Updated!! Pennsylvania: 40% tax = game over for vape

[GBalkam]

It's Time for a Rally in the Major Cities.
It's Time for People with Signs in front of the TV Stations.
Its Time for a Letter Drive.
It's Time to Post EVERY House and Senate Member's Name who Voted for this Tax.

It Time to Do More than Talk.

Well people owning a horse and buggy are excused from driving out of state, since it is a 3 hour drive. I know in 3 hours I can drive from Canada (Holton) to NY State in just under 3 hours, and get to Deleware in about 4 hours more. Only took me an hour and 15 to cross PA, and that includes getting lost.

Besides, driving out of state is the "or else" to go with the signs.. NO TAX ON vape.. "OR ELSE" we will shop out of state and local business will flood your office with calls and voters will become unemployed and the jobless rate will go up and you will be remembered for years to come as the cause of it all. It is a pressure tactic, not a solution.

 

[pennysmalls]

No, the floor tax would be based on inventory as of Oct 1st. So if you've closed up shop prior to that, you are no longer a vape/tobacco retailer, don't have any inventory and there is no tax.

Thank god for small miracles. I hadn't read all of this in detail so didn't know about the Oct.1st date. I thought it was the two week date and that could have literally put vape shop owners out on the street.

 

[cllmda]

How would this been even remotely enforceable? Is it a "good faith" kind of thing? I know in my state I'm supposed to voluntarily pay sales tax on online purchases from out of state vendors. Yeah, that happens... right.

I guess they'd have a name and address from the purchase.I suppose online stores would be forced to submit lists of customers with their purchases + shipping names & addresses ..it all sounds so Big Brother-ish...SCARY

 

[ENAUD]

Thank god for small miracles. I hadn't read all of this in detail so didn't know about the Oct.1st date. I thought it was the two week date and that could have literally put vape shop owners out on the street.

Still, it's a two month window, half a fiscal quarter. Not a lot of time to reduce inventory to a minimum, and even that is not a great idea. You can't sell from an empty cart. So shop owners are faced with dumping inventory, probably at a loss, and having barely stocked shelves, or digging into saving or securing a loan to cover the tax, when ultimately they will have to price their goods well above market value just to stay afloat, and overhead never stops. It's a loose loose for any business. I think Oliver really nailed it with the title of this thread...Game over.

 

[Sugar_and_Spice]

Well people owning a horse and buggy are excused from driving out of state, since it is a 3 hour drive. I know in 3 hours I can drive from Canada (Holton) to NY State in just under 3 hours, and get to Deleware in about 4 hours more. Only took me an hour and 15 to cross PA, and that includes getting lost.

From east to west is around 300 miles so you must have went through a tiny flat corner of the state to do it in such little time. Plus there are plenty of mountains to slow down travel time. No, I don't reside in PA but I visit loads of friends who do, from the Delaware line to the Ohio line. And it certainly takes a whole lot longer than that what you claim.

 

[GBalkam]

From east to west is around 300 miles so you must have went through a tiny flat corner of the state to do it in such little time. Plus there are plenty of mountains to slow down travel time. No, I don't reside in PA but I visit loads of friends who do, from the Delaware line to the Ohio line. And it certainly takes a whole lot longer than that what you claim.

most likely.. I was on I95 (I think.. note.. getting lost prev post) going closer to the coast side. Either way, even if you discount those right in the middle, and say people 100mi from the borders (1.5h at 55mph aprox) and make a bi-weekly or monthly day of it.. (kids love out of state shopping.. we would get KFC and go to the city park and HUGE toy depts) It is an inconvenience for consumers, but minimize it by making it an outing and one stop shopping trip. The entire point of the trip, is not to save money on the juice, it is to take money from the Gov. of PA and make them lose face with voters. I never said it was the ideal way to go, but it is a lot more effective than sending a stack of letters that can be ignored or email that can be deleted and put on hold until it blows over. That loss of revenue is REAL and is going to be noticed. So drive or don't drive, it's up to you. You can take it standing up or take it bending over.... it's all up to you.

Even from dead center of PA you are still closer to NJ, DE, MD, VA, WV, and NY than the "east to west 300 miles" you state. Even at that you are never at at point in PA more that 150 mi from any other state.

LOL I don't think anyone near OH will drive to NJ, more likely just to NY or WV or OH.
anyway.. it's a case of short term pain for long term gain.

LOL I found this..
Dead Center Arms
Gun Shop
Address: 148 Main St, Brookville, PA
Dead Center of PA. I couldn't resist sharing.

