Why Exclusivity Doesn't Work

[iamtumus]

to expect the 316 SS hand made devices to be in the same price range as these chrome plated brass chinese large scale manufacturing with little attention to detail, you either are living in a fantasy or have no idea how much work gets put into these things. Just because something is considered the current best doesn't mean it can't be revised and made better.

i don't own any zen products, nor have any plans to own any (unless i can find a ZAU on the classies) in the future.
I'm content with my readily available high quality genesis devices, like my ihybrid and DiD.

Not because I don't want a zen, but because i don't have the patience for lists.
Same reason I got a paps instead of a caravela.

 

[j4mmin42]

close this

No. A forum is a forum for a reason; Discussion is what this place is for. The thread should stay.

I agree with some of you, but the point of my article was not that the Zen mods and others are too expensive- they're too hard to get.

 

[Dougiestyle]

to expect the 316 SS hand made devices to be in the same price range as these chrome plated brass chinese large scale manufacturing with little attention to detail, you either are living in a fantasy or have no idea how much work gets put into these things. Just because something is considered the current best doesn't mean it can't be revised and made better.

i don't own any zen products, nor have any plans to own any (unless i can find a ZAU on the classies) in the future.
I'm content with my readily available high quality genesis devices, like my ihybrid and DiD.

Not because I don't want a zen, but because i don't have the patience for lists.
Same reason I got a paps instead of a caravela.

I payed ~$20 for a high-quality SS A7 that is engineered to superior standards, IMO. I bought it for function and form and cost-effectiveness. I couldn't be happier, because I feel I received a quality product at a reasonable price. A lot of RBAs ARE quality. Their design is impeccable for the function, but supply needs to be increased for demand, so the exclusivity and inflated prices can be stopped. I can't justify spending as much money on something that is a niche market. Seems vanity takes precedent for some tho.

 

[j4mmin42]

to expect the 316 SS hand made devices to be in the same price range as these chrome plated brass chinese large scale manufacturing with little attention to detail, you either are living in a fantasy or have no idea how much work gets put into these things. Just because something is considered the current best doesn't mean it can't be revised and made better.

i don't own any zen products, nor have any plans to own any (unless i can find a ZAU on the classies) in the future.
I'm content with my readily available high quality genesis devices, like my ihybrid and DiD.

Not because I don't want a zen, but because i don't have the patience for lists.
Same reason I got a paps instead of a caravela.

I see it in quite the opposite way- if you're thinkin that in 5 years, someone won't have a large factory with updated machinery able to work 316 SS and make mods even more beautiful than the ones around today, than YOU are living in a fantasy. It's all a mater of time, imho.

 

[iamtumus]

I see it in quite the opposite way- if you're thinkin that in 5 years, someone won't have a large factory with updated machinery able to work 316 SS and make mods even more beautiful than the ones around today, than YOU are living in a fantasy. It's all a mater of time, imho.

so the possibility of something happening in the future impacts current supply and demand?

and i'm living in a fantasy?

 

[j4mmin42]

so the possibility of something happening in the future impacts current supply and demand?

and i'm living in a fantasy?

Part of the discussion here has to do with the current state of things, and that fact that the products we all want are not made in sufficient quantities for the right price. I would argue that the future has most everything to do with this discussion- in fact, in some ways, the future that I was talking about is already happening. look at the AGA atomizers: They're priced right, all-SS construction, proper threads and build quality...and look at the all-Stainless DUDs that are about to go live really soon, it's the same story. They're catching up to the small mod makers, for sure. It's only a matter of time before hybrids start appearing, too, along with other things...

...And for reference, I'm not taking out my @$$ here. I've got my finger on the pulse when it comes to the Chinese manufacturers, if not so much with what's happening domestically- so I can assure you that they ARE working on refining their materials and production techniques on the whole- at least some manufacturers are.

 

[iamtumus]

what grade stainless steel is it?
how closely are they inspected or tested before they're sent out?
i can nearly guarantee it's nowhere near the level of devices like the zenesis.


it's really the difference between a toyota and a Bugatti.
both get the same job done but one is made in a large scale factory for general public and another is a handmade piece of hardware for a specific group of enthusiasts, of a completely different level.
There's a reason a toyota costs $20,000 and a Bugatti costs upward of $1m.

