Why Vapers are getting a BAD NAME.

[Jay-dub]

You were. But vague, left-field responses will hopefully distract us from reality.

I'm going to call that more baiting and question who is being distracting. You're telling me that between all the vapists and shops, and CASAA and ECF that we can't divide the cost enough to lesson the burden towards employing a feasible tactic? Just here in Missouri, it's not feasible to get one thousand people to put forth five dollars a month for maintaining a lobbyist? vape shops and CASAA could cross-promote a "save the vape" day or week once a month when customers and members are asked to contribute. vape shops could have a notice at the point of sale. I really don't see you guys doing anything other than... well, I'm not going to derail the more important issues. I think it's feasible. Obviously, you all know better. I've made my case and will drop it now.

 

[zoiDman]

Where have vapers been getting a "bad name"? I certainly are not aware of it.

The original vaper had an issue with another vaper vaping in a doctor's waiting room in front of children and titled this thread "Why Vapers are getting a bad name".

If you could give me any examples where there is public outcry because of rude vapers, I'd surely like to see it.

...

Not sure if this is what you are Looking For. But it sounds like things Didn't go over to well.

"To force people outside among second-hand smoke is preposterous,” added Jay Reissberg.

E-cigarette vapers puffed away right in City Council Chambers as the councilmembers heard the arguments. The act did not sit well with some in the chamber.

“I thought it was outrageous and very disrespectful,” said Councilman James Gennaro (D-24th.) “If they think by coming and blowing smoke in the council’s face that it’s going to be sympathetic to their position, they guessed wrong.”

City Council To Consider E-Cigarette Ban « CBS New York

Perhaps the LAST group of People I would want to Piss Off with a Vape Everywhere Attitude.

 

[Jay-dub]

I think, if you go back through this thread, that it shows certain personalities too willing to be venomous and distracting. Though, they fervently lash out and point fingers, the record speaks for itself. If those people are affording restraint here - for the sake of ECF and it's mods - can you imagine how they comment in other venues, perhaps even mentioning their affiliation and support for CASAA and ECF? I couldn't possibly be any more embarrassed to be affiliated with the means and methods that these people employ. That is why I will never tout my affiliation. And that is why vapors are getting a bad name, even among fellow vapors. Now, I've finished what I've had to say on both subjects I've brought up in this thread. My "hijacking" is done.

 

[stevegmu]

Occupy tactics seem to be the strategy for militant vapers...

 

[LDS714]

Give this a listen:

Dimi Rants: What happened in Nashville? | Welcome to DimiSphere

Unless, of course, anyone still wants to maintain that it's more about the people than the money...

 

[Myk]

Not sure if this is what you are Looking For. But it sounds like things Didn't go over to well.

"To force people outside among second-hand smoke is preposterous,” added Jay Reissberg.

E-cigarette vapers puffed away right in City Council Chambers as the councilmembers heard the arguments. The act did not sit well with some in the chamber.

“I thought it was outrageous and very disrespectful,” said Councilman James Gennaro (D-24th.) “If they think by coming and blowing smoke in the council’s face that it’s going to be sympathetic to their position, they guessed wrong.”

City Council To Consider E-Cigarette Ban « CBS New York

Perhaps the LAST group of People I would want to Piss Off with a Vape Everywhere Attitude.

Not really the best example. That vote was already bought and paid for. Vaping in chambers was a start of the civil disobedience that will take place.
In fact the councilman who claimed "blowing smoke in the council's face" proves it's not about respect, it's the fact that we exist at all.

 

[LDS714]

And the majority of city council members are experts, professionals even, when it comes to disrespect...

 

[zoiDman]

I think, if you go back through this thread, that it shows certain personalities too willing to be venomous and distracting. Though, they fervently lash out and point fingers, the record speaks for itself. If those people are affording restraint here - for the sake of ECF and it's mods - can you imagine how they comment in other venues, perhaps even mentioning their affiliation and support for CASAA and ECF? I couldn't possibly be any more embarrassed to be affiliated with the means and methods that these people employ. ...

It Isn't that hard to Imagine.

Sometimes all you have to do is go to one Twitter Page to get an Idea.

 

[Jay-dub]

Give this a listen:

Dimi Rants: What happened in Nashville? | Welcome to DimiSphere

Unless, of course, anyone still wants to maintain that it's more about the people than the money...

