I am new to vaping. I have been seeing a lot of concern about potential regulation from the FDA. Exactly what is it that the FDA is looking to do with respect to ecigs and vaping? Is the FDA trying to ban Ecigs and vaping, or is it more about being able to charge more taxes and control the manufacturing of ecig products and juice? I am really liking the idea of vaping and I love even more the fact that I do not smoke regular cigs anymore. I don't even miss them. Thanks Stu
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The fda as a regulatory body does not cover taxation. That is the role of government. The FDA's motive is to do what's in the best interest of the FDA. At one point in time they applied their mission against tobacco towards e cigarettes and attempted to ban them and that failed. Another attempt would be highly distasteful and unsuccessful.
The fda has recently been pressured by government to extend its reach of regulation into e cigarettes and that is it's goal. Naturally this leads to the application of its current regulation over cigarettes towards e cigarettes. This is what's called deeming regulations.
The problem with deeming regulations being applied towards e cigarettes is that this would in effect ban the devices again and would appear rebellious towards our federal court ruling. Because they cannot ban the devices or appear distasteful they must adapt them to e cigarettes in a way that expresses the spirit of the regulations which they applied to cigarettes.
A problem with that line of thought is that the two products are so drastically different and as the fda figures that out it will require more time.
You could say they intend to create federal restrictions against the sale to minors and ban flavorings. Ironically, they don't truly have the ability to do anything which the vaping community rejects as these devices can be sold in pieces, rebranded, flavoring are as easily obtained and applied by yourself.
I think the only thing they can do is what the vaping consumer allows. That's higher manufacturing and safety standards and a list of flavors unfit to inhale.
The fda has recently been pressured by government to extend its reach of regulation into e cigarettes and that is it's goal. Naturally this leads to the application of its current regulation over cigarettes towards e cigarettes. This is what's called deeming regulations.
The problem with deeming regulations being applied towards e cigarettes is that this would in effect ban the devices again and would appear rebellious towards our federal court ruling. Because they cannot ban the devices or appear distasteful they must adapt them to e cigarettes in a way that expresses the spirit of the regulations which they applied to cigarettes.
A problem with that line of thought is that the two products are so drastically different and as the fda figures that out it will require more time.
You could say they intend to create federal restrictions against the sale to minors and ban flavorings. Ironically, they don't truly have the ability to do anything which the vaping community rejects as these devices can be sold in pieces, rebranded, flavoring are as easily obtained and applied by yourself.
I think the only thing they can do is what the vaping consumer allows. That's higher manufacturing and safety standards and a list of flavors unfit to inhale.
It looks to me like the FDA is dragging their heels. That is what the FDA is doing now, or making a mountain out of a molehill.
Also consider this. Allot of vapers are stocking up and making plans just in case. I think that's wise. My vaporizers are rebuildable and I'll be making my own wicks. I've also got a box with about 15-20 ounces of eliquid in it. I could easily stock up a two year supply if they make a bad move and that's plenty of time to let the courts defend our rights.
I really hope they don't ban flavorings and its not because I'll miss my chocolate. I can order food grade organic flavor concentrate from the exact place my manufacturer uses and drip that into unflavored bottles. What we need is for the fda to push for the research into flavorings that are regarded as safe to inhale. Right now the consumer is regulating the industry with dollars and that's just not good enough.
Yep stocking up just in case, presently have 3-4 year of gear supplies, and growing. Also have 2 years of liquid supplies and growing, next is DIY supplies. Please don't turn me in, hey leave my Vamo alone, no not the billy club...... Whats water boarding? Oops seems I got off tracked. Oh well time to Vape On! lol.
The only thing I see them truly being able to ban/regulate is the nicotine liquid. Perhaps making it so that only certain "certified' companies/labs are able to distribute it at certain nicotine levels. I see it almost impossible to ban devices since they could be re-branded and be made at home by experienced people. Therefore, the thing to stock up on would be nicotine liquid and plan on DIY. I mean, you can't ban a tank.
I could see them publishing a list of "Generally regarded as safe" flavorings and ingredients, but for the most part this is already done. The ingredients in most e-liquids is simply nicotine, PG and/ or VG, and already approved food flavorings. As to if it is considered "safe" to inhale the flavorings or not may be difficult to prove or disprove but I can almost guarantee you that it is less harmful than the actual air in most major cities not to mention all the stuff you inhale when smoking an analog. If they make a move to ban specific flavors, people will buy their flavorings at local food stores and DIY anyway so that would be pointless. They can't ban PG or VG do to the many other uses. As others have mentioned they can't ban the hardware, because that too can be easily fabricated at home out of nearly anything from wood blocks, to coke cans, etc. They can't ban batteries, they can't ban wire, they can't ban yarn or other wicking materials. They can't ban metal/plastic tubes or plastic bottles either.
So what does that leave? The nicotine itself. This is all that they could possibly regulate. They could potentially regulate the purity, and the concentration of it but that is about it really. If they do manage to somehow over-regulate this, it is still LEGAL to grow your own tobacco and really DIY.
EDIT: The FDA has probably come to this same conclusion which is why they haven't done anything and are now just hoping people forget they ever said they would do something.
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Got 2 years of 100mg nic in the freezer multiple mods rebuildable atamizors and tanks and 4 dna20d boards. My stockpile will continue to grow untill they make a decision but I will not be doing without no matter what it is.
Join CASAA. It's free and your voice can be added to fight for vapers rights. The FDA can get rid of the liquid refills if they so desire.
