Vapor Flask V3 DNA40 Clone thread

[TheBloke]

Yeah, for a 420F target temperature, if the low resistance really is -0.04 you would want NP100 (actually NP102 for a 0.11 coil reading as 0.07).

However only some of that drop is actually 'too low' - because there will be some static resistance in your atty.

So for example if the atty reads 0.11 on other mods, and 0.07 on the SXK, 0.09 is more likely to be a good figure - assuming about 0.02 in the atty itself. That gives an NP figure of 94.

That's still way higher than I used it for Ni200 though, and that others are using with Ni200. I have very little Ni200 experience so far because I moved to Titanium, Stainless Steel and Resistherm almost immediately. I'm just double checking the calculator

More experimentation is needed with Ni200, and to figure out what the exact resistance drop is (taking into account the atty itself.) But there should be an NP value that counteracts most low resistance readings and TC vapes right

 

[dwcraig1]

Actually sorry NP100 might be what you want after all for a -0.04 drop with Ni200. Just checking now.

I came up with 95 using your calculator (.05 drop)

 

[Unior]

Well I just got my 60 watt FT SXK flask, after 4 hits I'm already thinking about changing the board.
Resistance is .05 lower than actual and I'm getting "temp protect" almost immediately.
I took this TGT II off an Evolv powered mod the will but didn't give me "temp protected" ever with this atty.
I got the "new/old" atty question upon firing atty first time.
I came in a nice box.
Not too happy
Here's what I'm running for a coil, 28 gauge annealed ni, 11.5 wraps, 2.5 mm id, 0.12Ω @ 28 watts/450 F


Oh wait, I see the SXK is set to 300 F, just got up, hardly any coffee drank yet....DUH
OK, set to 450 F, vapes much better but still hitting TP

Well I just got my 60 watt FT SXK flask, after 4 hits I'm already thinking about changing the board.
Resistance is .05 lower than actual and I'm getting "temp protect" almost immediately.
I took this TGT II off an Evolv powered mod the will but didn't give me "temp protected" ever with this atty.
I got the "new/old" atty question upon firing atty first time.
I came in a nice box.
Not too happy
Here's what I'm running for a coil, 28 gauge annealed ni, 11.5 wraps, 2.5 mm id, 0.12Ω @ 28 watts/450 F


Oh wait, I see the SXK is set to 300 F, just got up, hardly any coffee drank yet....DUH
OK, set to 450 F, vapes much better but still hitting TP

That's what mine has been doing since I got it. Reading 0.04 low and hitting temp. protect almost immediately. But since this is my first temp protect & I don't know .... about it, I assumed this was normal. Well actually I thought it might be the Kanger ni occ I'm using. my nickel wire isn't here yet but I am about to try NP.

 

[TheBloke]

I came up with 95 using your calulator

OK cool. Try that out, hopefully it'll both be a good vape and prevent dry hits.

It's really frustrating this problem - the chip itself is superb, it has a feature found only in this ~$50 mod chip, and $300+ Dicodes mods. But it's been really hampered by this stupid low resistance. I don't get why it has this problem. We really thought it might be fixed int he 'batch 2' with New Atomizer question because one guy with an rDNA 40 is seeing resistances read correctly. But everyone else is not, and you're seeing the same sort of high-ohm delta that we measured on the batch 1.

The higher the ohms of the wire, the more it reads too low. However that also means it has less effect on the TC - so using Ttianium and Stainless Steel and Resistherm, where coils are in the 0.30-0.60 range usually require less severe NP adjustments than the +32 you're needing with Ni200 (NP62 is the actual correct value for Ni200 - they defaulted to 70 to try and counteract the low resistance read I believe.)

 

[TheBloke]

That's what mine has been doing since I got it. Reading 0.04 low and hitting temp. protect almost immediately. But since this is my first temp protect & I don't know **** about it, I assumed this was normal. Well actually I thought it might be the Kanger ni occ I'm using. my nickel wire isn't here yet but I am about to try NP.

There's definitely a significant problem with low resistance reading on this chip. Thankfully it can be counteracted with NP. But all bets are off with OCC Ni200 coils - they're notoriously flaky, and so could cloud your findings.

That said, @TheotherSteveS is using them with a temp setting of 460°F and a NP of 76 I think (check the Beyond Ni200 thread for exact details, last page or two). So they can work.

But you'd be best off doing proper testing once you can make your own coils tomorrow.

What other mods do you have? Do you have any others with two-decimal-place resistance displays? That would be useful to check how low the resistance is reading. Failing that, just using Steam Engine to see waht the resistance should be for a given coil, or just estimating it can work. It's generally going to be about 0.04Ω on any Ni200 coil, though it has been measured (on a v1 batch) as up to 0.06Ω at the 0.20Ω level.

