I think that it's right at the tip that counts. The model is crude but I got within 6% to actual tests which is darn good for an engineering model.
Why Drops Regarding flavoring?
- Thread starter ENAUD
- Start date
- th_trl_thread_readers 0
- Status
Don't get me wrong. I think % is best for large samples. I also think that the overall flavor is more determined by the relative proportion of the flavors. if you are close.
well. a lot of people just measure by the tip on the bottle, as i referenced to. using the aroma bottle (and tip) goes faster, no extra cleaning of equipment....... but even then.. for me, use %... the drops is differnt on the bottles, and as other said..how hard you press..
This is Kinda a Trippy thing about Drops. It doesn't Matter How Hard you Press. As long as you Make One Drop at a Time.
Of Course, If you push the Bottle To Hard, you make a Stream of Fluid. But then we are No Longer Talking about Drops.
It is a Simplified Model. But not without it's Charm.
BTW - Here is a Cool Shot of the Drop Pendant. And some Cool Force Waves traveling back up the Liquid to of the Next Drop to Form.
The part about the relative proportions makes a lot of sense. Lots of positive points were given about the value of using drops. I have a lot of experimenting to do, and recently did a few 5ml batches using drops. I think I will be doing more of these experiments, having 5ml sample batches with varying ratios of different flavors to see how they play together. I am just starting to mix multi flavor batches, and am still working my way through my flavor bar a couple at a time. Playing with this stuff sure can eat up some time!
Drops out of the same bottle type (or dropper) are not always the same size - sometimes they vary substantially (see example below).
When using concentrates or ultra-concentrates, drop size matters FAR more than if using a non-concentrated flavor (see example below).
Example:
16 bottles of VZ's Gourmet ultra-concentrated flavor. After mixing 16 different flavors at 3 different concentrations (being assured the drops were consistent by 'veteran users' in a thread in the Flavor Reviews forum), we found the results to be extremely inconsistent (stupid us, for not measuring as we knew was necessary for accuracy).
We then counted the drops per ml from each of the 16 identical bottles (squeezed by the same person, at the same temperature, held at the same angle). Range? A whopping 32 - 48 drops per ml. We repeated the test twice - results were similar, but not exactly-precisely the same.
We had mixed the test bottles using the 'standard' from the thread - 1 drop per 2 ml (and since we made three bottles of each, we also varied the amount of base in two of the bottles).
1 drop/2ml of 48 drops per ml is 1.05% flavor; 1 drop/2ml of 32 drops per ml is 1.57% flavor = a difference/range of .52%...a difference/range of HALF (of the commonly reported 'sweet spot' of 1% for those particular ultra-concentrates)!
So, if we apply that same difference/range to a flavor that has a sweet spot of 15%, the difference/range would be 11.25% - 18.75%!
The more concentrated a flavor is, the more essential it is to use adequate measuring tools (assuming one desires to create mixes & recipes that can be duplicated consistently & accurately), or be able to calibrate drop size very precisely. The difference in drop size might not matter all that much on a flavor needing 10-15% of flavor (it might just change the finished juice by a partial percentage) - but with concentrates & ultra-concentrates, even the slightest variance in drop size yields an enormous difference in the finished juice.
Of course, mix however you want (that's what DIYing is all about)! But please realize that one can be screwing newbies 'up & over' by generally advising that 'drops are accurate'/best for concentrates & ultra-concentrates...especially without explaining just how vast a difference 'drop size' can make with the concentrates.
Fwiw...our test size bottle is typically 10ml; after we've completed a recipe/formula, we never make less than 60mls at a time, and more typically make 120mls of each recipe.
***For those scientifically calculating drop size - note that due to the chemicals in each flavor being different (which may substantially alter viscosity), there's no way to ensure consistency in drop size across various flavors in a flavor line - even if the bottles, tips & base liquids are identical. The viscosity can also change substantially due to ambient room temperature.
When using concentrates or ultra-concentrates, drop size matters FAR more than if using a non-concentrated flavor (see example below).
Example:
16 bottles of VZ's Gourmet ultra-concentrated flavor. After mixing 16 different flavors at 3 different concentrations (being assured the drops were consistent by 'veteran users' in a thread in the Flavor Reviews forum), we found the results to be extremely inconsistent (stupid us, for not measuring as we knew was necessary for accuracy).
We then counted the drops per ml from each of the 16 identical bottles (squeezed by the same person, at the same temperature, held at the same angle). Range? A whopping 32 - 48 drops per ml. We repeated the test twice - results were similar, but not exactly-precisely the same.
We had mixed the test bottles using the 'standard' from the thread - 1 drop per 2 ml (and since we made three bottles of each, we also varied the amount of base in two of the bottles).
1 drop/2ml of 48 drops per ml is 1.05% flavor; 1 drop/2ml of 32 drops per ml is 1.57% flavor = a difference/range of .52%...a difference/range of HALF (of the commonly reported 'sweet spot' of 1% for those particular ultra-concentrates)!
