What are the best batteries to put in my Aegis Geekvape?

[TrollDragon]

Perhaps I should be more clear the highest drain batteries can’t SAFELY handle more than a 30amp drain. It doesn’t mean they won’t DO it. It just means it’s not safe. You could throw 10amp off brand garbage in there and hit 200w. For a little while anyway. You’d have hot damaged batteries of course. You might even vent one.

I see what you were getting at now.

 

[greek mule]

Aegis Legend has 9V max voltage output and 50A current output limit.

To achieve 200 watt:
A) Resistance must be not higher than 0.405 Ω due to voltage limit.
R=V²/P=>9²/200 watt=0.405Ω

B) Resistance must be not lower than 0.08Ω due to current limit.(Aegis legend can fire down to 0.05Ω in power and bypass mode)
R=P/I²=>200/50²=0.08Ω

R=resistance required to achieve max wattage.
V=max voltage output of device (9V)
P=max wattage of device (200 watt)
I=max current limit of device (50A)

You can vape at 200W with fresh batteries but after a few puffs the voltage sag will force the device to display "weak battery" and limit power output.

 

[the wind]

Well that’s 5 minutes and 22 seconds of my life I’ll never get back. I’d call that a rickroll

you now know what it takes to be a professional vaper now.

 

[bombastinator]

you now know what it takes to be a professional vaper now.

Or more accurately a salesman for a vape making company.

 

[DaveP]

DaveP, puffing along at 11.5W in TC mode and enjoying the banter! I can vape all day on a Sony VTC6 (then change it to make it to bedtime).

 

[TrollDragon]

you now know what it takes to be a professional vaper now.

Victor was pure internet gold back in the day.

Perfeshinal Vaperers Only!

 

[the wind]

DaveP, puffing along at 11.5W in TC mode and enjoying the banter!

I'm at 20watts today and caused the banter.

 

[Baditude]

What are you on about?
Daniel's charts show the Legend easily hitting 200W+ across a wide range of resistance.

With regulated mods, coil resistance is irrelevant as long as the resistance is within the chips capability to fire.

Daniel's osceloscope charts in the video are probably using current pulses (pulse discharges). Regarless, if you look closely at the chart, the calculated wattage setting (green bar) is different from the real wattage output (blue bar). 144.2 watts with fully charged batteries and 139.5 watts with low batteries at the 200 watt setting.

Daniel appears to be using VTC5A batteries (25A up to 75 watts each battery), so using two should theoretically allow up to 150 watts minus wattage loss due to chip set inefficiency. So 144 watts using two VTC5A batteries is to be expected.

 

[Punk In Drublic]

As @TrollDragon mentioned, the Legend is able to meet its wattage ceiling of 200 watts through much of its resistance range up to 1.015 ohms. The reason why it cannot hit 200 watts with this resistance (or higher), is due to the voltage output limitations of the regulator board. 200 watts with a 1 ohm coil requires an output of 14.4 volts, the Legend’s spec is 10 volts - but as measured it is able to exceed this up to 12 volts (still shy of what is required for a 1+ ohm coil)

The 25 CDR spec of the VTC5A is just a safety limit that we should follow in order to mitigate risk. The cell is able to exceed the 25 amp current draw but ends up running hotter, thus increasing risk. Mooch’s graphs for this cell displays he took measurements of up to 35 amps and depleting the cell down to roughly 2.8 volts. Given he has a separate Pulse graph (where he pulsed up to a 70 amp draw), I will assume he performed a 35 amp continuous discharge on these cells.

The reason we usually see a device scale back power with low cells is due to the minimum required voltage the regulator needs to run efficiently at that prescribed wattage. Taking voltage sag from the cell into account, at higher wattages we may exceed the devices low voltage limitation – the device will attempt to continue firing but at a lower wattage.

Scroll through DJLsb’s measurements and you will find some devices meeting their max wattage with low cells – of course assuming the coil resistance is still within the devices max voltage output

 

[TrollDragon]

With regulated mods, coil resistance is irrelevant as long as the resistance is within the chips capability to fire.

