Wow, wiki says pg not good for health

[Hotwire]

So, yeah I'm sure its probably still better than tobacco smoke but, here is what wiki says

Exposure to mists may cause eye irritation, as well as upper respiratory tract irritation. Inhaation of the propylene glycol vapors appears to present no significant hazard in ordinary applications. However, limited human experience indicates that inhalation of propylene glycol mists could be irritating to some individuals. Therefore inhalation exposure to mists of these materials should be avoided. Some research has suggested that propylene glycol not be used in applications where inhalation exposure or human eye contact with the spray mists of these materials is likely, such as fogs for theatrical productions or antifreeze solutions for emergency eye wash stations.[

Additionally, some electronic cigarette users who inhale propylene glycol vapor may experience dryness of the throat or shortness of breath . As an alternative, some suppliers will put Vegetable Glycerin in the "e-liquid" for those who are allergic (or have bad reactions) to propylene glycol.
Important correction, november 2010: Recent findings in a Swedish study strongly suggests a connection between air-concentrations of propylenglycol in houses and development of asthma and allergic reactions as rhinitis, in children. (Choi, Schmidbauer m.fl. ("010): Common Household Chemicals and the Allergy Risks in Pre-School Age Children. PLoS ONE 5(10): e13423, doi:10.1371/journal.pone.0013423.)

 

[markfm]

Yes, sensitivity to PG absolutely exists with some people, that's why there are non PG juices also available.
For most people PG in eliquid doesn't seem to cause an issue, and for others just reducing PG, but not eliminating it, seems to work fine.
PG has been used in various inhalers for decades. This topic comes up every couple of months, including people listing the ingredients on their inhalers calling out PG.

 

[Hotwire]

So not a biggie if I'm having no symptoms?

hmmm, but what if they take years to develop...?

i'm getting hyperchondriac now...

Well, like I said, prob better than tob smoke...

 

[markfm]

If you can stop vaping, too, not just stop smoking, I don't think anyone would disagree that that is the best thing.

Given my 35+ year smoking history, I'm really happy to be not smoking for half a year as of now. For me, and I can only speak for me, I've absolutely had improved breathing (though I always worked out), improved smell/taste.

I really like nicotine, also like coffee. Truth is I've actually noticed a decrease in coffee consumption since I'm able to vape at work -- I guess the nicotine stimulant is replacing the caffeine stimulant, that my body is self-regulating. Thus, while I've increased regular water consumption (vaping dryness) I've also decreased intake of a diuretic -- likely a net plus.

It's all a case of making a decision with the information available. For now I'm content that vaping, at least for me, is a net positive. I'll likely live a longer, overall healthier, life by not smoking. If I get to the point of not vaping that would be great, but it is not even a mid-term goal right now.
If PG is a particular concern to you, you can look for VG and PEG-based products. I haven't heard much about PEG, but it is out there. Concerning VG, some people actually have a bit of sensitivity to it, too, at least when inhaled.

Congratulations on trying to find out about things. You might want to poke into the stickies in the Health and Safety forum area, some knowledgeable types post what information is available.

Ahh, decisions, decisions

 

[bassthumper]

PG DOES affect some people but not everybody. Same with VG though. I read a study a few months ago and (I don't know when and don't have any links sorry) I THINK it was from the 50s or 60s but they tested PG on a bunch of people and found that it only caused minor irritation after prolonged exposure.... a few other things but that was most of it- they found it was fairly harmless. However, that was an old test and there haven't been many other studies, I'm willing to bet almost ANYTHING is better than smoking what I USED to smoke. And I smoked alot. Also, I believe there's even PG in cigarettes!!!

I could be wrong in all this- its just my 2 cents

 

[Cajun83]

Wiki also says that "truthiness" is a word.

Truthiness - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Hotwire]

Markfm

For me it's smoke or vape. One or the other. I once told my friends that the day I quit smoking will be the day my Doc says 'You have to stop smoking or you will die a very painful death - very soon.'