CASAA - The Consumer Advocates for Smoke-free Alternatives Association
This next link will tell more about what's going on.
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-understand-your-right-vape-under-threat.html
Be informed, we have a fight on our hands to keep vaping a viable alternative to smoking.
CASAA - The Consumer Advocates for Smoke-free Alternatives Association
This next link will tell more about what's going on.
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-understand-your-right-vape-under-threat.html
Be informed, we have a fight on our hands to keep vaping a viable alternative to smoking.
The FDA tried 6 times in 2009 to totally ban vaping in the US. They almost succeeded. Many suppliers and consumers vaping orders/supplies were confiscated and hundreds of thousands of dollars were lost. They are now trying a different tactic that could come close to a ban. You should read this thread to educate yourself. And if vaping is important to you, I suggest you join and support CASAA as they are the only group fighting for us to keep are right to vape:
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-understand-your-right-vape-under-threat.html
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-understand-your-right-vape-under-threat.html
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I have to disagree with you here. They could easily make it impossible for your average consumer to obtain nicotine for DIY. And after what I read is required chemically to extract nicotine from tobacco leaves, very few would go this route.
They only employed a tiny percentage of their power back in 2009 when they were confiscating suppliers and consumers mail orders of vaping supplies. If they really let the hammer drop, you have no idea how quickly they could stop us from vaping as we do now.
Our best hope is that we can delay any action until there is a new administration and we have one similar to the previous administration. This is what many of the experts believe might save the day.
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I really do not see it getting banned though. Controlled maybe. Really though it is time people realized that banning things does not work. Think about how many thinks are illegal to buy, sell, or have in your possession yet they are still sold in every city, in every state, 365 days a year. Considering lots of people in law enforcement also vape, this would be one ban that would probably be a bit tough to get enforced.
I do agree 100% about this current administration though. Maybe we can get him to play enough golf and take enough vacations that nothing else gets done.
They dont have to outright ban it. Make it illegal to produce procure or store E liquid over 4mg/ml and you have a defacto ban on anything that would help people.
IMHO with the dollars of BT, being put into government coffers, we well not be able to legally acquire our beloved liquids as we do now. But be forced to buy off the shelf disposables, I could be way off here and hope that I am. I also believe there's a slight possibility that we may be able to acquire certain nic amounts in the form of government controlled strengths from a medical program as in the way certain drug cessation are dispensed now, again I'm hoping I'm wrong.
Just note that I've been wrong about many many things in my life, and that ain't going to stop any time soon.
I use to being wrong on matters of opinion, since opinions are just that, and not usually based are hard core fact.
Pleas let me be wrong yet again, lol.
Please join CASAA and help to fight for our right of Freedom.
Just note that I've been wrong about many many things in my life, and that ain't going to stop any time soon.
I use to being wrong on matters of opinion, since opinions are just that, and not usually based are hard core fact.
Pleas let me be wrong yet again, lol.
Please join CASAA and help to fight for our right of Freedom.
If you want to know and understand exactly what the FDA is trying to then read this...
The FDA & Deeming Regulations of E-cigarettes
The FDA & Deeming Regulations of E-cigarettes
I'm pretty sure there's a way to refine the nicotine in any liquid to increase its potency. In cooking, its called reducing. You just boil off the water and the flavor becomes more potent. I'm not saying that you can reduce in this way for e liquid but there will be a way. Heck. It if there is any difference in weight between the nicotine and what it is suspended in then it reduces itself when its not being shaken.
In my opinion, it seems clear what the FDA is trying to do...
Their number one goal is to eliminate electronic cigarettes.
If that goal can not be accomplished then their next goal would be to regulate them to the point of being useless.
If that goal can not be accomplished then their next goal would probably be to deliver them to Big Tobacco on a silver platter.
But of those goals, what WILL they be able to accomplish?
Only what WE let them accomplish.
I hope the vast majority of vapers are not willing to give up without a fight.
Because a fight is most likely what it is going to take in order to avoid getting screwed.
Their number one goal is to eliminate electronic cigarettes.
If that goal can not be accomplished then their next goal would be to regulate them to the point of being useless.
If that goal can not be accomplished then their next goal would probably be to deliver them to Big Tobacco on a silver platter.
But of those goals, what WILL they be able to accomplish?
Only what WE let them accomplish.
I hope the vast majority of vapers are not willing to give up without a fight.
Because a fight is most likely what it is going to take in order to avoid getting screwed.
Most vapers do not want to break the law in order to vape. I don't see a black market being a solution. If you had been vaping back in 2009, I have a strong idea you would be more concerned now.
The bottom line is, whether they try to ban it or restrict it, we as vapers will be hurt in the process. The only solution is for us to organize and fight for the right to vape at every level of the government. I hope you are a supporting member of CASAA. And since I would be surprised if you are not, we all need to put the CASAA banner on our posts so that we can bring awareness to all new members of ECF. We need to be stronger (through numbers and financially) or all of this "talking" will just be hot air.
Our betters in Washington have little to no concern about our health. This about putting a huge tax on what we do so that they can spend that money on more give-aways to other people. They had no concern about requiring carpet glue be put on each cigarette for safe burning. We are a small minority and can be hit about the head and shoulders all they want. How much research are they putting on all those little bottles in health food stores? Why is there no huge tax increase on alcohol since drunk driving causes much death and damage? Why isn't that good for the children too? Simply because the drinking crowd is much larger than us.
OK I fill better now.
OK I fill better now.
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