Vapor Flask V3 DNA40 Clone thread

[Phone Guy]

i hope they were telling me the truth supposed to get a free 15ml bottle of some kind of jooooz too., we will see!
still waiting on my ipv4 also

i been drinking beer all day and i'm feelin no pain


picked out your Derby Winner yet?

I hope that juice is excellent! For all your hassle......

No, no derby pick here, how about you?

 

[cowfood]

Ok, so am I to understand that the Waidea's out now have a ground wire that is flaky? Poorly attached to the casing internally? And that if I receive one it will most likely need to be adjusted? Either poor battery life and or a intermittent fire button problems? And that one of you guys is going to use a washer to help solve the problem and others are thinking solder is the solution? Am I just trippin or am I just trippin?

-CF

 

[Tpat591]

Here's a sneak peak under the hood of the Waidea VF clone.
Interestingly enough it appears to have the exact same pin out as the authentic less the onboard buttons.
The second board you see is the charging board with a remote USB connector.

Note the 510 and the way the did the ground ...

Last two pictures show a Fatdaddy v4 spring loaded center pin assembly screwed into the Waidea VF clone 510
I'm going to remove the stationary 510, be the first guinea pig and retrofit the 510 with the guts from a FD v4 spring loaded and let you guys know how it works
Also I plan on fixing that ......ed half ... ground but using a proper ground washer from a FD assembly.

Wish me luck I'm going to put it back together now.

Here's my defective Kangxin DNA40 board and charging board.
The top half of the fire button is missing, the on-board up and down buttons are present.
Note the white wire on the top left corner of the dna board, that came from the charging board with the USB, it supplies 1.5 volts

My many thanks to both of you for your efforts in proving that Kangxin & Waidea do in fact carry the same ChiNA40 Chip/Board!

Willie, thanks for letting us peer under the hood & realize how much care Waidea took in installing such a sturdy ground in the device! It is not hard to understand what was causing TheBloke's initial issues he was having with his unit! What were they thinking?

 

[sando7]

I hope that juice is excellent! For all your hassle......

No, no derby pick here, how about you?

being a louivillian i always pick a field horse especially if it rains or if the track is sloppy which it usually is, you want to bet the first daily double cause that's where the cash is at...then the rest is gravy...the Derby is a crap-shoot.....bet what sounds good too you; .just get the first double down.

plus ive had about 6, 32 oz beers and i'm rockin on some Clapton, feeling good like i should!

 

[cowfood]

Ok, so am I to understand that the Waidea's out now have a ground wire that is flaky? Poorly attached to the casing internally? And that if I receive one it will most likely need to be adjusted? Either poor battery life and or a intermittent fire button problems? And that one of you guys is going to use a washer to help solve the problem and others are thinking solder is the solution? Am I just trippin or am I just trippin?

-CF

Ok, that's the negative lead, I was wondering where all this "ground" lead was coming from. These mods don't need grounding, for if they did, your body would be the path to ground, and since the circuit is based in battery land, where is all this talk about grounding.. Right, so the NEGATIVE LEAD is twisty tied to the inside of 510 connection.. Wow.. that is total trash.. I mean, ..., seriously.. That is the worst I am referencing the blurry drop box pics linked earlier.. And I will have to say, unless you want to pull this mod apart and properly solder that wire to the 510, stay away. And I will say, they have horrid QC with practice like that..

So far, waedia, total thumbs down unless you are diy.

-CF

 

[Croak]

Actually, that ground would be more than fine with a DNA30, it's flexible and yet still secure, and is easy to assemble and repair. I actually give Waidea props for doing something besides using a glob of solder on brass and wire.

The problem is, the mod itself is using a DNA40 clone that needs more (and solid) ground paths. Vaporflask made the same mistake with the early production runs of the v2.1 with the DNA40 inside, didn't ground it to Evolv's spec, and I'm willing to bet it was that early version Waidea cloned. More recently, HCigar did the same thing with the first production run of the HB40 mod.

All that said, you may never see any trouble with the device (a lot of early run VF customers are still using theirs), but if you do, it's a fairly easy fix IMHO, in the grand scheme of things.

 

[cowfood]

Actually, that ground would be more than fine with a DNA30, it's flexible and yet still secure, and is easy to assemble and repair. I actually give Waidea props for doing something besides using a glob of solder on brass and wire.

The problem is, the mod itself is using a DNA40 clone that needs more (and solid) ground paths. Vaporflask made the same mistake with the early production runs of the v2.1 with the DNA40 inside, didn't ground it to Evolv's spec, and I'm willing to bet it was that early version Waidea cloned. More recently, HCigar did the same thing with the first production run of the HB40 mod.

