Yet another explosion

[Ed_C]

@KenD I think it's a lost cause. Some people just can't understand the idea of shared responsibility.

 

[beckdg]

The normal consumer won't know that these cells are the same that are/were used in laptops, that they're not specifically made for vaping, that they could potentially be dangerous. I don't know what you worked/used to work with, or if you always had an interest in electronics, but this is not something that is common knowledge. You're fooling yourself if you think it is. And no, it's not only the "youngins" this applies to. In fact, if it weren't for the internet and social media even fewer vapers would be aware of these things.

Sent from my M7_PLUS using Tapatalk

And there's the rub, really.

I've met a few dozen (at least) people whom have either given or received the education you guys speak of.

I've had to wrap coils for more than could tell me an accurate (within reason) CDR for their batteries.

Even the ones with wires couldn't figure out on their own how to wrap a decent coil.

And the couple that worked at a vape shop that I met making clouds in the Walmart soda Isle with a 200 watt box mod got very obstinate and insisted their batteries were 40 amp cells.

Prior to that, these guys were telling me about the massive coils they build for noobs they just sold a mech all the time.

And complaining how they just come back for the next coil.

I wonder why...

As far as I'm concerned, the youngins get no free pass.

They grew up in the information age with a device attached at their hip that can freely give them all this knowledge on a whim...

And they know how to use it.

Some just choose not to until it's too late.

But a 50+ yr old gets more leeway IMO.

Either way... the rub...

With vaping we have an atomizer and some material between our faces and our batteries when they're in use.

With a cell phone, mp3 player and maybe laptop, not so much.

So if anyone has any responsibility to educate consumers about lithium batteries, it's Motorola, Apple, Samsung, LG, etc.

I read a lot of comments how it's unfair the pressures put on vaping.

And here the same camp is putting the onus on a smaller, more segmented industry and giving a free pass to the mega Corporations that put us at the closest proximity with the biggest risk and the most profits to spend on education.

Please do make some sense of this for me.

'Cause I don't get it.



Tapatyped

 

[Kprthevapr]

 

[Bad Ninja]

The normal consumer won't know that these cells are the same that are/were used in laptops, that they're not specifically made for vaping, that they could potentially be dangerous. I don't know what you worked/used to work with, or if you always had an interest in electronics, but this is not something that is common knowledge. You're fooling yourself if you think it is. And no, it's not only the "youngins" this applies to. In fact, if it weren't for the internet and social media even fewer vapers would be aware of these things.

Sent from my M7_PLUS using Tapatalk

Newsflash:
You are sticking and electronic device your mouth!!!
Isnt that clue number one to do some basic research?

Are you saying that sticking strange unknown objects in your mouth is safe and normal?

Wut ?
Just shove any ole object into your mouth and if things go south its someone elses fault?
SMH.

You say they dont know better.
I say they do know better, they still ignore the signs, and blame others when things go bad.
Its the way of a new generation.


"Normal people". Gimme a break.

 

[Bad Ninja]

@KenD I think it's a lost cause. Some people just can't understand the idea of shared responsibility.

And some people refuse to accept responsibility for their own actions.

Lets pass the blame around.

 

[Lessifer]

So... let's approach this from the other side. What do you think can be done to lessen the occurrence of incidents like this?

 

[Bad Ninja]

So... let's approach this from the other side. What do you think can be done to lessen the occurrence of incidents like this?

We can start with the broken educational system.

Beyond that, we can promote critical thinking and responsible actions.

We must deny ignorance, not celebrate it.
What we cannot do is lay the responsibility at the feet of someone else for our own improper actions.

 

[Ed_C]

So... let's approach this from the other side. What do you think can be done to lessen the occurrence of incidents like this?

I tried suggesting that a while back.

 

[Ed_C]

Newsflash:
You are sticking and electronic device your mouth!!!
Isnt that clue number one to do some basic research?

Are you saying that sticking strange unknown objects in your mouth is safe and normal?

Wut ?
Just shove any ole object into your mouth and if things go south its someone elses fault?
SMH.

You say they dont know better.
I say they do know better, they still ignore the signs, and blame others when things go bad.
Its the way of a new generation.


"Normal people". Gimme a break.

So did you do extensive research on electric toothbrushes, shavers, beard trimmers, wireless headphones and cell phones before you dared put them next to your head?

And since all that technology, except for the cell phones, existed long before the internet, did you go to the library to do your research?

I'm really curious to know.

 

[Bad Ninja]

So did you do extensive research on electric toothbrushes, shavers, beard trimmers, wireless headphones and cell phones before you dared put them next to your head?

And since all that technology, except for the cell phones, existed long before the internet, did you go to the library to do your research?

I'm really curious to know.

Yes.
If I dont understand how to use ANY tool, I educate myself before using it.

Common sense.
Otherwise you are gambling with your safety.

I work daily with tools that will cause injury or death if used improperly.

I am not a careless man.
Im also not unintelligent.
Some things i am smart enough to figure out myself. One must use the brain for something other than pie filling.

 

[Lessifer]

I tried suggesting that a while back.

The problem is, I don't know what can or should be done. I don't believe regulating warning labels and instructions would actually help, other than to minimize lawsuits filed. We can't require vendors to educate. So, we can, as consumers, promote knowledge of safe battery handling practices, but that's about it. As far as I can tell.

 

[Ed_C]

I would agree, to a point, with you when you're talking about professional tools or even perhaps hobbyist tools. But with consumer products, there should be warnings as to proper safe use. That's all I'm saying. If the person has been warned and then he/she chooses to disregard the warnings, then I'd say it's 100% on them.

 

[Ed_C]

The problem is, I don't know what can or should be done. I don't believe regulating warning labels and instructions would actually help, other than to minimize lawsuits filed. We can't require vendors to educate. So, we can, as consumers, promote knowledge of safe battery handling practices, but that's about it. As far as I can tell.

