0.01 ohm, 165watt - IPV3 Upgrade!!?

[AquaLung22]

I just got word of this, early December upgrade for the IPV3!! Firmware upgrade will raise its watt limit to 165watts. And more imprtantely, reading ohms to the hundredth, 0.01 ohm display!
Man, now I'm really glad I snagged 1 of these last night. For just under $100 at eciggity with "blackfriday" coupon!

I just joined an "ipv Owner's Group" on Facebook, and somebody posted a pic of the SX chip at 165watts, and ohm-display accuracy showing 0.01/hundredth of an ohm! I've been debating between the ipv, sigelei 100w Plus, and Sig150w for months now. Even after I finally made my purchase last night, I was still weary if I made the right choice. If this is true, I will know for sure that I did!
... He said this upgrade will be available to the IPV3 in early December!! The 0.01 ohm upgrade alone makes me extremely happy I grabbed 1, if this is true.

What great timing. I'm just bummed I got the new version with charging disabled, and the screws will be a pain.

But I don't think I'll regret buying the IPV3 over the Sig's, if this update is true. Got a great deal (cheapest I've heard of), can't wait til it's here! I have a pic of the chip, ill post when I get to my computer

 

[AquaLung22]

product upgrate_Download_Green Leaf Electronic Cigarette -
Man this is really exciting.. this will enable the IPV3 to be able to handle down to 0.08ohms, as well. Will post the pic I saw in a little bit!

 

[montara]

 

[stevegmu]

 

[Ed_C]

I just joined an "IPV Owner's Group" on Facebook, and somebody posted a pic of the SX chip at 165watts, and ohm-display accuracy showing 0.01/hundredth of an ohm! I've been debating between the IPV, Sigelei 100w Plus, and Sig150w for months now. Even after I finally made my purchase last night, I was still weary if I made the right choice. If this is true, I will know for sure that I did!
... He said this upgrade will be available to the IPV3 in early December!! The 0.01 ohm upgrade alone makes me extremely happy I grabbed 1, if this is true.

To clarify, just because something than can display down to 0.01 ohm, doesn't mean it's accurate to 0.01 ohm.

 

[Jjshbetz11]

It's ready for download, check out VU

 

[MrPlink]

To clarify, just because something than can display down to 0.01 ohm, doesn't mean it's accurate to 0.01 ohm.

That does not mean it isn't accurate either. What is your point Sherlock?

 

[AquaLung22]

Yeah I was just trying to pass this along.. and I hope it is accurate..
From what I heard, more accurate than the Sigelei's (that's why I grabbed it, I think the Sig Plus looks nicer..)

 

[Ed_C]

That does not mean it isn't accurate either. What is your point Sherlock?

Well, since only expensive and calibrated meters deliver that kind of accuracy, my money is on "isn't." That's my point Watson.

 

[VaperGlock]

I updated mine and the ohm reading is .3 to .4 more than my dedicated ohm reader. Unfortunately. My Atlantis reads .59 on my IPV3 and .56 on my ohm reader. Not sure I'll ever need 165 watts but it's nice to know it's there if I do.

 

[AquaLung22]

Will I have a problem getting this with Windows Vista?

 

[rusirius]

Well, since only expensive and calibrated meters deliver that kind of accuracy, my money is on "isn't." That's my point Watson.

Well, actually this isn't true... A normal multimeter (non-Kelvin bridge) can't have this kind of accuracy for one reason and one reason only. The resistance in the leads is often higher than the resistance you are measuring. But... 4-wire kelvin bridge meters can be extremely accurate at these levels because they measure the resistance by introducing a fixed current through the portion of the circuit being tested, but they do so with separate leads right at the point of testing. So by being able to place a fixed current on either side of the coil (that's why it has 4 wires, 2 to introduce the current and 2 to measure the voltage drop across the load. This way the voltage dropped through the leads won't be measured, ONLY the voltage drop of the load is measured. Which means now we have have extremely high accuracy in our measurement.

But in the case of a mod, they don't have long leads and they already know exactly what voltage and current is being supplied.directly at the coil, and measurements are taken directly at the coil as well. The point is, they too can high extremely high accuracy as well. Is it as accurate as a kelvin-bridge meter? No, but it can probably still hit within +/- .01 ohm or so fairly easily.

 

[stanthemanchan]

It's upgrate, guys. UPGRATE.

 

[Ed_C]

Well, actually this isn't true... A normal multimeter (non-Kelvin bridge) can't have this kind of accuracy for one reason and one reason only. The resistance in the leads is often higher than the resistance you are measuring. But... 4-wire kelvin bridge meters can be extremely accurate at these levels because they measure the resistance by introducing a fixed current through the portion of the circuit being tested, but they do so with separate leads right at the point of testing. So by being able to place a fixed current on either side of the coil (that's why it has 4 wires, 2 to introduce the current and 2 to measure the voltage drop across the load. This way the voltage dropped through the leads won't be measured, ONLY the voltage drop of the load is measured. Which means now we have have extremely high accuracy in our measurement.

But in the case of a mod, they don't have long leads and they already know exactly what voltage and current is being supplied.directly at the coil, and measurements are taken directly at the coil as well. The point is, they too can high extremely high accuracy as well. Is it as accurate as a kelvin-bridge meter? No, but it can probably still hit within +/- .01 ohm or so fairly easily.