Daniel's osceloscope charts in the video are probably using current pulses (pulse discharges). Regarless, if you look closely at the chart, the calculated wattage setting (green bar) is different from the real wattage output (blue bar). 144.2 watts with fully charged batteries and 139.5 watts with low batteries at the 200 watt setting.

Daniel appears to be using VTC5A batteries (25A up to 75 watts each battery), so using two should theoretically allow up to 150 watts minus wattage loss due to chip set inefficiency. So 144 watts using two VTC5A batteries is to be expected.

Sorry but I must be missing something here, the 144.2W reading is for a 1.04 ohm coil, the mod has no trouble hitting the 200W mark with everything under that value.

 

[Punk In Drublic]

To add, In wattage mode the Legend has one of the best boards I have seen DJLsb measure (apart from DNA’s). Well done GV

 

[Baditude]

Sorry but I must be missing something here, the 144.2W reading is for a 1.04 ohm coil, the mod has no trouble hitting the 200W mark with everything under that value.

View attachment 832103

Coil resistance is irrelevant in a regulated mod, so specifying the resistance shouldn't matter in these tests.

The green bars are the calculated wattage, or the wattage the mod is set to.
The blue bars are the real measured wattage, which are all over the place, especially with a low battery.

@Punk In Drublic , am I wrong? Am I the one missing something?

 

[Punk In Drublic]

Coil resistance is irrelevant in a regulated mod, so specifying the resistance shouldn't matter in these tests.

The green bars are the calculated wattage, or the wattage the mod is set to.
The blue bars are the real measured wattage, which are all over the place, especially with a low battery.

@Punk In Drublic , am I wrong? Am I the one missing something?

@Baditude – you are both correct and incorrect (sorry to say). Coil resistance within a regulated device is irrelevant based on current draw from the batteries. BUT!!! That coil resistance still has to fall within the regulator chip’s output limitations for a prescribed wattage. Every board has its limitations in what it is able to output in terms of max wattage, max voltage and max current. Max wattage can not be met if a coils resistance dictates a voltage or current that exceeds the boards limitations. High resistance at high wattage requires high voltage. Low resistance at high wattage requires high current

I will use a DNA250C because Evolve is kind enough to give us the specifications for these boards (not all manufactures do)

A DNA 250C has a max voltage output of 10 volts. Using V = √PxR, we can see that this limit will be reached with a 0.5 ohm coil at 200 watts. Any resistance above 0.5 ohms, and the device will not be able to output 200 watts. This does not matter if the device is configured with 3 or 4 cells, which would be more than enough to meet 200 watts. It is a voltage output limitation of the board.

 

[TrollDragon]

Coil resistance is irrelevant in a regulated mod, so specifying the resistance shouldn't matter in these tests.

The green bars are the calculated wattage, or the wattage the mod is set to.
The blue bars are the real measured wattage, which are all over the place, especially with a low battery.

@Punk In Drublic , am I wrong? Am I the one missing something?

Depending on the chip set in the mod some will only hit their advertised wattage at very specific resistance, they won't provide the advertised power across a wide range like the Legend will.

Take the Smok T-Priv for example, you only get the full 220W output with a ~0.12 ohm load.

 

[Baditude]

That chart for the SMOK is sad. All the more reason to avoid SMOK.

 

[Punk In Drublic]

Not defending Smok but that chart is actually not that bad. 110 watts is very accurate which can not be said for many other devices

 

[Baditude]

@Punk In Drublic , that chart that I stole from Mooch that shows what battery to use up to a desired wattage setting, is it not valid?

Daniel was using Sony VTC5A batteries, which are 25 amp batteries good for up to 75 watts each according to Mooch's chart. Using two should allow up to 150 watts. How can the Legend make 200 watts output with those batteries?

Learn something new every day.