All that said, you may never see any trouble with the device (a lot of early run VF customers are still using theirs), but if you do, it's a fairly easy fix IMHO, in the grand scheme of things.

Well, it's above and beyond Evolv really, within the realm of TC, specs have to be tight, at least in these early adoption phases with this tech.. Perhaps new TC wire (a hybrid) will come into play.. But, back to this ground. it's a negative lead wire. ground - literally goes into the ground. positive and negative are the direction current flows in a circuit. This is a negative wire, hand wrapped around the negative portion of the 510 connector inside the mod completing the negative current flow of the circuit in this mod.. I'm sorry if I don't give praise to this practice, for example.. would you use that practice on the negative post of your cars battery? Maybe to get to the nearest gas station sure, but for every day, doubt it. Once loose, arcing can happen, poor performance, burnt insulation on wires, etc.. Bottom line, you get this device knowing it's twist tied, and have to open her up to make sure it's a "tight" enough twist to carry on without a hiccup or complete failure.. So, back to my point, it's great for those that are comfy with DIY, and ready to pull it apart in order to 1: verify and tighten the wire, 2: solder it, or 3: use hot glue to keep it in place.. or 4: hubba bubba bubble gum. or, just not worry about it, and get maybe 30% performance hit, or maybe 15% or maybe %50, and not know if it's your build or the mod, or the battery, or your etc etc....

I think you see where this is going..

-CF

 

[Croak]

I see you've made up your mind.

A battery terminal on many vehicles is just a round post (or hole) using a flexible circular connector held in place with mechanical friction. You know, kind of like how Waidea wired the negative on their product.

All that said, it's more than "twist tied", it's a solid loop around what should be a secure connection. In theory, it's no different than using a ring terminal/post and screw.

 

[cowfood]

I see you've made up your mind.

A battery terminal on many vehicles is just a round post (or hole) using a flexible circular connector held in place with mechanical friction. You know, kind of like how Waidea wired the negative on their product.

All that said, it's more than "twist tied", it's a solid loop around what should be a secure connection. In theory, it's no different than using a ring terminal/post and screw.

Agreed, why didn't they? trap it between two nuts? so yes.. I agree.. in that case, "something besides just a hand wrap" and I'd not have to say "DIY"

I am assuming you mean to suggest the wrap is in place around the threading of the 510 to "hold it in place" that is hopeful wishing.

The threading I'm talking about is the 510 internal threads to the body not to be confused with a 510 connection with an atty. obviously (for those reading)

-CF

 

[dwcraig1]

Agreed, why didn't they? trap it between two nuts? so yes.. I agree.. in that case, "something besides just a hand wrap" and I'd not have to say "DIY"

I am assuming you mean to suggest the wrap is in place around the threading of the 510 to "hold it in place" that is hopeful wishing.

-CF

It is tightened between two pieces that thread together, just one of them isn't quite a nut. You don't think they just wrapped it around there and hoped that it worked.
Or did they? Picture # 10 show it best, that's all I have to go on at this point but I see no problem with the way they did it as long as it can be made tight.

 

[cowfood]

It is tightened between two pieces that thread together, just one of them isn't quite a nut. You don't think they just wrapped it around there and hoped that it worked.
Or did they? Picture # 10 show it best, that's all I have to go on at this point but I see no problem with the way they did it as long as it can be made tight.

I think pics 9 and 10 pretty much show how it's held in place. actually 1, 8,9 and 10.. I can actually see what looks to be solder in pic 1 perhaps i am mistaken? perhaps they actually did try to solder that wrap to the brass nut? Or it's solder to hold the wrap together.. My guess is the later as if you are going to solder wire to a piece of metal you only need enough wire to make the connection, not a loop.

-cf

 

[Croak]

The benefit of their method is that you can simply unscrew the bottom 510 barrel, freeing up both the positive and negative leads, allowing a clean removal of the top plate. Could have achieved the same thing with a $0.02 brass ring terminal though, and had better conductivity.