Not enough to inspire inaction. Only makes me want to figure out how to engage more efficiently. Yelling past each other here - with fellow members, or out there -with the public and the opposition - seems to have proven it's worth by now. And if it isn't obvious I've done my best to help them keep up. I'm not willing to remain stagnant or perhaps, allow others to enable my stagnancy as justification for their own.

 

[zoiDman]

Not really the best example. That vote was already bought and paid for. Vaping in chambers was a start of the civil disobedience that will take place.
In fact the councilman who claimed "blowing smoke in the council's face" proves it's not about respect, it's the fact that we exist at all.

No?

I don't see how that Bit of Street Theater cast a Good Light on the Average Vaper? Seeing what kind of Media Coverage they Knew it would Get.

Is that how we Want an Uninformed Non-Vaper to Perceive ALL of Us?

 

[LDS714]

Not enough to inspire inaction. Only makes me want to figure out how to engage more efficiently. Yelling past each other here - with fellow members, or out there -with the public and the opposition - seems to have proven it's worth by now. And if it isn't obvious I've done my best to help them keep up. I'm not willing to remain stagnant or perhaps, allow others to enable my stagnancy as justification for their own.

Exactly. Two lobbyists trump 40 citizens...

 

[Maurice Pudlo]

Vaping is not a protected right, and the abuse of any privilege is likely to result in restrictions.

So to all of the vape anywhere crowd, I say this, "Thanks for nothing, your doing me no favors".

Maurice

 

[Myk]

Not enough to inspire inaction. Only makes me want to figure out how to engage more efficiently. Yelling past each other here - with fellow members, or out there -with the public and the opposition - seems to have proven it's worth by now. And if it isn't obvious I've done my best to help them keep up. I'm not willing to remain stagnant or perhaps, allow others to enable my stagnancy as justification for their own.

Figuring out how to engage more efficiently is what I've been trying to get out of you.
Although in defense of the small businesses that didn't show up, many would have to shut their doors to show up. But that is precisely why they should be supporting some group to go there for them. So how do you get them to cough up the money?

The problem is enough support would have to be national and this nickle and dime them to death local and state by state ban thing is an old trick that was used for Prohibition, it is designed to break the backs of the smaller groups they're against.

No?

I don't see how that Bit of Street Theater cast a Good Light on the Average Vaper? Seeing what kind of Media Coverage they Knew it would Get.

Is that how we Want an Uninformed Non-Vaper to Perceive ALL of Us?

Once again your timeline is screwed up and you're placing blame on the great Oz projection instead of the man behind the curtain.

The vote was already decided before a single one was cast. Everyone knew it. Vaping in chambers didn't cast any light on vapers the council didn't already have.
Did people vape in chambers before the postponed vote that we likely would've won?
Haven't you been paying attention? We're already getting that bad light media coverage.

NYC lied, lied again and then did some slight of hand to ram the ban through. How long do you expect vapers to be respectful when our own politicians are thumbing their noses at us? If the media wasn't bought and paid for that would be what gets the media coverage.

I agree with the people in NYC who are planning civil disobedience. They tried playing the game and the dictatorial powers that be kept on making up their own rules. If this was a couple hundred years ago the majority of our politicians would find themselves tarred and feathered.

 

[Myk]

Vaping is not a protected right, and the abuse of any privilege is likely to result in restrictions.

So to all of the vape anywhere crowd, I say this, "Thanks for nothing, your doing me no favors".

Maurice

Property RIGHTS are a protected right. The government dictating what a business allows on their PRIVATE property is not a power of the government.

 

[Jay-dub]

Figuring out how to engage more efficiently is what I've been trying to get out of you.

I propose ideas that you shoot down without honest deliberation. I've made constructive attempts at forwarding a cause among people who only seem to understand how to be destructive. I've looked up the cost of a lobbyist in my state and ran the numbers. Hard facts you have yet to dispute. You don't believe that, at least in Missouri, it's possible to raise $5,000 a month? Why do you adhere to such a destructive and defeatist mentality? Every thing's a bad idea, we're all doomed, the opposition is too strong, the opposition is too corrupt, we can't do this, we can't do that, all we can do is wait and pray for our Saviour's at CASAA and ECF to save us and the meantime we'll lash out in all directions with inflammatory and divisive language and tactics. If anyone disagrees, well... I think we've seen - destruction wins here!

