What's the deal with just a simple, single flavor? HELP!!

[DoctorJ]

I just started DIY'ing a few months ago and having very little success. Just making a single flavored juice doesn't seem to come right. I've made one single flavor that is great using Capella's Cinnamon Danish Swirl. I got lucky when on a whim I mixed up a bunch of chocolate flavors and created a decent chocolate vape (see the chocolate thread for "Dr.J's Chocolate Adventure).

I'm just trying to make some simple, single flavored juice. I've tried making coconut, vanilla custard and white chocolate. NONE have turned out with the expected flavor. I've been all over ECF and the web trying to find simple recipes and had little success. Most just say to add this percentage of flavoring and PG/VG, steep and VIOLA! Well I'm finding out quickly that it's not that simple.

It seems that most recipes are multi-flavored concoctions that I'm obviously not ready for. I'm not looking to make anything fancy like "Apple pie ala mode with a cherry on top" juice or anything like that. I have noticed that all these different additives are needed for even the simplest of juices: butter, sweetener, EM, etc... Then it seems that you need other flavors: marshmallow, sweet cream, ghraham cracker, etc... Then other hints and tips tell you to add lemon juice or vinegar.

So I ordered some butter, vanillin, EM, and Koolada. But yet this doesn't seem to be enough to create a simple juice! I'm getting extremely frustrated just trying to make a plain vanilla or coconut juice and getting something that tastes absolutely horrible or something that is nothing near what it should be.

I've tried a few of the tips such as adding lemon juice or vinegar or EM or Koolada...and as I said, I got one decent single flavored juice. After tasting some of my creations and some vendor juices, I think they have the same problem I do. They are just mixing stuff up and selling it as "X-flavored juice" and getting the same results as me. But I digress...

I'm about to the point of pulling my hair out just trying to make a single flavor. I've looked all over the place and all I see are these multi-flavored juice recipes that I know I don't have a chance of creating, nor do I think I'm even ready to try.

It would be really cool if there was a thread for just single flavored juices. Maybe there is and I just haven't found it. Or maybe a site that has simple juices. I'd love to find something like this to give me a little more encouragement than people posting "Just keep trying". I"VE TRIED AND TRIED!!!

I don't have a ton of flavors like a lot of the DIY vets out there. I don't see the point in ordering more flavors if I can't make anything decent with the ones I already have.

If anyone out there has any information on a single juice thread or site, that would be wonderful and I'd really appreciate it.

If someone would just start a single flavor thread with, let's say vanilla or coconut, that would cool too!

Any help or direction would be great!

 

[dannyv45]

Flavors are tricky. Each manufacture produces different taste in there flavors. Juicy peach from one manufacture can be very different from juicy peach from a different manufacturer. What I've found as well as many on the forum is that the hangsen line of flavors seem to give the truest taste to a natural flavor. I myself just switched to hangsen and found an 80% success rate with the least amount of fuss.

Hangsen e-Liquid Flavoring | ecigExpres]


[url]http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/diy-e-liquid/440440-hangsen-thread.html


[/URL]

 

[glasseye]

In my experience, limited as it is, to me, you've picked the 2 hardest ones- vanilla and coconut. A great vanilla is very hard and coconut...there is just something wrong with some of them. Or maybe it's me but I'm on my 4th one, just tried it today. It's promising though, Hangsen coconut. It smells like if you just popped open the real thing and took a whiff.

Check out the Capella thread. I think it is Caridwen that has fantastic luck with single flavor recipes.

 

[dannyv45]

In my experience, limited as it is, to me, you've picked the 2 hardest ones- vanilla and coconut. A great vanilla is very hard and coconut...there is just something wrong with some of them. Or maybe it's me but I'm on my 4th one, just tried it today. It's promising though, Hangsen coconut. It smells like if you just popped open the real thing and took a whiff.

Check out the Capella thread. I think it is Caridwen that has fantastic luck with single flavor recipes.

Hangsen vanilla is also very good and easier to work with. Use at 2% for a flavor additive and 3 - 4% as a primary flavor to start with.

 

[glasseye]

You're right Danny, that one is excellent. I haven't used it by itself yet.

 

[michaelsil1]

Hangsen! .........................

 

[Screamin Eagle]

One thing that I've learned in my very short time getting into mixing is that there are some flavors that are really light (such as some apples) and others that are very strong (such as caramel). I'm right now working on a caramel apple recipe where, in this last batch, I'm using 20% Lorann apple and 5% caramel. We'll see how that turns out.

I've also tryed my hand at making a spearmint. I went 15% flavoring on my first try and it was way Way WAY too much. Read a little. Learned a little. Made my next batch using 2% flavoring and it's still a tiny bit spicy but OH does it tast good droped on my finger. Right now all I have is plastic clearomisers so I have to let it set up while I wait for the glass tank clearo I want comes out. But if it vapes as good as it tastes I may have I first winner. If it works I'll post my resipe.

In any case, what exactly is going on with your mixes? Are they, over powering, weak, sour, bitter...ect? What are you experancing with them?