 

[Phone Guy]

Well, it's above and beyond Evolv really, within the realm of TC, specs have to be tight, at least in these early adoption phases with this tech.. Perhaps new TC wire (a hybrid) will come into play.. But, back to this ground. it's a negative lead wire. ground - literally goes into the ground. positive and negative are the direction current flows in a circuit. This is a negative wire, hand wrapped around the negative portion of the 510 connector inside the mod completing the negative current flow of the circuit in this mod.. I'm sorry if I don't give praise to this practice, for example.. would you use that practice on the negative post of your cars battery? Maybe to get to the nearest gas station sure, but for every day, doubt it. Once loose, arcing can happen, poor performance, burnt insulation on wires, etc.. Bottom line, you get this device knowing it's twist tied, and have to open her up to make sure it's a "tight" enough twist to carry on without a hiccup or complete failure.. So, back to my point, it's great for those that are comfy with DIY, and ready to pull it apart in order to 1: verify and tighten the wire, 2: solder it, or 3: use hot glue to keep it in place.. or 4: hubba bubba bubble gum. or, just not worry about it, and get maybe 30% performance hit, or maybe 15% or maybe %50, and not know if it's your build or the mod, or the battery, or your etc etc....

I think you see where this is going..

-CF

I do see where that is going, you should order the genuine from any number of retailers (vaperev, vapinart, etc) assuming your in the USA. that way you'll get everything perfect (or hopefully) but you should get killer customer service, hassle free (we would assume), and you shouldn't have to deal with quality control and build quality issues those of us who are buying from China mainly for the shell to retrofit our own genuine DNA40 into.

Post some pictures of your genuine so we can compare

 

[Tpat591]

The benefit of their method is that you can simply unscrew the bottom 510 barrel, freeing up both the positive and negative leads, allowing a clean removal of the top plate. Could have achieved the same thing with a $0.02 brass ring terminal though, and had better conductivity.

You should post that for Robby.

 

[KenD]

Do you guys'/gals' Waidea flasks have preheat? Mine seems to. At least it does put out more watts than I've set it to at the start of a puff (when the atty is cold). Still loving this device (though I'd want to get rid of the "temperature protection" warning. Not very helpful at all and I'm really interested in seeing how it regulates the watts up and dish down.). Also still proud of myself for getting the Fogger dual coils working

 

[TheBloke]

Do you guys'/gals' Waidea flasks have preheat? Mine seems to. At least it does put out more watts than I've set it to at the start of a puff (when the atty is cold). Still loving this device (though I'd want to get rid of the "temperature protection" warning. Not very helpful at all and I'm really interested in seeing how it regulates the watts up and dish down.). Also still proud of myself for getting the Fogger dual coils working

I thought the point of the TP message was that it's not firing all when that flashes? 0 watts? Yours does show the varying watts when it's not showing TP, doesn't it?

I'm wondering if mine ever shows TP. I know croak said it was only when there's a large delta, and I haven't done a dry cotton test yet for example. However yesterday I was trying to use my Lemo RTA, which gets a terrible connection to my VF and the resistance was jumping, making it think the temp was jumping. So it often stopped firing, and showed 0 watts. I thought that is when it should flash TP?

In other news, I think mine is playing up again. I'm quite possibly going to need to go in and fix this f'ing ground.

First though I'm going to do a test of resistances, to confirm my suspicion that I'm seeing up to 0.08 too high resistance. still not got an ohms reader; ordered it and it got delayed - I am not having much luck with anything flask related! But I have a play to verify resistances, using specific lengths of wire checked against Steam Engine. I nearly went out and bought a multimeter, but I couldn't find one with a granularity of 10 milliohm, only 100.

Sent by fondling my slab.

 

[damped]

After seeing the pics from WW (Weird Willy) I checked the ground wire connection on mine Waidea 510 connector, it was secure but I could tighten it a little bit more.
I don't think the ground wire (if tightened enough) will produce any faults. The ground wire comes from the other compartment underneath the display and then goes from above to the other compartment where the 510 connector is fitted so there is not many space left for fitting a washer with a lip (see pic 8 from WW) the lip will make contact with the flat flexible wire from the display or press it.
So to connect to a washer (if you prefer or when fitting a FD) its better to reroute the ground wire underneath to the 510 compartment and from there you can solder it to the washer without take any risk the washer-lip can damage or press the fragile flat wire of the display.
Till now my Waidea works flawlessly apart from the fire button which sometimes needs some more pressure. A spring-loaded 510 would be very nice and when I find one I fit one
Still I think the VF from Waidea has a nice clean design with enough possibility's to make it perfect.

 

[damped]

@TheBloke
First though I'm going to do a test of resistances, to confirm my suspicion that I'm seeing up to 0.08 too high resistance

I checked the resistances from the ground wire to the outside 510 and is was 0.03 on mine DMM (UNI-T UT61E) ok not the best DMM but it gives a idea, don't think its to much.

 

[TheBloke]

@TheBloke
First though I'm going to do a test of resistances, to confirm my suspicion that I'm seeing up to 0.08 too high resistance

I checked the resistances from the ground wire to the outside 510 and is was 0.03 on mine DMM (UNI-T UT61E) ok not the best DMM but it gives a idea, don't think its to much.