So if it was simply the resistance of the leads, why can't you just zero out the lead resistance? I always thought (although I don't know for sure), that the limitations in accuracy were more due to manufacturing tolerances in the meter, than simply long leads, I've always read the cheap DMMs were not good at resolving resistances below about 1 ohm.

 

[KenD]

I thought the op meant that with three upgrade the ipv can measure in the hundredths whereas it only could do tenths before. Being able to measure 0.56 is a significant advantage over simply measuring 0.6. Then again, I don't know anything about the ipv and can have misunderstood the op.

 

[Ed_C]

I thought the op meant that with three upgrade the ipv can measure in the hundredths whereas it only could do tenths before. Being able to measure 0.56 is a significant advantage over simply measuring 0.6. Then again, I don't know anything about the ipv and can have misunderstood the op.

That is what he meant and it can be an advantage. My point was that the accuracy might still be in the order of +/- 0.1 ohms or more. Just because they added an additional digit, doesn't necessarily mean it's accurate to that digit.

 

[rusirius]

So if it was simply the resistance of the leads, why can't you just zero out the lead resistance? I always thought (although I don't know for sure), that the limitations in accuracy were more due to manufacturing tolerances in the meter, than simply long leads, I've always read the cheap DMMs were not good at resolving resistances below about 1 ohm.

It's kinda complicated, but to measure the resistance the a 4 wire meter is actually putting a current on the leads and measuring voltage drop across the load. This results in a much higher accuracy than just a typical two wire meter. This is why you won't find a two wire meter that has an ohm display any higher than a tenth of an ohm. So you can technically measure the leads and subtract this resistance from the measurement, but it still can't measure to any high accuracy without introducing a known current and measuring the voltage drop. That's where the 4 wire systems come into play. But a mod essentially has the exact same setup. Something that can supply a known voltage/current and then measure the resistance across the load.

 

[Ed_C]

It's kinda complicated, but to measure the resistance the a 4 wire meter is actually putting a current on the leads and measuring voltage drop across the load. This results in a much higher accuracy than just a typical two wire meter. This is why you won't find a two wire meter that has an ohm display any higher than a tenth of an ohm. So you can technically measure the leads and subtract this resistance from the measurement, but it still can't measure to any high accuracy without introducing a known current and measuring the voltage drop. That's where the 4 wire systems come into play. But a mod essentially has the exact same setup. Something that can supply a known voltage/current and then measure the resistance across the load.

Hopefully I'm not being too dense and I'm asking because I want to learn, but it seems like I an APV would be more like a DMM with very short leads. It doesn't really use anything like a Kelvin Bridge does it? The current is being carried over and the resistance measured over the same two wires. I guess the bottom line is, do you think the addition of a hundredth digit on APV would add anything of value? I never expected the accuracy of APV to be greater than a cheap DMM.

 

[rusirius]

Hopefully I'm not being to dense and I'm asking because I want to learn, but it seems like I an APV would be more like a DMM with very short leads. It doesn't really use anything like a Kelvin Bridge does it? The current is being carried over and the resistance measured over the same two wires. I guess the bottom line is, do you think the addition of a hundredth digit on APV would add anything of value? I never expected the accuracy of APV to be greater than a cheap DMM.

Not at all! (The dense part!) LOL... And you're right... The APV is pretty much exactly like that. But you have to think of it this way. A normal DMM has a lot of very unknown factors. The leads themselves are swapable. You might have 1 meter leads or 3 meter leads or 6 meter leads. You might slap a pair of alligator clamps on it... When you connect it to a load you might have a semi-crappy connection, there might be some slight oxidation on the surface of the load, etc... Even in 1 meter leads a simple temperature change from cold to hot can change the resistance in the leads a bit. So it's not that a normal DMM can't do high resolution resistance checking, it's just that all the various factors that play a part make it extremely difficult. Even trying to zero out all these factors before taking the measurement just can't give you the resolution needed for hundredths of an ohm. There's just too many factors that can change too rapidly including how good of a connection you make to the load.

Take a piece of wire and measure it's resistance with a standard DMM... Watch the display carefully and press harder and harder on the leads... Even this slight difference can change the resistance reading fairly drastically... So again, it's just too difficult to try to zero out the leads when there are so many unknowns...

That's where the 4-wire systems come into play. It's not that a standard DMM can't measure to that kind of accuracy, it's just that it's not even worth it to try. With a kelvin system you're eliminating all of the factors of the leads themselves.

In a mod, you have very short "leads", and these leads are "fixed". They are hard solder joints that (baring any problems) won't be introducing stray resistances. So now things can be accounted for a little better. You have leads of a known gauge and fixed length that won't change. You are passing a fixed current through the load and able to measure the voltage drop across that load. The only variable is the atty, the connections in the atty, the coil, etc... and those are all exactly what you want to measure to a high degree of accuracy.

I know I'm not doing a very good job of explaining it. LOL... But hopefully that helps at least a little?

 

[twgbonehead]

Another reason a mod could get much better accuracy is that it is designed to work with a specific type of load.

A multimeter uses a tiny amount of power to measure resistances; this is done so it doesn't blow anything up in the circuit. But a tiny amount of power through a very small resistance generates an extremely small voltage. Offsets in the meter's electronics can play a huge factor.

A mod, on the other hand, can put a very respectable amount of current through a coil, and therefore will be measuring much larger voltages.

ETA: Also, just because a 510 connector only has 2 contacts, they can still use a kelvin connection. One wire to the + terminal for the drive current, a second wire to the same terminal to sense the voltage; likewise for the negative side.