 

[zoiDman]

...

Once again your timeline is screwed up and you're placing blame on the great Oz projection instead of the man behind the curtain.

The vote was already decided before a single one was cast. Everyone knew it. Vaping in chambers didn't cast any light on vapers the council didn't already have.
Did people vape in chambers before the postponed vote that we likely would've won?
Haven't you been paying attention? We're already getting that bad light media coverage.

NYC lied, lied again and then did some slight of hand to ram the ban through. How long do you expect vapers to be respectful when our own politicians are thumbing their noses at us? If the media wasn't bought and paid for that would be what gets the media coverage.

I agree with the people in NYC who are planning civil disobedience. They tried playing the game and the dictatorial powers that be kept on making up their own rules. If this was a couple hundred years ago the majority of our politicians would find themselves tarred and feathered.

I'm not Trying to make Any Inferences about How a NYC Council Member would Vote.

I'm Pointing Out that what a Small Group of Vapers Did in that Council Chambers was Viewed by Many Non-Vapers. And that their Actions Cast a Bad Light on the Vaping Community as a Whole.

It is also Worth Noting that the NYC Ban is Being Closely Watched by Policy Makers in Different States on Many Different Levels. I can't think of a Worse Image to Portray to these Policy Makers than what these Vapers did in NYC.

 

[Ohms Lawbreaker]

Seems plenty of concern on both sides for sure, judging by all this. Something is bound to happen. How's that for a political prediction? lol

I try to keep in mind that people fight many personal battles in life and only have the time and energy for so much. Like charities, my wife and I do our part here and there in different ways when we can. Still, some will make a silent judgement if you refuse to give a dollar here or there for this or that cause, or wave a flag for this or that. Hard to tell sometimes what people do in their personal lives. At one end you can not vote at all, in the middle you can simply vote, at the other end you can be proactive. Someone said voting is really the least a person can do, funny and kind of true, I think it was Hank from over at the pond. No offense to anyone who champions a cause, not when I realize there are a million different causes to champion.

 

[DC2]

No offense to anyone who champions a cause, not when I realize there are a million different causes to champion.

I think a lot of the anger comes from the fact that there aren't even 10,000 CASAA members yet.
It's free to join, only takes one minute, and yet here we are...

 

[Ohms Lawbreaker]

I think a lot of the anger comes from the fact that there aren't even 10,000 CASAA members yet.
It's free to join, only takes one minute, and yet here we are...

Your point is well taken. Though consider this: Everyone wants one bite at the pie, right? That is sort of the basic advertising argued right, that allows a salesman to come to your front door, and "offer you a bite of the apple." You are of course able to politely refuse. If the salesman doesn't go away or keeps coming back, there is a problem. Suddenly there are 10,000 issues competing for your attention in every social situation, and even into private situations. Not trying to troll the extreme here, just saying we are all free to choose our battles.

The good people with the clip boards in our little busy shopping center are getting out of control. PITA, Green Peace, Neighborhood Association, Political Action Committees up the wazoo. Can I say "wazoo" here? Yeah, up the Great Wazoo interfering with pedestrian and street traffic alike, particularly on weekends. They all have a right to get you to take one bite of the apple. But maybe you are full.

 

[DC2]

Your point is well taken. Though consider this: Everyone wants one bite at the pie, right? That is sort of the basic advertising argued right, that allows a salesman to come to your front door, and "offer you a bite of the apple." You are of course able to politely refuse. If the salesman doesn't go away or keeps coming back, there is a problem. Suddenly there are 10,000 issues competing for your attention in every social situation, and even into private situations. Not trying to troll the extreme here, just saying we are all free to choose our battles.

The good people with the clip boards in our little busy shopping center are getting out of control. PITA, Green Peace, Neighborhood Association, Political Action Committees up the wazoo. Can I say "wazoo" here? Yeah, up the Great Wazoo interfering with pedestrian and street traffic alike, particularly on weekends. They all have a right to get you to take one bite of the apple. But maybe you are full.

Well, it's funny you mention that, because I do sign petitions at shopping centers.
In fact, I used to circulate those petitions myself when I was in college.


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