There's no way, that I know of, to get everyone to behave safely. I just think warnings should be included with products and I think that they mostly are. Batteries are the exception because they are not intended for our purposes and therefore aren't packaged with any information. They are not manufactured to be consumer products, from what I understand. I wouldn't mind seeing some sort or fact sheet supplied with all ecig purchases. I'm not sure if that should be legally mandated, but I think it's something that the industry could do.

 

[Lessifer]

There's no way, that I know of, to get everyone to behave safely. I just think warnings should be included with products and I think that they mostly are. Batteries are the exception because they are not intended for our purposes and therefore aren't packaged with any information. They are not manufactured to be consumer products, from what I understand. I wouldn't mind seeing some sort or fact sheet supplied with all ecig purchases. I'm not sure if that should be legally mandated, but I think it's something that the industry could do.

I come from the land of warning labels. Too many warning labels can have the opposite effect of what's intended.

 

[Ed_C]

I come from the land of warning labels. Too many warning labels can have the opposite effect of what's intended.

I spent most of my life in California, so I know what you mean. That's why I was kind of liking the idea of a separate fact sheet that wasn't burred in the box with all the other little bits of paper with text in font sizes that are too small to read without a magnifying glass.

 

[Bad Ninja]

Batteries are the exception because they are not intended for our purposes and therefore aren't packaged with any information. They are not manufactured to be consumer products, from what I understand

This is incorrect.
Batteries are consumer products and sold as such ( sony vtcs are not packaged for individual resale by the manufacturer but are not retricted in any way).
These batteries are indeed sold to the public. And they have been for longer than e-cigs have existed.



The flashlight industry has embraced their use long before vapers modified them into vaporizers ( hence the term "Mod").


Flashlight users and early modders educated themselves and were quite safe using tools they built themselves.


What makes you think you are the exception?

As stated above, almost everyone has instant access to a world of information.
Ill agree some are too lazy to bother, but legislating life to the lowest common denominator only dumbs us all down to that level.


So now if mods looked scary enough people would think more critically?
I seriously doubt it.
Im beginning to think we should just let nature thin the herd.

 

[Ed_C]

@Bad Ninja Question for you. Would you rather try and do something to educate people who don't have the initiative or insight to search out information on the dangers of high drain batteries or would you rather wait till they they are made unavailable and be able to sit home smugly in the knowledge that you were wise and responsible enough to search out the proper use of these batteries? There's a pragmatic element to all this as well.

 

[Ed_C]

This is incorrect.
Batteries are consumer products and sold as such ( sony vtcs are not packaged for individual resale by the manufacturer but are not retricted in any way).
These batteries are indeed sold to the public. And they have been for longer than e-cigs have existed.



The flashlight industry has embraced their use long before vapers modified them into vaporizers ( hence the term "Mod").


Flashlight users and early modders educated themselves and were quite safe using tools they built themselves.


What makes you think you are the exception?

As stated above, almost everyone has instant access to a world of information.
Ill agree some are too lazy to bother, but legislating life to the lowest common denominator only dumbs us all down to that level.


So now if mods looked scary enough people would think more critically?
I seriously doubt it.
Im beginning to think we should just let nature thin the herd.

These batteris are available because they have not been made illegal, but the manufactures have all stated that they are not intended for consumer use. They are not purchased directly from the manufactures, they are sold through back channels.

Supplying information that people need to be safe has nothing to do with dumbing down anything.

And like you said, "almost" everyone has access to this information. Is it just tough luck for those who can't afford the internet or perhaps elderly people who don't understand it? I guess they are just collateral damage?

 

[Mazinny]

Sony eSupport - WARNING: eCigs, Vape Pens, and Lithium-Ion Batteries

Sony has great concern for the safety of our consumers. We recently became aware that some people may use our cylindrical lithium-ion VTC battery cells ("Li-Ion Cells") in a way that Sony does not intend for them to be used: in eCigarettes and vape pens. Sony has not tested Li-Ion cells in eCigs and vape pens. Because of the high power, Sony Li-Ion Cells require safety precautions and mechanisms to make their use safe. Sony is not aware of eCigarettes or vape pens that have such safety mechanisms. Misuse of Sony Li-Ion Cells in eCigarettes and vape pens may cause a serious risk to personal property and safety.


This issue is important to the US Fire Marshall and to the Consumer Technology Association, who have both released reports or statements on it.


The Sony Li-Ion Cells are sold to manufacturers and meant to power products like power tools that contain certain safety precautions and mechanisms which meet our quality standards.


Please take care to follow all manufacturer guidelines to ensure your safety. For questions about whether a Sony battery cell of any type may be used in a particular product, please email us at cps@am.sony.com. Thank you for your understanding and cooperation.

 

[Bad Ninja]

These batteris are available because they have not been made illegal, but the manufactures have all stated that they are not intended for consumer use. They are not purchased directly from the manufactures, they are sold through back channels.

Supplying information that people need to be safe has nothing to do with dumbing down anything.

And like you said, "almost" everyone has access to this information. Is it just tough luck for those who can't afford the internet or perhaps elderly people who don't understand it? I guess they are just collateral damage?

Eithier you are seriously uninformed or just spreading false info.
Please show proof.

Batteries are not sold through black market "back channels".
They are sold directly to retail vendors because manufacturers do not deal in small individual sales.
Samsung will happily sell you 10,000 cells at full retail price.


Careless people rarely make it to 60 without learning a valuable lesson or two about blindly using tools


"But but ....what about the children and the elderly?"
Seriously?


And yes, if you do not have information to use a tool safely you should not do so.
Doing otherwise is clearly foolish and asking for trouble.