mere mention of the Nano Particle phase of TD, POSSIBLY BEING A POSSIBLE CARCINOGEN(in rats), is apparently enough to convice enough of you to throw your best fightin' hats on, and threaten, demand, blame and persecute everyone you can find who doesn't agree with your unproven mission statement.

Never tried this juice before, but this is a very intelligent comment. You're 100% correct.

People love to get extremely bent out of shape about additives they may be consuming if there is even a whisper that they might be harmful in some manner or another, regardless of the actual science behind it. Let's take a rational approach here.

 

[Kropotkin]

^have you asked a vendor like Alice in vapeland what their ratios are?

I'm not talking about super magical recipe secrets - just a simple ingredients list like that on a box of cornflakes.

Do you think that would be excessive for some reason?

 

[ruet]

The attitude, arrogance and disregard for safety being shown by some in this thread is unnerving. ...at best. I can't, nor do I want to, make you stop vaping whatever you want. However, consumers should have all of the information on the table so they can make an informed decision. So with that in mind, here is what we know about Titanium Dioxide:

Titanium Dioxide : OSH Answers

What are the potential health effects of titanium dioxide?

Main Routes of Exposure: Inhalation; skin contact; eye contact.

Inhalation: At high concentrations: can irritate the nose and throat.
Skin Contact: May cause mild irritation.
Eye Contact: May cause slight irritation as a "foreign object". Tearing, blinking and mild temporary pain may occur as particles are rinsed from the eye by tears.
Ingestion: Not harmful.
Effects of Long-Term (Chronic) Exposure: Conclusions cannot be drawn from the limited studies available.
Carcinogenicity: Possible carcinogen. May cause cancer based on animal information. Has been associated with: lung cancer.
International Agency for Research on Cancer (IARC): Group 2B - Possibly carcinogenic to humans.
American Conference for Governmental Industrial Hygienists (ACGIH): A4 - Not classifiable as a human carcinogen.*Under review by ACGIH.

Teratogenicity / Embryotoxicity: Not known to harm the unborn child.
Reproductive Toxicity: Not known to be a reproductive hazard.
Mutagenicity: Not known to be a mutagen.

What does this tell us? Titanium Dioxide is not harmful when touched. It's not harmful when eaten. It won't hurt you if you drink it or take a bath in it. It's not harmful when you get it in your eyes. But, it might cause cancer. When? When it's inhaled.

What is Titanium Dioxide used for:

Titanium dioxide - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

TiO2 is also an effective opacifier in powder form, where it is employed as a pigment to provide whiteness and opacity to products such as paints, coatings, plastics, papers, inks, foods, medicines (i.e. pills and tablets) as well as most toothpastes. In paint, it is often referred to offhandedly as "the perfect white", "the whitest white", or other similar terms. Opacity is improved by optimal sizing of the titanium dioxide particles. Some grades of titanium based pigments as used in sparkly paints, plastics, finishes and pearlescent cosmetics are man-made pigments whose particles have two or more layers of various oxides – often titanium dioxide, iron oxide or alumina – in order to have glittering, iridescent and or pearlescent effects similar to crushed mica or guanine-based products. In addition to these effects a limited color change is possible in certain formulations depending on how and at which angle the finished product is illuminated and the thickness of the oxide layer in the pigment particle; one or more colours appear by reflection while the other tones appear due to interference of the transparent titanium dioxide layers.[26] In some products, the layer of titanium dioxide is grown in conjunction with iron oxide by calcination of titanium salts (sulfates, chlorates) around 800 °C[27] or other industrial deposition methods such as chemical vapour deposition on substrates such as mica platelets or even silicon dioxide crystal platelets of no more than 50 µm in diameter.[28] The iridescent effect in these titanium oxide particles (which are only partly natural) is unlike the opaque effect obtained with usual ground titanium oxide pigment obtained by mining, in which case only a certain diameter of the particle is considered and the effect is due only to scattering.
In ceramic glazes titanium dioxide acts as an opacifier and seeds crystal formation.
Titanium dioxide has been shown statistically to increase skimmed milk's whiteness, increasing skimmed milk's sensory acceptance score.[29]
Titanium dioxide is used to mark the white lines of some tennis courts.[30]
The exterior of the Saturn V rocket was painted with titanium dioxide; this later allowed astronomers to determine that J002E3 was the S-IVB stage from Apollo 12 and not an asteroid.

Basically it's, safely, used in many products, including foodstuffs, as a whitener.

