Why don't people want e-liquid labels changed?
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Check the 'civil disobedience' aisle. Right between the ammunition and the secure transmission software.
On the other hand, if there were pictures on pill bottles, we would have less of a problem of people taking the wrong pills.
There is a whole group of people that would think that leaving a 10 year old unattended in a car for any length of time is extremely irresponsible and dangerous. If that child was in the company of care taker then I don't see the problem with it. Would you feel better if that child was left in the car or at home alone? Not everybody can afford childcare to run to the store for something. A parent can bring their child into a pub (can't sit them at the bar but can bring them in), into a liquor store, fireworks store etc. As long as the child is not allowed to roam into employee sections how is it any different then being at home with adults who vape? The quote in blue.... this is YOU but many do enjoy the different cool, funny, interesting labels and collect vape gear, bottles and tips just for their looks so sometimes we need to put ourselves aside and think about the whole market. The quote in pink....IMO this is an impossible feat as everything and nothing appeals to different children and people of any age. Image appeal is not generated by age. Red quote... There will be no give and take that benefits our side. At this point I fight for it all because I know that sometimes (most times) regulations are written in a way that can look as if they are giving way but in reality the wording just leaves doors open for tighter restriction later. I live in NH and that Live Free or Die thing resonates through my whole being.
To answer your question about cloud competitions.
I think it's a stigma that does not serve the vaping community well because it creates a negative distraction that overshadows the greater cause and purpose of vaping. I think it does a terrible injustice to every heart wrenching story we hear in how vaping literally changed someone's life for the better that was already struggling with soo many health problems as a result of smoking cigs...for many, having vaping as a option saved their life. Those who are using vaping as a competitive sport/hobby have the least to lose if the hammer comes down on vaping because clearly, they don't have respiratory problems. They can just go back to smoking or move on to something else, but it's the vapers who do have respiratory problems that stand to lose the most, including their life if they return to cigs.
We see soo many hardworking dedicated people from individuals to organizations rising up in this fight and it's these very stories that are the heart and soul of their foundation in which they fight to protect vaping. Have you ever once heard cloud competitions being used in any presentation as a bases to defend vaping? No you don't because it serves no importance to the cause and actually harms it because no matter which way you look at it, there just isn't a way to spin it in a positive light.
Now with that said, i still don't think it should be banned. I think adults have every right to engage in using vaping as a game, sport, or hobby if they wish, even though i think it does reflect badly on vaping at a time when vaping doesn't need this kind attention or another nail in it's coffin.
Speaking of nails, the FDA already has their hammer out when comes to kid-like marketing and packaging, it's just a matter of will they stop there, or go for flavoring and possibly nic. I think if the industry shows some restraint by self regulating, flavoring might survive, which is why i fully support the majority of vaping businesses that share this view and partake in no kid-like marketing tactics or packaging. I am just grateful it's only the minority of vaping businesses that seem to not be able to differentiate between kid marketing and adult marketing and hopefully the regulators will take that into consideration and just go after the kiddie marketing and packaging and not flavoring or possibly nic.
I see people juggling chainsaws...using them in a way that they were not intended to be used. How is that any different than cloud comps? Why should that cast a dark light on vaping in general? People can make their own choices in how they use something to their own benefit or demise. Again I don't need the govt to tell me where, when, what, how and why, and certainly don't need a policing system in place when I'm not paying attention and make uncommon sense decisions. I chose my own fate.
Either do half the posts in this topic, but that hasn't stopped anyone.
We even had somebody post about having their chainsaw "rights" removed ....
....not sure how labelling an ejuice with ingredients list takes away anybody's rights. They've been labelling food for decades, and I am having no problem buying or obtaining food.
People here seem to think that it means the FDA will get their foot in the door and take it all away.
The biggest part of this thread, from the OP, wasn't about ingredients. It was about the graphics used on labels.
Exactly. And dictating what sort of artwork can appear on a product is a first step to completely repealing the 1st amendment.