OK interesting, thanks. (Sorry I don't know what DMM is?)

Right I've just done the tests on mine, and actually it seems to be not too bad.

I used 65mm of 0.5mm Kanthal A1 (24 gauge, ish.) On Steam Engine I entered resistances until I found one that came to an easy-to-measure length, 65.00mm precisely. The expected resistance of this length of wire is 0.48.

I wired that up using my Derringer RDA clone, which has an adjustable copper 510, one of the smaller decks of the RDAs I have, and has posts/screws which facilitate grabbing the wire as easily as possible, as close to the ends as possible.

The result: The Smok M80 measured 0.50, the VF measured 0.51 and 0.52, mostly 0.52. I ran the test twice on each mod, alternating.

That's one thing I've noticed a lot on the VF, the resistance will regularly fluctuate by 0.01. So I tap the fire, say New Coil, and it shows 0.51. Tap the fire, still 0.51; tap the fire, 0.52; tap the fire, 0.51; and so on. On this occasion it read 0.51 a couple of times, then 0.52 for all subsequent taps. On other attys I've seen it change literally tap-by-tap. I wonder if this is rounding errors, or is it a sign of a slightly loose internal 510 connection?

I'm assuming the 0.50 is about right, despite the expected 0.48, given there's also the path through the 510 of the mod and the 510 on the atty and the atty itself - is that fair to say? Plus my measuring won't be super precise (though it couldn't be out enough to add 0.02, which requires an extra 2.7mm of 0.5mm Kanthal.)

I tried adjusting the 510 pin, and on both the M80 and VF I tightened the atty down as hard as I dared, ultimately using pliers to make sure it was super tight, but in both cases the original resistance read did not change with further tightening (I'm glad to see.)

So for now I'm going to assume that the VF is 0.01 - 0.02 too high, which is perhaps a little higher than others have found, but not out of the ballpark.

But I still think I am going to go in there and make sure everything is tightened, especially the ground.

 

[damped]

OK interesting, thanks. (Sorry I don't know what DMM is?)

Right I've just done the tests on mine, and actually it seems to be not too bad.

I used 65mm of 0.5mm Kanthal A1 (24 gauge, ish.) On Steam Engine I entered resistances until I found one that came to an easy-to-measure length, 65.00mm precisely. The expected resistance of this length of wire is 0.48.

I wired that up using my Derringer RDA clone, which has an adjustable copper 510, one of the smaller decks of the RDAs I have, and has posts/screws which facilitate grabbing the wire as easily as possible, as close to the ends as possible.

The result: The Smok M80 measured 0.50, the VF measured 0.51 and 0.52, mostly 0.52. I ran the test twice on each mod, alternating.

That's one thing I've noticed a lot on the VF, the resistance will regularly fluctuate by 0.01. So I tap the fire, say New Coil, and it shows 0.51. Tap the fire, still 0.51; tap the fire, 0.52; tap the fire, 0.51; and so on. On this occasion it read 0.51 a couple of times, then 0.52 for all subsequent taps. On other attys I've seen it change literally tap-by-tap. I wonder if this is rounding errors, or is it a sign of a slightly loose internal 510 connection?

I'm assuming the 0.50 is about right, despite the expected 0.48, given there's also the path through the 510 of the mod and the 510 on the atty and the atty itself - is that fair to say? Plus my measuring won't be super precise (though it couldn't be out enough to add 0.02, which requires an extra 2.7mm of 0.5mm Kanthal.)

I tried adjusting the 510 pin, and on both the M80 and VF I tightened the atty down as hard as I dared, ultimately using pliers to make sure it was super tight, but in both cases the original resistance read did not change with further tightening (I'm glad to see.)

So for now I'm going to assume that the VF is 0.01 - 0.02 too high, which is perhaps a little higher than others have found, but not out of the ballpark.

But I still think I am going to go in there and make sure everything is tightened, especially the ground.

Ah sorry DMM stands for a DigitaI Multimeter, don't know about using Kanthal and TC mode but I think it's better to use ni200 or Ti wire for TC mode so I can't say anything about using Kanthal with TC mode and don't advice you to use kanthal in TC mode anyway. I have used a ni200 0.32 diameter 0.160 coil for 1 week and it never changed value I'm now using the second new 0.160 coil without any issue, the FV regornize it as the same coil.
The ohm testing I did was without any atty on it just from the ground wire inside to the - of the 510 connection outside, so ofc any atty have it's effect on this measurement which I did not include in the test. And yes the measurement between mods,atty's can vary be variably.

BTW sorry for my english, sometimes its hard to explain technical information.