 

[lviperz]

Personally I find the waiting (steeping) time is what discourages me. I mean, I have this idea for a flavor I want to try so I look for ideas of what to mix and then mix it. Now comes the problem, waiting for the steep. If I don't wait long enough I taste crap. If I wait too long I've lost interest in the flavor and pick it to death. So I head to my local B&M to get a fix.

Now comes the next problem, I try to compare my stuff to the store stuff and can't seem to get it just right. So I mix again and the cycle starts over.

I'm not only new to DIY but vaping as well. So I'm still waiting for the newness of this to wear off. So I just tell myself, hey, I can vape this for now and you saved money. I settle on a mix I made and I'll make adjustments for the next batch. I'll finish up the "OK" batch while I wait for the next to steep.

So I share in your frustrations. I would love to have a simple flavor that just worked out of the box. But my taste is many times not simple.

 

[Traver]

Mixing flavors is an art, a science and a journey. If you get one out of ten that you like you are doing a lot better than I am and I have mixing for almost three years.

I think you are on the right track. Eventually you will find a simple one ingredient flavor that you will like. For it is peach. Fruit flavors are easy because they don't require steeping. Personally I don't worry to much about getting it right the first few times with any particular flavor. Most of the time I will just add a drop of a flavor into a vivi nova to whatever juice I happen to be vaping and see what it taste like. If I like it I will try another drop or two. If I still like the taste I will mix a 5% batch up and go on from there. It's a journey and I just like trying different things.

 

[dannyv45]

Personally I find the waiting (steeping) time is what discourages me. I mean, I have this idea for a flavor I want to try so I look for ideas of what to mix and then mix it. Now comes the problem, waiting for the steep.

If you don't like waiting for it to steep naturally then you need to get yourself an ultrasoinc cleaner and use that to steep your juices. it cuts steeping time down from several weeks to several hours. Read this tread.

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...eeping-times-ultrasonic-cleaner-part-iii.html

I try to compare my stuff to the store stuff and can't seem to get it just right. So I mix again and the cycle starts over.

And that's your next problem. At this stage never try to clone a vender juice it take's a whole lot of knowledge, patience and experience. What you should be doing when first starting out is to use your imagination and mix what sounds good to you. Come up with your own original recipes and later down the road try cloning. What you will eventually find is that what you came up with you most likely will prefer over the vender juices.

 

[SuperLuckyLady]

The juices I make are mostly single fruit flavors with no additives - I didn't have any success with the ones you are trying either.

Let me know if you are interested in fruit flavors and I will supply details of what works for me.

 

[DeeDee1234]

What flavors do you have on hand? GIve us a list and let see if we can come up with something to get you going.

 

[Steve K]

Out of all the recipes I've made Vanilla and coconut was the easiest for me,With Capella's its 5% Vanilla Custard and 5% Coconut and 1 drop sweetener.I do the same for Tpa.

 

[Screamin Eagle]

The juices I make are mostly single fruit flavors with no additives - I didn't have any success with the ones you are trying either.

Let me know if you are interested in fruit flavors and I will supply details of what works for me.

By all means post them in here http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/e-liquid-recipes/439217-simple-recipes.html . I think we all could benefit from some good easy recipes.

 

[Norman Clature]

For starters; there is a thread for "Single Flavor" recipes somewhere which I don't feel like searching for right now, but you can find it if you want.

You sound like you might not be much of a "tobacco"-lover, but Hangsen "USA-Mix", "Tab Blended", The "RY*" line, etc. are all good at 5% (others use it around 3% so YMMV) and they are all "one-flavor" recipes. If it's tobacco you may want to use either ACV or Pure Distilled Vinegar at roughly 1-2 drops per 10ml as an additive and to prevent "flavor-fade."

Now here is how I mix up recipes with multiple flavors. I use either 5ml or 10ml bottles for "test" batches. I use no nicotine (just whatever ratio of PG/VG you prefer) and add the first flavor. Then I slowly scale up the second one while tasting 'til the taste changes (you don't have to taste the second flavor that strongly or even the first anymore that strongly; you only have to get to the place where it's sort of a "I could vape this" point.)

Then you should stop.

Then repeat with the 3rd ingredient, etc.

If you "overshoot" you will know it and should start again.

Be sure to keep good notes so you don't repeat your mistakes. When you finally have a good complex tasting juice with multiple flavors you can make a real batch with nicotine and additives.

Also the detailed notes come in handy when you realize you liked it better before you added "something or other" or you want to try a test with less of "something or other", etc.

Hope this helps. It sounds like in 3 months you already have a few flavors you like. I've been at it about a year and have about 10, but a bunch of those are "one flavor" tobacco mixes. I only have about 5 that are complex and also there are a bunch I thought I would keep making that I got tired of.

Thanks,

Norman

 

[DoctorJ]

In my experience, limited as it is, to me, you've picked the 2 hardest ones- vanilla and coconut. A great vanilla is very hard and coconut...there is just something wrong with some of them. Or maybe it's me but I'm on my 4th one, just tried it today. It's promising though, Hangsen coconut. It smells like if you just popped open the real thing and took a whiff.