 

[dwcraig1]

So now I understand why the specs say it fires down as low as 0.06Ω. (SXK ohms)
Slowly becoming more happier with it now.

 

[TheBloke]

So now I understand why the specs say it fires down as low as 0.06Ω. (SXK ohms)
Slowly becoming more happier with it now.

Yeah

I have wondered if half the good features (low minimum Ω, NP) were put in to counteract the low resistance I'm going to assume that's just the way it, luckily, worked out

I've emailed SXK to inform them of the findings, including some detailed resistance comparisons done by @balazsk against a high quality micro-ohm reader. Maybe they'll fix it in v3.

In the meantime it remains a good TC mod, just more work than one would expect. And for those wanting to use Titanium, Resistherm NiFe30 and, in particular, Stainless Steel it's a superb mod - particularly for SS because it can't be used for TC at all without NP (or Dicodes' equivalent in their $200-$300 mods.)

I've vaped a lot of SS in the last days and I really like it as a TC wire, so strong and easy to use and although it's right at the lowest end of the TC capabilities for these mods (Dicodes quote it as accurate to nearest 30°C / 86°F, compared to 5°C / 41°F for Ni200) it can still provide a very decent, and repeatable TC vape once the right settings are found.

That said I still splashed out six SXK-Flasks worth of cash for a Dicodes 2380 today Very nearly more than I've spent on all my other mods combined (I just worked that out and now I'm scared.) But I want it as a master reference point for accurate TC - and I may well sell it if/when SXK or another manufacturer come out with a TCR-adjusting mod that's got accurate resistance readings. Yeah yeah I'm trying to convince myself! And of course this means I will drop it on day 1...

But I'm still going to get a second SXK flask as well - just I was hoping resistance might already be fixed and now it seems unlikely. Probably still get it when @Quantum Mech receives his shipment from SXK.

 

[TheBloke]

Oh and here's a Chinese vendor for the 40W SXK flask for anyone sure they won't ever need more than 40W. Which to be fair I almost never exceed - I did 45W briefly earlier today to act as a pre-heat on a TC vape that would settle back to 25W quickly. But not for long, I toned it down to 35W after a bit.

Vapor Flask V3 DNA40 Temperature Control 40W VW Mod

$51 for the mod, $6 for worldwide (economy) shipping, $57 total.

About the same as FT had it for - as long as you don't mind slow postage. Other methods cost a lot more. EMS is $21 to the UK, $5 more than for DHL. For the US it's more, $17 and $25 for DHL and EMS respectively.

FT/3F/Focal really do have an incredible deal with EMS. I wonder if it's some kind of government thing to encourage exports. Or maybe it's just vast volumes

 

[dwcraig1]

I suppose if you push all the buttons the right way it works just fine.

 

[dwcraig1]

And now to say what I do really like about my SXK Flask (probably been said before but here goes)
It has little to no delay on firing.
5 click lock stays locked.
I'm actually a bit amazed that this flask has these little problems considering who made it.
Perhaps that is why FT gave up the ship so quickly with the threat of legalities.

 

[AtmizrOpin]

Sorry in advance if this was asked and answered before, but does the SXK flask have any type of preheat? Also does it race you up to your max temp setting, hit "temp protection", then severely cut your wattage like the Rayn V 3,4?

 

[dwcraig1]

Sorry in advance if this was asked and answered before, but does the SXK flask have any type of preheat? Also does it race you up to your max temp setting, hit "temp protection", then severely cut your wattage like the Rayn V 3,4?

I'm only guessing but think there is no preheat. Mine pretty much acts like the Rayn board but mine stays within a couple of watts of the set watts. (providing the TP message doesn't get in the way)
450F is my setting.

 

[Unior]

I'm only guessing but think there is no preheat. Mine pretty much acts like the Rayn board but mine stays within a couple of watts of the set watts. (providing the TP message doesn't get in the way)
450F is my setting.

Mine stays close to set watts as well. My computer is screwed up right now so I am either on my iPhone or iPad & cant download calculator right now BUT my 0.15 OCCs read 0.4 to 0.5 low. I cranked NP to 95 at 450f and everything seems fine.

 

[Tpat591]

Oh and here's a Chinese vendor for the 40W SXK flask for anyone sure they won't ever need more than 40W. Which to be fair I almost never exceed - I did 45W briefly earlier today to act as a pre-heat on a TC vape that would settle back to 25W quickly. But not for long, I toned it down to 35W after a bit.

Vapor Flask V3 DNA40 Temperature Control 40W VW Mod

$51 for the mod, $6 for worldwide (economy) shipping, $57 total.

