Adult stupidity !!

[Midniteoyl]

Since we aren't citing reports on this, I'll just claim that for every report of child getting poisoned, I'm feeling confident that there are 100 other children that are around nicotine (same home) or possibly using it, and doing just fine.

Again, I would ask how many current vapers, who were once smokers, ingested nicotine (via smoking) when they were minors? If they are alive to tell about it, it means this nicotine scare is literally fear mongering. What percentage would say it is? I'd estimate that 90% of all vapers, who were once smokers, started putting nicotine into their little bodies that when they were under 18 years old.

Sorry... second part of your post: 'Smoking' is not the same as 'ingesting'. We are talking about actually having the child drink the liquid, or eat the nicotine lozenges.. Smoking, while not good for the child, probably wont 'cause more than a 'nicotine headache' as it is a much lower quantity and your body says 'stop' well before you are pass the point where you will get sick. Ingesting nicotine, or liquid with nicotine, or lonzeges, or ciggs, or whatever is not the same in that you can easily ingest way more than necessary to be poisoned, or even killed, way before your body can tell you to 'stop' or even feel anything at all.

So, ingesting is what we are talking about here...

 

[edyle]

This wasnt unattended, but it does show what happens to even a small, 190mah, Li-Ion battery when the charger goes bad Happened in less than 3 mins.. Whats not shown is the melted countertop from the orange hot battery... It was hot so long that I have no doubt that had I not been there, it would have started the countertop on fire... I guess you could say it makes the case for granite

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I don't understand what I'm looking at in that first picture; I see what looks like a counter top, but the wall seems extremely odd; like its made of foam material?
a blackened area on the left from some kind of burning
a blackened area on the right from some kind of burning
and the whole area in between I just dont understand what that is about

 

[Dominique Hoogduin]

I wonder if the sales person would have sold her the gear had you not said anything. Selling to a minor could cause big troubles, the same as if he were selling cigarettes, alcohol or dirty mags. I think you not only did good in speaking your mind , but you saved the sales person / owner their business license.

Just to be clear, even if " Mom" was paying all parties knew it was for the kid....... and thats the same as someone buying cigs, booze or mags for a minor........

hmm dunno bout your laws.. but its illegal to sell alchohol and tobacco here (netherlands) to an adult here that is intended to be given to a minor (how we are to determine that is not stated in said law so minor just probably wait outside the store to receive the goods 0_0.. or when confronted mom just returns later without kid and buys it anyway 0_0) wich brings us back to the real problem.. the law trying to make up for bad parenting or what the government considers bad for children.

 

[epicdoom]

Since we aren't citing reports on this, I'll just claim that for every report of child getting poisoned, I'm feeling confident that there are 100 other children that are around nicotine (same home) or possibly using it, and doing just fine.

Again, I would ask how many current vapers, who were once smokers, ingested nicotine (via smoking) when they were minors? If they are alive to tell about it, it means this nicotine scare is literally fear mongering. What percentage would say it is? I'd estimate that 90% of all vapers, who were once smokers, started putting nicotine into their little bodies that when they were under 18 years old.

Your blowing it all out of whack here, I totally agree that nicotine can be ok if ingested in small amounts, Its an overdose I'm talking about. And its true there aren't a lot of cases of it, but are you also aware that a test for that isn't done unless its suspect as a cause of death. That alone could account for atleast one possible death unreported as such. the main important thing here that's been pushed aside is Its a parent's responsibility to keep this kind of stuff away from children. Why would anyone in there rite mind take a chance with there kids life. Again you would probably had to have lost a child to understand. I sure hope you never have to feel that pain, especially when its preventable with common sense.

 

[epicdoom]

Would you like me to post pics of what a gun can do to a person? I mean, it seems like just the pics alone ought to be convincing that these are dangerous if not attended to properly.

The idea that li-ion batts have risk of danger is not being disputed by anyone in this thread, that I can see. That risk is very minimal. And that risk doesn't know an age, so the point of it being something all adults can handle, while no child can, is simply a bizarre assertion. Keep making the case that these batts are dangerous and that is relevant to vaping, and why wouldn't regulators want them removed from society regardless of age? I do realize that will never happen, but it is the case that is seemingly being made.

I would like you to show me a picture of a gun killing, shooting, pistol whipping or anything else to a person animal or thing. see because as far as I knew they had no brain to do any of this. ITS THE PEOPLE who wield the tool that kill, maim and pistol whip.

Many adults are unable to handle the batteries we are human we can panic a child certainly has a higher probability of panic and there not taught what to do with the battery should it erupt into flames many adults aren't but if you use it that's your responsibility to find out. Why put a potentially dangerous item in your childs hands to hope they will know what to do. And the who will even know when all are sleeping while it happens

 

[Midniteoyl]

Would you like me to post pics of what a gun can do to a person? I mean, it seems like just the pics alone ought to be convincing that these are dangerous if not attended to properly.

The idea that li-ion batts have risk of danger is not being disputed by anyone in this thread, that I can see. That risk is very minimal. And that risk doesn't know an age, so the point of it being something all adults can handle, while no child can, is simply a bizarre assertion. Keep making the case that these batts are dangerous and that is relevant to vaping, and why wouldn't regulators want them removed from society regardless of age? I do realize that will never happen, but it is the case that is seemingly being made.

No.. You made it sound as if the batts are no problem. Someone else started the gun debate, but you seem to be carrying it on.

