yep exactly. that's why i'm here. there are folks several years ahead on this. there's the inherent problem of long term smokers and concomitant health issues, but i haven't seen anything to spook me yet.
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yep exactly. that's why i'm here. there are folks several years ahead on this. there's the inherent problem of long term smokers and concomitant health issues, but i haven't seen anything to spook me yet.
Perhaps you could have inhaled Computer dust cleaner and had better lung function, doesn't mean it won't kill you in 10 years.. Thats why these studies are important... (I know its an extreme example, but I was trying to emphasize the point and right now we don't know).
it makes sense the airways constricted, because the body isnt used to it. The human body is very adaptable to what it encounters....basically if it doesnt kill you, the body will adapt to it. But the first response is to expell or close off against it. No surprise there! Ever got a smoker to take a puff off your e-cig? they hack and cough like it's volcano ash they are inhaling. Pretty much the same response when we smokers took our first puff of a cigarette. Poor science if you ask me.
I smoked 2 packs a day for 30 years, although my healing process has no doubt been slowed by a 4ml a day minimum, there's no question I can take a much deeper breath than I could 4 months ago, and no more nasty morning cough.
I think I'll stick with the vape.
I think I'll stick with the vape.
First thing I tell every smoker before they try a pv, "It's not whimpy! Draw into your mouth first, then slowly inhale into your lungs."
Duh, researchers, a dry carto will make a long-term vaper cough. Geesh. Toss some quilt batting onto a hotplate and inhale, bet you'll cough, gag, turn green/blue. Has diddly to do with vaping.
Duh, researchers, a dry carto will make a long-term vaper cough. Geesh. Toss some quilt batting onto a hotplate and inhale, bet you'll cough, gag, turn green/blue. Has diddly to do with vaping.
Someone should tell pulmonary technicians about this. PG fog is used in hospital breathing treatments to deliver medication to the lungs. Most have seen the mask and fog treatment for people with pneumonia. If they only knew that this was just making the problem worse ...
Hey Sunny Crack, (trying not to picture that) If you need to be 100% sure vaping is perfectly safe, wait 15 years for the studies (by the FDA, who we can all trust 100%) to be complete and then decide for yourself it vaping is a better alternative than smoking. I don't need researchers to tell me I'm doing great on the vape, I can feel it.
EDIT: and I don't have the 15 years to wait
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I'd have to believe that if they took non-smokers and had them inhale a regular cigarette for 5 minutes, they'd have similar results - it is probably the body's way of saying, "Whoa, what is this new substance?". I coughed the first few times I tried vaping until I got used to it. Big deal.
They lost me at "healthy smokers" too. Personally, I can't agree with their findings. I feel healthier than I have in 20 years.
Sounds like faulty test methods ala the ......... kills brain cells study (basically killed chimps via smoke inhalation with no oxygen added).
The study did not mention a control group and double blind studies.
If I can pick that out imagine what a peer reviewed journal treatment of the subject would do.
I can come up with a study that "proves" Dan Patrick does indeed poor stars and rainbows.... will it stand up to peer reviewed inquests? Not likely.
The study did not mention a control group and double blind studies.
If I can pick that out imagine what a peer reviewed journal treatment of the subject would do.
I can come up with a study that "proves" Dan Patrick does indeed poor stars and rainbows.... will it stand up to peer reviewed inquests? Not likely.
Okay so I got here from another post about this article and I see that everyone is talking about the healthy smokers... but if you read the methods section from CHEST it is actually healthy NON smokers!
"30 healthy non smokers (ages 19-56, 14 male) participated in this laboratory based experimental vs. control group study."
Can you imagine the impedence that a non smoker would have with vaping... LOL smokers usually can't handle it.
"30 healthy non smokers (ages 19-56, 14 male) participated in this laboratory based experimental vs. control group study."
Can you imagine the impedence that a non smoker would have with vaping... LOL smokers usually can't handle it.
TOTALLY agree w/twohanded. E-cigs were the easiest & most effective quitting method I had ever tried & I'd tried numerous times over the last 30 years to quit analogs. In all my years I never heard of e-cigs & only accidentally came across them on the internet. Now both my husband & I have quit smoking, feel better, don't hack/cough/wheeze, & saving $$$$.
Why hadn't I heard about e-cigs before???? I've got my opinions about the answer. (And it p#%$es me off.)
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i'm sure vaping beats smoking, but i would like to understand this FeNO metric as well. increased risk of asthma?
http://allergynotes.blogspot.com/2007/09/exhaled-nitric-oxide-feno-in-asthma-and.html?m=1
Let me play devil's advocate...
My major concern with vaping is the effect of PG on the lungs as it is a diuretic. If this is in some way related to that, I think I could understand it.
However, airway constriction is a very common response to a foreign substance being inhaled into the lungs. I would be intrigued to see the impact of these same test subjects when tested side by side versus cigarettes. I would imagine the constriction of airways would be the same if not worse when they inhaled tobacco smoke.
But, when you look at the evidence here... this seems like a shotty test without the controls, clear test parameters and background to be considered "legit".
IMHO..this WREAKS of a test funded by tobacco companies. I.E. - lets not clearly explain what happened, lets just find a way to make it sound bad..
My major concern with vaping is the effect of PG on the lungs as it is a diuretic. If this is in some way related to that, I think I could understand it.
However, airway constriction is a very common response to a foreign substance being inhaled into the lungs. I would be intrigued to see the impact of these same test subjects when tested side by side versus cigarettes. I would imagine the constriction of airways would be the same if not worse when they inhaled tobacco smoke.
But, when you look at the evidence here... this seems like a shotty test without the controls, clear test parameters and background to be considered "legit".
IMHO..this WREAKS of a test funded by tobacco companies. I.E. - lets not clearly explain what happened, lets just find a way to make it sound bad..
"For the new study, Vardavas and colleagues in Athens had 30 healthy smokers puff on an e-cigarette to see how it affected their airways.
Theresearchers found that after five minutes, users showed signs of airway constriction -- as measured by several types of breathing tests -- and of inflammation."
Amazing-they used smokers and found the effects of smoking. I have never been a smoker. I vape heavy. I have no airway obstruction, do an hour of strength training and 30 minutes of HI cardio a day. They should have used non smokers.
Theresearchers found that after five minutes, users showed signs of airway constriction -- as measured by several types of breathing tests -- and of inflammation."
Amazing-they used smokers and found the effects of smoking. I have never been a smoker. I vape heavy. I have no airway obstruction, do an hour of strength training and 30 minutes of HI cardio a day. They should have used non smokers.
As a PP pointed out they actually didn't use healthy smokers, they used healthy 'non-smokers'.
Acute pulmonary effects of using an e-cigarette: impac... [Chest. 2011] - PubMed - NCBI
Acute pulmonary effects of using an e-cigarette: impac... [Chest. 2011] - PubMed - NCBI
The link to the abstract refers to "healthy non smokers" and "healthy adult smokers", so take your pick I guess. Shoddy.
Oh yeah, you are right. WTF?
ETA: I emailed the first author to ask. I'll let you know if I hear back.
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