So, if we apply that same difference/range to a flavor that has a sweet spot of 15%, the difference/range would be 11.25% - 18.75%!
The more concentrated a flavor is, the more essential it is to use adequate measuring tools (assuming one desires to create mixes & recipes that can be duplicated consistently & accurately), or be able to calibrate drop size very precisely. The difference in drop size might not matter all that much on a flavor needing 10-15% of flavor (it might just change the finished juice by a partial percentage) - but with concentrates & ultra-concentrates, even the slightest variance in drop size yields an enormous difference in the finished juice.
Of course, mix however you want (that's what DIYing is all about)! But please realize that one can be screwing newbies 'up & over' by generally advising that 'drops are accurate'/best for concentrates & ultra-concentrates...especially without explaining just how vast a difference 'drop size' can make with the concentrates.
Fwiw...our test size bottle is typically 10ml; after we've completed a recipe/formula, we never make less than 60mls at a time, and more typically make 120mls of each recipe.
***For those scientifically calculating drop size - note that due to the chemicals in each flavor being different (which may substantially alter viscosity), there's no way to ensure consistency in drop size across various flavors in a flavor line - even if the bottles, tips & base liquids are identical. The viscosity can also change substantially due to ambient room temperature.
Last edited:
How about a hybrid system. Share the precise proportions, and suggest a strength.
KAHLUA AND LIGHT CREAM - suggested strength 4-5%
6 parts FA Espresso
6 parts FA Vanilla Bourbon
4 parts FA Fresh Cream
2 parts FA Jamaican Rum
1 part FA Caramel
The mixer would measure out the flavorings into a bottle, creating their custom 'Kahlua' flavor. They'd then mix that 4-5% if following the recipe.
advantages:
* everyone can use whatever units they like: drops, ml, tenth-of-ml, moles, bucketloads...
* everyone can adjust the final strength with ease.
* everyone can make whatever size batch they want.
* it's easy, and everyone gets the identical flavor profile
* we can all vape in harmony again. Would that work?
For any recipe out there in any form, you can already use this method. Explained: http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...42-how-mix-small-batches-complex-recipes.html
KAHLUA AND LIGHT CREAM - suggested strength 4-5%
6 parts FA Espresso
6 parts FA Vanilla Bourbon
4 parts FA Fresh Cream
2 parts FA Jamaican Rum
1 part FA Caramel
The mixer would measure out the flavorings into a bottle, creating their custom 'Kahlua' flavor. They'd then mix that 4-5% if following the recipe.
advantages:
* everyone can use whatever units they like: drops, ml, tenth-of-ml, moles, bucketloads...
* everyone can adjust the final strength with ease.
* everyone can make whatever size batch they want.
* it's easy, and everyone gets the identical flavor profile
* we can all vape in harmony again. Would that work?
For any recipe out there in any form, you can already use this method. Explained: http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...42-how-mix-small-batches-complex-recipes.html
Last edited:
This is True for Fluids of Different Viscosities.
A Drop of Pure VG is going to be MUCH Larger than a Drop of Pure PG using the Same Dropper.
But for the Same Fluid using the Same Dropper, the Variations of Drops Size is Incredibly Small.
Allow me to correct you...
Circumference would be the measurement from a point on the tube, along the inside (or outside, depending on the measurement being taken) of the tube, back to the same point on the tube. In other words, the perimeter of the circle.
Diameter is the measurement across the circle at the center. The radius is half of that.
-C
Circumference would be the measurement from a point on the tube, along the inside (or outside, depending on the measurement being taken) of the tube, back to the same point on the tube. In other words, the perimeter of the circle.
Diameter is the measurement across the circle at the center. The radius is half of that.
-C
Correct me if I'm Wrong. But Isn't a Tubes Inside Circumference (or Outside for that Matter) just another Way to Describe a Tubes Inside Diameter? Also long as someone uses the Term Tube in reference to a Circle.
And I'm not sure how I can be Off by a Radius. In that the Opening of a Dropper Doesn't have to be a Circle. Hence why I said Cross-Sectional Area.
No Arguments with you.
But here is a Question:
If I Know the Circumference of a Circle, do I then Know the Diameter of that same Circle?
Because can't the Diameter of Circle be Expressed as the Quotient of the Circumference Divided by Pi?
No argument, but you've just turned it into a semantic one? That's more confusing than your writing style.
Your statement I originally quoted leads one to believe that circumference and diameter are interchangeable, which they are not. One is not "another way to describe" the other on it's own. If you know the value of the circumference, then yes, you certainly have the ability to SOLVE for the diameter. The mathematical expression of the equation is D=C/π.
-C
Your statement I originally quoted leads one to believe that circumference and diameter are interchangeable, which they are not. One is not "another way to describe" the other on it's own. If you know the value of the circumference, then yes, you certainly have the ability to SOLVE for the diameter. The mathematical expression of the equation is D=C/π.
-C
- Status