 

[GBalkam]

From east to west is around 300 miles so you must have went through a tiny flat corner of the state to do it in such little time. Plus there are plenty of mountains to slow down travel time. No, I don't reside in PA but I visit loads of friends who do, from the Delaware line to the Ohio line. And it certainly takes a whole lot longer than that what you claim.

And I wasn't going from DE to OH. Even at 55mph an hour and a half is plenty of time to cross PA into any state that is NOT PA. You don't need to go to OH if you live near NJ.

 

[GBalkam]

I guess they'd have a name and address from the purchase.I suppose online stores would be forced to submit lists of customers with their purchases + shipping names & addresses ..it all sounds so Big Brother-ish...SCARY

Not without a Federal court order they wouldn't. Just try to get any store to give you their customer mailing list.. and good luck!!! It would take YEARS.

Now, As stated, I'm in NS, Canada. So my interest is purely from a "we could be next" position. (he said position.. heh heh heheh.. heh heh *Beavis and Butthead laugh here)... but there is a lot people in PA and in the USA who are concerned with the precedent being set in PA can do to make Gov't aware that they ain't happy and they ain't gonna take it.

 

[Iron Molly]

Not without a Federal court order they wouldn't. Just try to get any store to give you their customer mailing list.. and good luck!!! It would take YEARS.

Unfortunately, this is not true. They do it with tobacco cigarettes here. People have received large tax bills due after the fact from ordering mail order cigs. The ATF requires the vendors to give up the records, and they are forwarded to the states.

As far as driving out of state, I'm not in PA, I'm in CT. Hemmed in by other states with draconian tobacco policies. I'm prepared to drive to New Hampshire to get my vape stuff. And will do a lot of other shopping while I'm there. I'm sure I won't do it often, but it's certainly doable. Maybe I'll be lucky, and CT won't pass anything too bad. But I'm sure not counting on it.

 

[GBalkam]

Unfortunately, this is not true. They do it with tobacco cigarettes here. People have received large tax bills due after the fact from ordering mail order cigs. The ATF requires the vendors to give up the records, and they are forwarded to the states.

As far as driving out of state, I'm not in PA, I'm in CT. Hemmed in by other states with draconian tobacco policies. I'm prepared to drive to New Hampshire to get my vape stuff. And will do a lot of other shopping while I'm there. I'm sure I won't do it often, but it's certainly doable. Maybe I'll be lucky, and CT won't pass anything too bad. But I'm sure not counting on it.

There ya go! And it all adds up. If everyone in PA shorted the Gov 99 cents on their state income tax, they would notice! I'm not sure about the US but here >$1.00 is neither paid out nor collected.. So if you were $1 short here, they don't send the goon squad after it. lol

 

[Katmar]

So, is Pa going to come after all of us who have been buying online for years and try to collect back taxes? @retired1?????

 

[retired1]

So, is Pa going to come after all of us who have been buying online for years and try to collect back taxes? @retired1?????

Who knows? However, Pennsylvania just made the short list of states I'll never move to.

 

[Katmar]

Who knows? However, Pennsylvania just made the short list of states I'll never move to.

Gee, thanks!!!!

 

[retired1]

Gee, thanks!!!!

I think it's too early to tell what the state is going to do. I think it all depends on how they decide to enforce the new requirements and how desperate they'll be to spend money on enforcement. If the majority of physical stores decide to close their doors for good, I doubt they'll try to throw more money at collecting taxes from prior sales. Who knows, though. You'd think that an idiotic law like that would never see the light of day to begin with. They could be stupid enough to to blow more money on the pittance they'd actually get in return.

 

[classwife]

My husband came up with this :


...and every time you drive out of state to make a purchase, let your Reps know how much you spent that THEY didn't get their cut of.

 

[MikeE3]

My husband came up with this :


...and every time you drive out of state to make a purchase, let your Reps know how much you spent that THEY didn't get their cut of.

But make sure to do it w/ a non-traceable email.

 

[classwife]

My husband came up with this :


...and every time you drive out of state to make a purchase, let your Reps know how much you spent that THEY didn't get their cut of.

But make sure to do it w/ a non-traceable email.

Gonna quote myself...

I have been reading...

Seems it would still fall under a "Use Tax" responsibility
This is for Florida :
FL Dept Rev - Use Tax on Out-of-State Purchases

 

[classwife]

turds they be

 

[classwife]

PA has Use Tax too

Use Tax


so there goes that idea


edit to add :
Use Tax For Individuals

 

[MikeE3]

PA has Use Tax too

Use Tax


so there goes that idea


edit to add :
Use Tax For Individuals

Yepper ... it can be reported on line #25 of the PA Personal Income Tax. Looky, looky ... the tax is even on shipping and handling.

"Purchases of taxable items subject to Pennsylvania use tax, including shipping & handling"