Check out the Capella thread. I think it is Caridwen that has fantastic luck with single flavor recipes.

Of course I pick two of the "hardest" to try LOL

In any case, what exactly is going on with your mixes? Are they, over powering, weak, sour, bitter...ect? What are you experancing with them?

Some are weak, some have no flavor at all and some have just had a "funky" hard to describe taste. I know that a "burnt" tastes generally means too much flavoring.

Mixing flavors is an art, a science and a journey. If you get one out of ten that you like you are doing a lot better than I am and I have mixing for almost three years.

Well that gives me a bit of encouragement knowing that I at least got the Cinnamon Danish Swirl right!

The juices I make are mostly single fruit flavors with no additives - I didn't have any success with the ones you are trying either.

Let me know if you are interested in fruit flavors and I will supply details of what works for me.

PM OTW!

What flavors do you have on hand? GIve us a list and let see if we can come up with something to get you going.

Capella flavors
Caramel--working on batch atm
Chocolate Fudge Brownie
Milk Chocolate Toffee
Marshmallow
Coconut
Vanilla Custard--batch I made 6 weeks ago is not bad, but light on flavor
Cinnamon Danish Swirl--this one came out good as mentioned in my post

TPA flavors
White Chocolate--made batch at 15% and has pretty much no taste at all, just a bit
Milk Chocolate
Vanilla Bourbon
Graham Cracker

And last but not least,
Freedom West Banana

Additives
TPA Vanillin
TPA Koolada
Capella's Butter
EM

You sound like you might not be much of a "tobacco"-lover,

I am, but I've heard they are even more difficult to deal with as the elusive single flavor I'm looking for.

Thanks for all the responses. I love the ECF community for jumping in to help! I'm trying everything that has been suggested and I'm also looking at expanding my flavorings from different companies. I guess this is just something that is going to take a lot of trial and error and it's good to know that I'm not the only one that has issues. Some people have just made it sound so simple and that frustrates me a lot. But then again, I teach literary theory and that's really simple, to me at least LOL. I see this is all about experimentation and patience. I'm not giving up, but I hate wasting mixing supplies, but I'm sure everyone does too! I'll keep plunking away and trying until I have more success. Fortunately I'm on sabbatical this semester and don't go back to work until next Jan., so I'll have plenty of time to work on this.

Thanks again for the help and encouragement everyone!!!

 

[Traver]

By all means post them in here http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/e-liquid-recipes/439217-simple-recipes.html . I think we all could benefit from some good easy recipes.

I second that.

 

[michaelsil1]

Simple Recipes ???

I want to mix several Flavors and wonder why it tastes like Boo Boo.

Then I want you to help me fix it!

 

[Screamin Eagle]

Doc,
I can sympathize with your frustration. I Still can't get a good caramel apple mixed. The caramel isn't too bad, you just can't tast the apple. I'm on my second 10ml batch and I think I'm going to have to start doing things a little different. Right now I'm upto 20% apple flavoring and 5% caramel. I can tast that the caramel is getting a little over the edge so I'm going to back down on it. But I'm first going to have to make a few stright apple batches until I can get a good apple flavor. Once I get a bace line with the apple then I can add some caramel to it a little at a time until it's where I want it to be.
I'm working with all Loranns flavorings too, so I may need to brake down and order a desent apple flavoring from an e-juice flavor vendor.

 

[DoctorJ]

Well I decided to try and mix some of the FW banana over the weekend and after adding a drop of koolada and some EM it came out pretty good! I'm really excited about that!

I'm consulting with a colleague of mine that teaches chemistry to try and get a better understanding of the "scientific side" of mixing. He plans on doing some tests with a gas chromatograph to see if he can give me any insight as to how PG/VG and flavoring "blend" together. He did tell me that just looking at the basic chemical makeup of the two that heat will play a big factor in binding the molecules. He then went on to speak more about the chemical nature of PG/VG and I was lost after about a minute or so LOL. I've provided him with some PG/VG and some flavor samples to work with. He's a smoker and is really interested in vaping. I loaned him a couple of batteries from my V2 starter kit and some vendor juices to get started. Now he'll at least be able to do his testing and kinda get a feel of what I'm trying to accomplish with the DIY.

I'm looking around and checking out some flavor vendors to expand the flavorings I already have. I've come to the conclusion that not every batch is going to be a great vape and some will be colossal failures. Fortunately I found a few vendor sites that are realtively inexpensive and have a gallon each of PG and VG to work with.

The one thing I have noticed about my attempts thus far is that my nic liquid may be too high, 60mgs. A lot of the juices I've tried mixing thus far have a strong, sort of burning sensation on the exhale. I'm not really sure if this has anything to do with what I'm doing, but I'm thinking that I may need to get a lower nic content on my next order. I'm probably wrong and that has nothing to do with it, but I was wondering what any of you guys think about that. Koolada does help with this strong/burning sensation I'm talking about, but I'm not sure if it's the nic juice or just the nature of the mixing and my nic level which I mix at 18mgs.

Any thoughts on the nic juice?