I loved it and couldn't quit.

Them are the facts.

So vaping has replaced smoking for me too (except when drunk, then I have 2 or 3 max.) I too like you feel a lot helthier from it after only 3 weeks. tbh I prefer it to smoking for many reasons (again except when drunk which I think is due to the lower level of blood oxygen when you smoke cigs that makes the booze buzz feel even better, whilst vape is a stimulant as you mentioned and for me doesn't mix with booze well)

Yes, i too notice when I vape I have a lot less coffee cravings and I used to drink around 10 cups a day!

Was a smoker for 21 years myself.

Pretty sure I'll never be able to not smoke when drinking though, but hey ho.

Just trying to make sure vaping pg isn't just leaping from the frying pan (smoking cigs) into the fire....

Thanks for your inputs guys, and tbh now I've thought it over, 'irritant' Is a lot better than 'carcogenic' - know what I mean...?

 

[Hotwire]

Wiki also says that "truthiness" is a word.

Truthiness - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Come on now, that's pretty feceasous of you. The wiki page on pg was backed up by and quoted serious scientific studies.

 

[phorbin]

Come on now, that's pretty feceasous of you. The wiki page on pg was backed up by and quoted serious scientific studies.

true, but they carefully chose which research they used in the article. There has been research ongoing since I believe the 1950s which shows that PG mist added to the air reduces the transmission of illnesses in hospitals. Those same studies showed no connection between PG exposure and asthma. So i guess its a question of "whose research do you believe"?

At the moment there are two camps: those of us who use PVs as well as manufacturers of the vaping hardware and software, and then there is the opposition camp. Very little research directly relating to the use of PVs has been done by anyone outside these two camps. In fact, very little has been done at all. Certainly not by independent labs who don't have a "horse in this race" so to speak.

Until more facts are available i continue to cling to two pieces of knowledge. 1) I am no longer a smoker 2) I feel better!
It hardly qualifies as emperical research, but i've lived in this body all my life. I know it pretty well. And its happier now than its been in a long time. Until more facts are available, thats good enough for me.

 

[Hotwire]

One needs to bear in mind that the levels of pg in children's wards may have been at a level where potential inlfamation would be miniamal.

compare that with a vaper directly inhaling successive large ammounts of it into their lungs... I'm pretty sure the ammount the kids in the kid's ward were exposed to (non directly I might add) compared to a vaper - would be much lower.

anyway, I'm not tyrying to upset anyone, just curious and interested in my physical wellbeing....

 

[uba egar320]

One needs to bear in mind that the levels of pg in children's wards may have been at a level where potential inlfamation would be miniamal.

compare that with a vaper directly inhaling successive large ammounts of it into their lungs... I'm pretty sure the ammount the kids in the kid's ward were exposed to (non directly I might add) compared to a vaper - would be much lower.

anyway, I'm not tyrying to upset anyone, just curious and interested in my physical wellbeing....

I understand where you're coming from. But don't forget what you are trying to get away from. True, I don't know the long term effects of inhaling this stuff all day everyday. But anything imo is better than what I was doing(short of quitting cold turkey of course, but I couldn't do it).

 

[Hotwire]

But anything imo is better than what I was doing(short of quitting cold turkey of course, but I couldn't do it).

That's what I'm hoping too. So far, yes I feel healthier.

Me too - I told my friends - 'I know I will not quit smoking until the day my doctor says "If you don;t stop now, you will die very soon and very painfuly..."

I still smoke when I drink, but when sober I actually enjoy vaping more than smoking, so....

 

[phorbin]

Oh I'm not upset at all....to the contrary. You asked a very valid question. My ultimate point was that there just isn't enough research yet for us to have an answer to your question. But we deserve an answer.

