Before you order from RTS Vapes read this

Discussion in 'Reviews of Suppliers - Negative' started by vaprr, Nov 14, 2011.

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  1. vaprr

    vaprr Full Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2011
    Location:
    uk
    Something has come to my attention that I think the ECF staff may need to look into regarding one of their approved suppliers.

    RTS Vapes has claimed in their advertisements, their website, and in their supplier thread that they make their own 100% USA nicotine in a Northern Carolina, USA laboratory. They posted a copy of their Certification of Analysis from said laboratory in post #646 of their supplier thread that I've attached below.

    I have found an almost identical Certification of Analysis from a major Chinese nicotine maker that I've also attached below. J&G Biotechnology. You may contact the company via their website and request a copy directly to verify the one I have provided.

    Looking at the two side by side, and from the identical misspellings of "Water" and "Related", there is no doubt that RTS Vapes did a very poor copy and paste job using a Certification of Analysis from this Chinese company. Even the name of the RTS pdf file left the % symbol intact.
    This begs the question of whether we can trust this vendor's claims.
    As it stands, it appears from these documents that RTS Vapes is reselling Chinese nicotine under a deceptive advertisement. If true, it is my understanding that this would not only be a breach of ethics, but may be a violation of US government trade laws. At the very least, ECF should be concerned that many members may be deceived by an ECF Approved Vendor.

    I would like to hear both from the owner of RTS Vapes as well as from any of ECF's chemists or professionals who are best able to understand these documents regarding this matter.
    After the alarming Box Elder matter, we need to have better assurances of exactly what we are buying and from whom.

    If need be, please move this post to the appropriate forum.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Renzuli

    Renzuli Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2011
    Location:
    North Las Vegas
    I agree , thou I don't buy from that company , if they are pulling a fast one , they need to be brought to task for it .
     
  3. lynleestar

    lynleestar Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

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    Sep 13, 2010
    Location:
    NW Indiana
  4. swedishfish

    swedishfish Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2010
    Location:
    NJ
    You need to post that in the appropriate forum. suppliers can't post here.
     
  5. vaprr

    vaprr Full Member

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    Nov 14, 2011
    Location:
    uk
    Thank you. Could a moderator please move this post to the appropriate forum so that the owner of RTS Vapes may reply directly?
     
  6. Kenzi

    Kenzi Senior Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

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    Oct 13, 2011
    Location:
    Upstate NY
    box elder ? anypne feel like sending me a message :mail:? maybe a link?
     
  7. swedishfish

    swedishfish Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2010
    Location:
    NJ
    You need to contact a mod and ask them to move this to the review section. It's really poor form to accuse a supplier of things and have them be unable to at least respond.

    edit: I'm sure you didn't know,you are just trying to keep everyone informed.
     
  8. atom48

    atom48 Super Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2009
    Location:
    Colorado
    If you look at the results printed on the two forms, they are actually different. Could it be that they each used the same analysis service, or a service that used the same fill-in form specifically? Just asking.
     
  9. Olef

    Olef Super Member ECF Veteran

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2011
    Location:
    UK
    Who are you, and what is your purpose in posting this? Judging by your post count you have created an account specifically to publish this 'evidence'.

    Why?

    What is your interest in the business of RTS vapes?
     
  10. Spazmelda

    Spazmelda Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2011
    Location:
    Ohio
    That J&G Biotechnology looks photoshopped on the bottom of the second link. Both files seem to be computer generated because of the quality of the text (it's not pixelated) but J&G Biotechnology is pixelated when you zoom in. Zoom in on Analysis Services and J&G down at the bottom and you can see the differences in pixelation. Why would an electronic file converted directly to a pdf have a pixelated stamped company name at the bottom?

    I don't know. I'm not convinced by this evidence.
     
  11. Spazmelda

    Spazmelda Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2011
    Location:
    Ohio
    Hm, and actually, you can select the stamped portion of the image separately from the rest of the image. Looks like it was added in later to me. I'm using Nitro pdf reader, and if you click on >select and the pull down to select text graphic, it selects the J&G image as a separate element.
     
  12. vaprr

    vaprr Full Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2011
    Location:
    uk
    The same interest I have in the still unresolved Box Elder issue that concerns all here.
    I accidentally came across this information while looking into Box Elder, and thought it was important enough to post here.
    I do not know how the pdf files were created, but I do know that the RTS file came from their supplier thread and the J&G file came directly from J&G.
    The similarity of the two, including the same typos, leads me to believe they are both from the same source. Very unusual considering they are from opposite sides of the globe.
     
  13. randyith

    randyith Registered Supplier ECF Veteran

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2011
    Location:
    North Carolina, USA
    Our five most expensive costs of doing business are the following: (Highest costs listed first)

    1) Nicotine extraction
    2) Postage
    3) Laboratory tests
    4) PG\VG
    5) Labor


    Here is our explanation to your charge:

    The laboratory tests you reference cost several thousand dollars each by a USA lab. In order to do more extensive tests on our nicotine batches we have recently outsourced to a laboratory in the country of India. Their test results were pretty close to a USA lab on the same batch so we now use them for our laboratory tests because they charge half of what an American Lab charges. Since English is not their first language we typically see typos and miss-spellings in their e-mails and test results. Perhaps J&G uses the same lab. We do not know nor do we care.

    Here is what we do know:

    We visited J&G's website and no laboratory tests are posted there. So we conclude you must be a supplier in the e-cig industry and contacted them directly to obtain their lab tests. How many ECF members have a copy of Chinese nicotine manufacturers laying around their house to compare to our lab test? I bet the answer is zero unless they are a supplier.

    So you are a supplier whose profit margin we must have hurt. (SOB; CRY SOB) Just has you threaten us legally and with regulators be advised your accusations are a matter of public record and when and if slander against our company occurs we will take appropriate legal action. This is not a threat but simply a statement of fact.


    Neutral readers should read this post:

    http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...blem-nic-titration-results-4.html#post4566130
     
  14. randyith

    randyith Registered Supplier ECF Veteran

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2011
    Location:
    North Carolina, USA
    You have crossed the line on the other forum. Do think you can hide behind a forum handle. We have just authorized our law firm to subpoena your identity on the other forum. We authorized the law firm $10,000 since we can see your IP addrees is really USA although you say you are from the UK. Keep posting that negative slander.
     
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