Where can someone who wants to make use of Titanium Dioxide acquire it? All over the place.

https://www.google.com/search?q=tit...j7&sourceid=chrome&espv=210&es_sm=93&ie=UTF-8

Based on what I've seen in pictures of the liquid it looks as though Titanium Dioxide might have been used to give it it's unique apperance. Until I see otherwise I'm going to assume that's the case. If you drank the e-liquid you would get sick from the nicotine but you probably wouldn't even know you ingested TD. It's perfectly safe until you vaporize or aerosolized it by heating it with your coil thereby releasing it from it's suspension to be inhaled into your lungs. What happens when you inhale it? The jury's out but it might be carcinogenic. PG and VG are not.

So in conclusion; you go ahead and vape whatever you want but don't come here and berate those of us who are concerned by what we are inhaling into our lungs and how it may effect our health. You know, the reason we (atleast I) got into vaping in the first place.

 

[SharonMM]

Before grandmasterlord was ejected from the forum, he mentioned that a colleague of his had the liquid tested and found that it contained Titanium Dioxide. He's the one who blew the lid off this thing, but all of his posts are gone now.

Likely it was him who tipped off the vendors, which led to the phonecall where the maker, Jared, admitted to using a food coloring that contained TD. I mean... How can anyone argue that there's no proof?

 

[Kropotkin]

Before grandmasterlord was ejected from the forum, he mentioned that a colleague of his had the liquid tested and found that it contained Titanium Dioxide. He's the one who blew the lid off this thing, but all of his posts are gone now.

Likely it was him who tipped off the vendors, which led to the phonecall where the maker, Jared, admitted to using a food coloring that contained TD. I mean... How can anyone argue that there's no proof?

And if there'd been no whistleblower, people might have been vaping it for years. Which is fine if you choose to do this, but not so fine if you never had the choice in the first place.

That's why I hope this little scandal will lead to some kind of self-regulating action on the community's part.

 

[suspectK]

^have you asked a vendor like Alice in vapeland what their ratios are?

I'm not talking about super magical recipe secrets - just a simple ingredients list like that on a box of cornflakes.

Do you think that would be excessive for some reason?

If they don't want to tell you the pg and vg ratio, why would they want to list ingredients? Plus, that is magical recipe secrets...put them out of order.. anyone could still figure it out if they have tastebuds.

I could care less...I don't sell liquid..I would definitely hear less whining from people about it that would be smoking cigarettes if not vaping if that would happen.. I'm sure people similar to some in this thread have already e-mailed the fda about it.

 

[Underwhelmed]

So you admit that you've never seen a vendor change their formula due to coil buildup. Good. Now we have a vendor, the first either of us have seen, change their formula just as questions arise regarding its components. Right after a seller of the product questioned the maker about its ingredients. And finally a vendor that has done nothing to refute any of the negative press he's receiving.

With coincidences like that someone needs to buy a lottery ticket or two.

Actually...
We had a thread with people raving about a juice.

Then some guy who was an un-registered vendor started saying this juice had an ingredient in it because some buddy of his had tested it and that it is dangerous.

Then we had some other guy who claimed to be a B&M owner, who also claims to know the juice maker, who claims he called the juice maker and that the juice maker admitted to using this ingredient and that he was planning on dropping said ingredient.

This thread is 99% hearsay. We don't know the "B&M owner" is who he says he is, nor do we know if the first guy (whistleblower/unregistered vendor/competitor) who said the juice was unsafe made the whole thing up after hearing that the juice was being reformulated, as that was announced before this even came up.

I've never bought or vaped this juice, but then again I don't use juices that have crazy colorings added to them to make them more marketable.

 

[Kropotkin]

If they don't want to tell you the pg and vg ratio, why would they want to list ingredients? Plus, that is magical recipe secrets...put them out of order.. anyone could still figure it out if they have tastebuds.

I could care less...I don't sell liquid..I would definitely hear less whining from people about it that would be smoking cigarettes if not vaping if that would happen.. I'm sure people similar to some in this thread have already e-mailed the fda about it.

I'm sure you're right.

But which would we all prefer - slightly ...... off venders, or an FDA crackdown?

The main reason I bring this up in the first place is because stuff like this looks so bad for the vaping community as a whole. This is a very volatile period for ecig legislation anyway, and I hardly think we need more crap for anti-vaping zealots to latch onto.

 

[jameth]

It is threads like this that make me even more happy with my switch to unflavored base nic liquid.

Food coloring and dyes, synthetic chemical flavorings, chemical additives for throat hit / lung fill....

I am glad to not be inhaling all those things anymore.


PG+VG+Nicotine = Done.

 

[iamzg]

Arhgraaaaawr why are we still talking about this? Vape it if you want and dont if you dont.

 

[Sissylala]

Arhgraaaaawr why are we still talking about this? Vape it if you want and dont if you dont.

Until you cant anymore because juice makers put potentially dangerous items in juice that don't need to be there and the FDA comes cracking down harder than ever.

Thats the thing. This did not need to be in the juice!!! It was added as a gimmick!