WATTAGE PER SINGLE BATTERY on REGULATED MOD:
(Total wattage doubles using 2 batteries; Triples using 3 batteries.)

Up to 45W:

Samsung 18650 30Q, 3000 mah 15 amp CDR

Sony 18650VTC6 3000mAh 15 amp CDR

​

Up to 60W:

LG 18650HG2 3000mah 20 amp CDR

LG 18650HE4 2500 mah 20 amp CDR

.
Samsung 18650-25R, 2500 mah 20 amp CDR

.
Sanyo UR18650NSX, 2500 mah 20 amp CDR

.
Sony 18650VTC5, 2600 mah 20 amp CDR

.
Sony 18650VTC4, 2100 mah 23 amp CDR

​

Up to 75W:

LG 18650 HD4 2100 mah 25 amp CDR

LG 18650 HD2 2000 mah 25 amp CDR

Samsung 18650-24S, 2500 mah 25 amp CDR

Sony 18650VTC5A, 2500 mah 25 amp CDR

Molicel 18650-P26A, 2600 mah 25 amp CDR

​

Up to 90W:

LG18650HB6 1500mah 30 amp CDR

LG18650HB2 1500mAh 30 amp CDR

LG18650HB4 1500mAh 30 amp CDR

Samsung 18650-20S 2000mah 30 amp CDR

 

[Punk In Drublic]

@Punk In Drublic , that chart that I stole from Mooch that shows what battery to use up to a desired wattage setting, is it not valid?

Daniel was using Sony VTC5A batteries, which are 25 amp batteries good for up to 75 watts each according to Mooch's chart. Using two should allow up to 150 watts. How can the Legend make 200 watts output with those batteries?

Learn something new every day.

WATTAGE PER SINGLE BATTERY on REGULATED MOD:
(Total wattage doubles using 2 batteries; Triples using 3 batteries.)

Up to 45W:

Samsung 18650 30Q, 3000 mah 15 amp CDR

Sony 18650VTC6 3000mAh 15 amp CDR

​

Up to 60W:

LG 18650HG2 3000mah 20 amp CDR

LG 18650HE4 2500 mah 20 amp CDR

.
Samsung 18650-25R, 2500 mah 20 amp CDR

.
Sanyo UR18650NSX, 2500 mah 20 amp CDR

.
Sony 18650VTC5, 2600 mah 20 amp CDR

.
Sony 18650VTC4, 2100 mah 23 amp CDR

​

Up to 75W:

LG 18650 HD4 2100 mah 25 amp CDR

LG 18650 HD2 2000 mah 25 amp CDR

Samsung 18650-24S, 2500 mah 25 amp CDR

Sony 18650VTC5A, 2500 mah 25 amp CDR

Molicel 18650-P26A, 2600 mah 25 amp CDR

​

Up to 90W:

LG18650HB6 1500mah 30 amp CDR

LG18650HB2 1500mAh 30 amp CDR

LG18650HB4 1500mAh 30 amp CDR

Samsung 18650-20S 2000mah 30 amp CDR

The chart is a recommendation and perfectly valid. We need to set a safe limit for these cells, for exceeding that limit means we run a higher risk. Every battery can exceed their recommended CDR, but in doing so the batteries run hotter thus runs a higher risk.

Mooch’s measurements for the VTC5A shows a 25 amp draw had a temperature of 83°C, but the 30 amp draw reached 92°C – he feels the latter is too hot so he gave this cell a 25 amp CDR rating. (35 amps reached 105°C)

75 watts for a 25 amp cell is just setting a safe operating ceiling. The cell can produce enough current to reach 80 watts, or perhaps even 100 watts, but we are now running a higher risk.

 

[greek mule]

@Punk In Drublic , am I wrong? Am I the one missing something?

You can give a look at my post #22 above.

 

[greek mule]

How can the Legend make 200 watts output with those batteries?

The device doesn't care if you have 2 batteries with 10A cdr each.It will fire the 200W.