One needs to bear in mind that the levels of pg in children's wards may have been at a level where potential inlfamation would be miniamal.

compare that with a vaper directly inhaling successive large ammounts of it into their lungs... I'm pretty sure the ammount the kids in the kid's ward were exposed to (non directly I might add) compared to a vaper - would be much lower.

anyway, I'm not tyrying to upset anyone, just curious and interested in my physical wellbeing....

 

[REGGAEGEEK]

If worried just keep reading.... plenty of places that say the opposite.
When i smoked, i always looked for the packs that had the warning "Smoking during pregnancy may cause low fetal birth weight", since i am male i had nothing to worry about.

 

[Hotwire]

I know many on this site have their beef with the fda in the US, but truth is (for better or worse - and beleive me I think they are a bunch of corrupt money hungry monsters at worst - or a group of buffoons poleaxed by beurocracy and red tape at best) they are pretty much THE institution that people listen to, so it would be best (though probably expensive beyond the e-cig manufacturer's means) if e-cig and e-liquid manufacturers paid their dues and got their products fda tested I guess....

thoughts?

 

[Aaeli]

Wiki also says that "truthiness" is a word.

Truthiness - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Stephen Colbert had a ball editing Wikipedia, too, loved it.

If you're concerned and want to research, I'd look outside Wiki. This isn't a knock against you for asking, we all have the right to ask valid questions. I just wouldn't rely on Wikipedia.

Maybe I'm just bitter because I've been told for 4 semesters now that Wiki had no business in paper citations as it isn't reliable. That could be it...

 

[UntamedRose]

There is always some who is allergic to some...Nothing is safe from that (want proof there are people allergic to water, and woman allergic to sperm..no joke)
From what I've read roughly 10% of people will have negative reactions to PG. Most of which will be minor problems. Based upon our VGies here on ECF that seems about right. So for someone to have an allergic reaction to PG is totally expected.

As to the study....after looking it over. There are a Lot of variables thrown in there I'm not really sure What to make of it.
Its just really out there...
Like this..."It was also found that a higher concentration of PGEs in indoor air was associated with children evincing antibodies (IgE) against
allergens such as cats, dogs, pollen."
So basically this says Children who Already are having allergy problems are more likely to have asthma, hay fever, and eczema with concentrations of PGE in the bedroom air.
But it Doesnt say How high those concentrations are/needs to be.
Nor compare the fact that kids already having allergy problems are more likely to have asthma, hay fever, eczema AnyWay. There is no control for this study really.

 

[UntamedRose]

Wiki also says that "truthiness" is a word.

Truthiness - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

My last history professor was a Wiki Toll...a rather proud one too. He "dreamed" of students using his Wiki info on a history report.

 

[ManicMaurice]

PG allergies most definitely exist. I know from personal experience. My reaction to PG is just like the typical stuff you hear about in every allergy med commercial - itchy water eyes, stuffed up nose, scratchy throat, post nasal drip. Nothing serious, it's pretty much the same thing I encounter during pollen season. I just pop an antihistamine, stop vaping PG and the symptoms completely go away. I've completely switched to VG in all my juice and the low percentage of PG that is present in almost all flavor additives doesn't bother me one bit. I've toyed with the idea of upping the PG slowly starting with 80% VG and 20% PG to see where my tolerance level lies, but haven't gotten around to it yet. Plus all the PG that is present in everything else I come into contact in my daily life doesn't bother me at all either. It only seems to cause an allergic reaction when it is in vapor form - fog machines, PG juices, etc.

 

[bassthumper]

That's what I'm hoping too. So far, yes I feel healthier.

Me too - I told my friends - 'I know I will not quit smoking until the day my doctor says "If you don;t stop now, you will die very soon and very painfuly..."

I still smoke when I drink, but when sober I actually enjoy vaping more than smoking, so....

That's a crappy way to go about it
when the doc tells you that- it might be too late

what if the doc says "you shoulda quit- now you have lung cancer...."
quips can't save you then....