Here's the point: A gun, if left unattended, is safe. Attended or unattended. It depends on what the person is doing with the gun that makes it unsafe, ie: human error. A battery is not necessarily safe, attended or unattended. It doesnt matter what the person is doing with the battery. Yes, there are things you can do to make a battery less safe, but they are already unsafe to an extent all by themselves.

 

[txskimo]

I keep losing the point of what's being argued

 

[Midniteoyl]

I don't understand what I'm looking at in that first picture; I see what looks like a counter top, but the wall seems extremely odd; like its made of foam material?
a blackened area on the left from some kind of burning
a blackened area on the right from some kind of burning
and the whole area in between I just dont understand what that is about

The battery charger was plugged into the socket you see. The ecig (white tube) was plugged into the charger, pointing down. The battery overheated and exploded from the ecig (white tube), hit the backsplash, bounced up the wall and hit the stove, coming to rest right on the edge of the countertop at the gap between it and the stove. The wall is painted drywall. The black marks are scorching caused by the glowing hot battery as it bounced.

 

[epicdoom]

I don't understand what I'm looking at in that first picture; I see what looks like a counter top, but the wall seems extremely odd; like its made of foam material?
a blackened area on the left from some kind of burning
a blackened area on the right from some kind of burning
and the whole area in between I just dont understand what that is about

I'm not sure what happened with this battery but lithium batteries can explode throwing there contents like a grenade throwing many little extremely hot burning chunks. I have several burned areas on my arms from spatter.

 

[Midniteoyl]

hmm dunno bout your laws.. but its illegal to sell alchohol and tobacco here (netherlands) to an adult here that is intended to be given to a minor (how we are to determine that is not stated in said law so minor just probably wait outside the store to receive the goods 0_0.. or when confronted mom just returns later without kid and buys it anyway 0_0) wich brings us back to the real problem.. the law trying to make up for bad parenting or what the government considers bad for children.

Yes... its the same here. No alcohol or tobacco to minors. The problem lies in those state that have a 'no nicotine to minors' law and the sale of zero nicotine liquid.

 

[epicdoom]

My state Maryland has a no nicotine Law as well as an alcohol law for all minors.

 

[edyle]

I keep losing the point of what's being argued

Maybe the title says it all: "Adult Stupidity !!"

LOL

 

[epicdoom]

Whats being argued has been pushed aside because a select few fail to comprehend how dangerous it can be to give a child vaping gear. Under no circumstances should a child be allowed to have this stuff While there may not be a million cases of folks blowing there faces off or burning there house down with batteries exploding and tragic Deaths. Some fail to see the problem with the items used in other facets of life that have been an issue. More to the point vaping has just become a very popular thing as more and more people get into it there will be cases of such events trust that as WORD. I am a big fan of vaping It helped me quit a 3 PAD 30+ year habit, I believe it is fairly safe if you know what your doing and do some research to know the devices your using as well as the liquids. There is inherent danger in everything hence my Fairly safe wording. It is not safe IMO to buy this stuff and use it without Knowledge of the items used. Ignorance has been the downfall of mankind from the get go, It doesn't have to be that way any longer can find the answers to our questions easily nowadays.

 

[Mrs C]

Why? As I said, selling e-cigs to minors is NOT illegal in many states... The equipment is not illegal to sell to minors in any state that I know of... Niether is 0 Nic juice.

Better check out Indiana HB 1225 that was signed into law in April and is into effect on July 1

This hasn't been updated since Feb. Quite a few states have age laws now.
Electronic Cigarette Legislation by State | Cig Buyer.com

 

[Amraann]

My state Maryland has a no nicotine Law as well as an alcohol law for all minors.

All states have this law Although it is no tobacco products.

Someone prior on the thread asked if minors could go into liquor stores. The answer is no. One must be 21 to go into a liquor store.
However, that does not stop parents from walking in with their young children to make their purchases.

 

[supertrunker]

I dont believe that...

Dont take my word for it:

CDC - Annual Deaths Attributable to Cigarette Smoking - Smoking & Tobacco Use

List of motor vehicle deaths in U.S. by year - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

T

 

[Laylel]

Maybe the title says it all: "Adult Stupidity !!"

LOL

Just spot on

 

[epicdoom]

Dont take my word for it:

CDC - Annual Deaths Attributable to Cigarette Smoking - Smoking & Tobacco Use

List of motor vehicle deaths in U.S. by year - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

T

Some insane numbers rite there.

 

[xhuffer]

"Mom" sounds like another valid argument for mandatory sterilization.

 

[Laylel]

OP.
Yes it's a lot of danger about e-cigarettes/batteries/e-liquids. It's absolute true. So, down to the the point. Do you have a moral right to tell me what is good for me and my family? What i can have and can't in my house for sage of safety of my children?
You say guns are OK around your children - i say - not around main. And yes around your house you can do what ever you want (because i consider every one has brain and uses it and takes maximum precaution for safety of there's family).

You do know nothing about ppl lifes, like nothing (inside there's families) And run around and telling ppl what they have to do... not gona do any good for you.

From your situations, it was 1 ileagal fact - sale for minor - NO NO NO. Come and remaind stuff member about it. Getting involved into conversation like this... I wish i cud say - you saved the world, but NO, you didn't, all what you got - dirty mouthing with women in front of her child. Nothing to be proud off.

And do not need to tell me that guns are save for my kids to have around, because guns do not kill anyone. It's my house, my children, my guns, my ..., my... and I'm the one who will take decision and make a statements at my place. And if someone will just jump into my conversation with stuff in store and tell me what to do... well, not like i will mouthing back, but i will sure tell - mind your own business, period.