 

[j4mmin42]

what grade stainless steel is it?
how closely are they inspected or tested before they're sent out?
i can nearly guarantee it's nowhere near the level of devices like the zenesis.


it's really the difference between a toyota and a Bugatti.
both get the same job done but one is made in a large scale factory for general public and another is a handmade piece of hardware for a specific group of enthusiasts, of a completely different level.
There's a reason a toyota costs $20,000 and a Bugatti costs upward of $1m.

I've heard that argument a million times, and I really don't want to get into a discussion about it, but let's just say that I don't agree that it can be applied to this industry correctly. It isn't that simple, because in this industry, there are MANY people who have (and would be willing) to fork over the cash for a premium product- but the supply isn't there. In your analogy, do you know what happens when the supply of Bugatti's runs out? They go and buy a few Lexus LFAs, or a Nissan GTRs instead.. but again, the cross-industry analogy thing just doen't work in this case.

I do get the feeling that a lot of people who are very defensive of the exclusive mods are somewhat objectivist- maybe it's just me, but it does make sense.

 

[iamtumus]

that's why people buy hybrids like the ihybrid. which are readily available but imo aren't to the same standard as Zenesis devices
there's a place in this world for all these devices. saying that someone will buy a GTR in lieu of a Bugatti is like saying you'll buy a gas station logic in place of a provari

 

[j4mmin42]

that's why people buy hybrids like the ihybrid. which are readily available but imo aren't to the same standard as Zenesis devices
there's a place in this world for all these devices. saying that someone will buy a GTR in lieu of a Bugatti is like saying you'll buy a gas station logic in place of a provari

I'm having fun with this now- A GTR may not have quite as much advanced engineering involved in its construction, but it is the only car in the world that is built by hand in a hermetically-sealed clean room. It is a properly OCD car in every way- and approaches perfection. In many ways it surpasses the Veyron- although the two are dramatically different animals.

Definitely not the difference between a cig-a-like and a provari.

 

[j4mmin42]

I'm having fun with this now- A GTR may not have quite as much advanced engineering involved in its construction, but it is the only car in the world that is built by hand in a hermetically-sealed clean room. It is a properly OCD car in every way- and approaches perfection. In many ways it surpasses the Veyron- although the two are dramatically different animals.

Definitely not the difference between a cig-a-like and a provari.

A bugatti is like a Zen, though, in that like Zen mods, they don't turn much of a profit- in fact, in the case of the Veyron, they lost something like $200,000 a piece on every car. They were literally built in pursuit of being the best at all costs, just like the Zen.

 

[iamtumus]

Bugatti's and Zenesis are both status symbols for 2 very different kinds of elite collectors.

the cig a like to provari is quite a bit of hyperbole but gets the point across.
There is a reason you SETTLE for a GTR when the Bugatti's are unavailable.
sound familiar?

 

[j4mmin42]

Bugatti's and Zenesis are both status symbols for 2 very different kinds of elite collectors.

the cig a like to provari is quite a bit of hyperbole but gets the point across.
There is a reason you SETTLE for a GTR when the Bugatti's are unavailable.
sound familiar?

When I couldn't buy a Zen, I settled on an iHy...but then again, I actually paid LESS for my Zen (by about $25), so there's that... heh

 

[iamtumus]

I own an ihy and have never touched a zen.

But that doesn't negate the argument.

 

[j4mmin42]

...And don't even get me started on that ****ing caravela... I'm still at least 3-6 months down the list for mine. By the time I get it, we'll all be vaping on CHybrids...LOL

 

[iamtumus]

you buying the caravela/paps/gus specific atty faceless is making?

 

[j4mmin42]

you buying the caravela/paps/gus specific atty faceless is making?

I've only heard whispers about it- and until I get the CV/Paps/GUS to put it on, I probably won't bother. Also, waiting to check out the quality of both Zen~'s and Faceless' work- waiting on a Zen standard and the iHy dragon, hopefully next week they'll be here. Until I see the iHy close up, I'm not comitting to buying anything from any mod-makers, lol. Except the CV.

 

[iamtumus]

ihybrid is my favorite genesis device i've used.
can't wait for the titanium 18/14500

 

[j4mmin42]

I ordered the switch magnets for mine- do you use them, or do you know how well they work? I love magnetic switches.

 

[iamtumus]

i use the spring
i lost my ground screw so it's out of order atm.