Andria
That is a fair assessment. I completely agree that there is a portion of the vape community that are here because of extreme health issues but that does not encompass the entire community. My daughter is 24. Fortunately smoking cigs didn't cause her the breathing problems my 38 year habit did. I have to say that she was a hesitant vaper and what got her really into it was the excitement angle. She started out dual, but once she saw that there was a younger crowd at a local vape shop that met up, hung out and had comps she got way more into it and gave up the smokes completely. YAY!!!! I was so excited for her that she was able to see that saving her life could be fun. The other thing cloud comps may do to help the community as a whole is bring awareness by appealing to the next generation. The young set is more likely to get involved in something that is fun and relatable to them. Otherwise it will be something their Dads, Mom's, Gramps and Grams did. This way it can be both. Now, reread the quote in red and tell me if I didn't just spin a positive side to cloud comps. You already know I strongly disagree with the rest of what you said so no point in kicking that horse.
I agree with you, though I personally have zero interest in cloud comps, total Tootle Puffer here, but yeah, if it gets the new generation of smokers into vaping, then it's a great thing. My only concern is that massive clouds needs a very bleeding-edge kind of setup, low ohms or high watts or both, requiring sound and stable batteries that can support it safely -- and younger folks have a tendency to think themselves immortal, so some of the safety stuff, they may just blow off... and that does worry me, a lot more than cookies on ejuice bottles or cloud comps themselves.
Andria
Agreed Andria on the safety issues. I think you will agree with me here when I say that people (adults) need to take personal responsibility to do research so that they are being safe. As I said, my daughter is 24 and her fiancé is 22, but when they started to get interested in vaping I told them both to educate themselves fully before upgrading. I will always be Mom and will always have more life experience to pass on so IMO parenting didn't end when they turned 18. I can only speak for the shop near me that holds these types of gatherings, but I do think it is important for shops to educate when selling, or at least telling the customer about ECF. I have listened many times as new customers are in my local shop and I am always pleased with the advice and knowledge I hear passed on. I know at the last comp there were strict rules about builds and they all had to be done there. I am not a cloud chaser either, but I see the appeal in it.
I do too! If my asthma would support it, I'm sure I'd at least try it out, just for the heck of it.
Sounds like a great shop there, educating them as to what is necessary for "cloudz yo". Unfortunately there are too many of the other sort, and they do worry me. Over in the tootler thread, they were just relating some experiences of being laughed at in vape shops for wanting high PG, or 29-30 gauge wire, etc. As if ALL of vaping is about 'cloudz yo.'Andria
Don't you know that vaping is only for smoking cessation? Oh, that's right, it's not.
As for the "extreme" setups needed for it, most good competitions have rules designed to at least force some safety aspects. It's a bit like motocross though, it's not necessary for those who just use motorcycles for transportation, and the equipment is usually tweaked to bring out extreme performance levels, but hopefully those doing it take the proper precautions.
In this thread there is a great video of a speech by an Australian Doctor, who makes some very good points that I think are very relevant to this thread:
"we can, we must, we will make tobacco obsolete" ( Attila Danko ) | E-Cigarette Forum
The video is about 15 minutes long, and further down in the thread is my transcription if you'd rather read it.
Let me see if I can break it down for you how it takes your rights away. Labels cost money...now with that new regulation all the ejuice manufacturers have to change those labels which costs money to print. They are going to need a graphic designer...which costs money to design. Now those cost will be passed on down to you the consumer. Now the govt is going to need a dept to police what needs to be on those labels...which costs money. Those new hires are gonna need paychecks as well as resources to do their job which means tax dollars and who's tax dollars are they going to use...yours. Now let's say xyz company, which makes your all time favorite adv ejuice, fails to comply with said regulations. Next thing you know they are getting stormtroopered by the feds, bank accounts siezed(which they will never get back), doors closed, employees lose their jobs, owners lose everything and you lose you favorite vape. All because of some freaking label. Now that sounds like a win win situation to me. Bye bye being able to vape what you want to vape when you wanna vape and how you want to vape it. Just speaking hypothetically of courseEither do half the posts in this topic, but that hasn't stopped anyone.
We even had somebody post about having their chainsaw "rights" removed ....
....not sure how labelling an ejuice with ingredients list takes away anybody's rights. They've been labelling food for decades, and I am having no problem buying or obtaining food.
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