About the same as FT had it for - as long as you don't mind slow postage. Other methods cost a lot more. EMS is $21 to the UK, $5 more than for DHL. For the US it's more, $17 and $25 for DHL and EMS respectively.

FT/3F/Focal really do have an incredible deal with EMS. I wonder if it's some kind of government thing to encourage exports. Or maybe it's just vast volumes

Excellent find! I'm sure you spoke to them & asked about higher wattages. What did they say?

 

[AtmizrOpin]

So in reality the SXK chip can handle down to .1 ohms not .04 ohms as advertised? Does it soft limit like the DNA? I'm asking all this to figure out if there is anything special about this chip besides the added wattage. I do like the ni purity setting.

 

[dwcraig1]

I got some strange behavior out of mine just now. I had a 0.3Ω dual coil dripper that was on my Sigelei 100 running at 60 watts. I put it on the SXK flask, turned off temp, set it to 60 watts and it only fires 12 watts. So I turn it down to 50 watts and it throws out the "low battery" message. These batteries are not low.
Oh, it reads o.29Ω on the flask.
OK I have the answer to what's happening.
They are using only the ground on the 510 for battery negative just like Waidea.
I started removing the screws on the top plate and only loosened two before the power to the board cut out.

 

[Phone Guy]

Oh and here's a Chinese vendor for the 40W SXK flask for anyone sure they won't ever need more than 40W. Which to be fair I almost never exceed - I did 45W briefly earlier today to act as a pre-heat on a TC vape that would settle back to 25W quickly. But not for long, I toned it down to 35W after a bit.

Vapor Flask V3 DNA40 Temperature Control 40W VW Mod

$51 for the mod, $6 for worldwide (economy) shipping, $57 total.

About the same as FT had it for - as long as you don't mind slow postage. Other methods cost a lot more. EMS is $21 to the UK, $5 more than for DHL. For the US it's more, $17 and $25 for DHL and EMS respectively.

FT/3F/Focal really do have an incredible deal with EMS. I wonder if it's some kind of government thing to encourage exports. Or maybe it's just vast volumes

That looks exactly like the first flask I got with the paint or coating on it. Same box, logo on box, font everything. I Can't speak about the board inside, as I never used it (it was kindly and graciously sold to me broken for retrofit purposes).

I'll say this... And it's only my opinion. I think the waidea from focal has a superior feel and finish for about $10 usd more, and that is only my personal opinion. Ymmv.

 

[TheBloke]

I got some strange behavior out of mine just now. I had a 0.3Ω dual coil dripper that was on my Sigelei 100 running at 60 watts. I put it on the SXK flask, turned off temp, set it to 60 watts and it only fires 12 watts. So I turn it down to 50 watts and it throws out the "low battery" message. These batteries are not low.
Oh, it reads o.29Ω on the flask.

Oh sorry to hear that, that is definitely not right and I've not seen that. Of course mine can't do 60W but I've done 50W in small bursts, and 45W for longer.

I'm sure not, but no chance you dislodged anything taking the top off? I will do a 50W non-TC vape in a minute just to be sure.

 

[TheBloke]

Excellent find! I'm sure you spoke to them & asked about higher wattages. What did they say?

I hadn't, but as live chat was on:

Tom
Will you soon stock 50W and 60W SXK Vapor Flask? At the moment you have only 40W but SXK makes 50 and 60W as well (with Nickel Purity). Thanks

CS
hi, if you need the 50w or 60w, we also can stock for you
so you need the 50 or 60W Vapor Flask? and how many you may need?

Tom
I am just checking to see if possible, I am not ready to order right now. So if I ask for 60W flask you can get in? How long would that take?

CS
1-3days. if you need.

Tom
Thank you. I know some people maybe looking for 50-60W flask. Price is same, $51? or more?

CS
may more $3-4.

Tom
OK understood. Thank you​

 

[dwcraig1]

Oh sorry to hear that, that is definitely not right and I've not seen that. Of course mine can't do 60W but I've done 50W in small bursts, and 45W for longer.

I'm sure not, but no chance you dislodged anything taking the top off? I will do a 50W non-TC vape in a minute just to be sure.

I did remove to top plate but it was put on securly.
I pulled it back off and lightly sanded the top of the box and the top plates underside. Also cleaned up the beveled part of the screw holes.
All is golden now, vaping at 60 watts (for the moment)
(sound familiar???)

There was something else, on the bottom of the top plate there's two thin strips of black tape to keep the screen tight, one was extra long maybe even keeping the top plate from grounding on that side so I trimmed about 5 mm from the fire button end of it.