anyone else have shortness of breath?

[Koman]

I have been vaping for 2 weeks, completely stopped the analogs, and I am getting a heavy shortness of breath. I thought the explanation that it can be a symptom of quitting smoking pure wishfulthinking, until I found this topic, written by people who quit smoking and are not vaping: Shortness of breath after stopping smoking · Nicotine Addiction discussions | Emotional & Mental Health center | SteadyHealth.com

Regardless, I decided to schedule a lung doctor for next week.

That's a good resource. Thanks!

 

[tim_man]

Thought I'd bump this thread since I too, since switching over to DIY, have been experiencing shortness of breath, exhaustion, abnormal heart rate, etc. First started noticing the SOB while doing things that normally wouldn't cause me to get winded, like going up 2 flights of stairs, carrying moderately heavy objects for short distances, etc. What really gets me concerned is I am in pretty good shape since I workout 4 times per week, and have been for as long as I can remember. Now, after (and during) a workout, I literally feel like I am about to go into cardiac arrest---seriously... I've never felt this way after a workout before, ever.. I kinda have a feeling it has to do with the high vg juice I've been making lately, so my plan over the next week or two is to vape pg-based juice only to see if it helps. If not, I'll try vg only for week. If that doesn't help, next on the list would be flavorless juice for an additional week. Last thing I try before giving up vaping completely--Dow OPTIM pharmaceutical grade VG and PG.

Man this is really bugging the ....... out of me.. Hope I can figure this out since I do love vaping...minus the side effects. I'll keep folks posted.

 

[salemgold]

Some points on what has been discussed:

- For some people, smoking suppresses asthma. When they stop smoking, whether they are vapers or not, the asthma comes back with a bang. This can confuse the issue mightily. It's a well-known effect because when you think about it, an asthma sufferer should be well and truly done in by smoking - but they're not.

- It is impossible for all liquids to be well-tolerated by all vapers. Ain't gonna happen. You have to test and trial, especially if you have a new breathing issue. Especially if you changed something recently. Flavourings are the big issue here, but not always the whole story.

- All PG is very similar as it is all synthetic. However the contaminant percentage content varies widely according to how much it costs, basically:
Industrial grade
Agricultural grade
Food grade
Pharmaceutical grade

Only pharma grade is suitable for inhalation, all other grades are guaranteed to contain contaminants in higher amounts. All it takes is for your e-liquid vendor to buy a cheap grade and there you go. Try another vendor with higher quality values.

- Although all PG mixes should essentially be the same, as PG is a synthetic product, the same is definitely not true of glycerines. They are made from so many different feedstocks, in so many different ways, that it can be guaranteed that someone will be intolerant to a variety that others find no problem to vape. The grade/cost issue is the same of course - you can't tell if they are using cheap rubbish or not, so try another brand. None of them post a full analysis of their finished retail product monthly, and there are good reasons for that. Cost of testing isn't really a factor for firms turning over hundreds of thousands of $$ a year (and certainly for those turning over millions a year, and there are many more of those than you think). There are other reasons, none of them valid in my mind. I just don't trust anyone who won't post an analysis, and that's all there is to it.

There are all sorts of issues with glycerine feedstock sources. Contamination, biodiesel byproduct glycerine getting into the chain, jatropha plant toxins getting in there, etc etc. Here's a story that might convince you:

I am a 100% glycerine vaper because at first I had issues with PG. That has receded now but I stick with glycerine because it works for me. I don't call it VG by the way because the finest quality of all now is synthetic glycerine like Dow's Optim, it is 100% synthetic and 100% pure, and also many pharma sources are changing their PG inhaler base over to that as they find it's a better choice. It's true that 3 years back, veg glycerine was the best choice as animal glycerine was the main alternative.

Anyway, I've tried lots of glycerines and most are OK for me. A while back, though, I got a new one to try. On day 2, I was having breathing issues. On day 3 breathing was becoming difficult. I stopped using that brand as it was obvious what the problem was. If I'd stayed with it, on day 4 I'd have been in hospital and in deep wotsit.

So there can be significant differences between glycerines. Yes Ecopure is safe, because it's expensive, because if they had any kind of user issue with it they would literally lose millions (it's complicated why, but they would).

I challenge anyone to show me something cheap and safe, and prove it with a 99.5% analysis by GC-MS and LC/LC and/or whatever else it takes to get to a 99.5% analysis including the water content. Strangely, you won't see many full tests on vendors' sites. None, at least for current analyses, as far as I know. Maybe because they are trying to sell you something 'cheap and safe'.

There ain't no such animal. Prove me wrong.

That is a great post, Roly. I have seen you talk about Dow Optim many times. Could you tell us where a DIYer might find that brand for sale retail? It gets very hard to sift through the info out there to find a good synthetic source that is available retail.
Thanks.

 

[rolygate]

As far as I know it is only available wholesale. However you could try getting in touch with Dow's sales dept and see what they say. It's possible you might be able to get a gallon as a sample, or something. Or persuade a vendor you know to buy a 45 gallon drum and start a new line of VG liquid marketed on its guaranteed 100% purity.

Quality always sells, and if you produce a high-quality/luxury product there are always buyers, even in a recession.

 

[salemgold]

As far as I know it is only available wholesale. However you could try getting in touch with Dow's sales dept and see what they say. It's possible you might be able to get a gallon as a sample, or something. Or persuade a vendor you know to buy a 45 gallon drum and start a new line of VG liquid marketed on its guaranteed 100% purity.

Quality always sells, and if you produce a high-quality/luxury product there are always buyers, even in a recession.

So true. I was actually just thinking of doing a request of my favorite nicotine vendor because it would take me a very long time to use a 55 gallon drum. Thanks!

 

[SloHand]

So true. I was actually just thinking of doing a request of my favorite nicotine vendor because it would take me a very long time to use a 55 gallon drum. Thanks!

Univar is the exclusive distributor of Optim here in Canada and the US. There smallest quantity is a 260 liter drum The Univar folks were nice enough to refer me to yet another 'reseller' but their smallest amount is 18 liters. You may have better luck in the US finding a smaller and smaller reseller

 

[rolygate]

That's a 4-gallon container, I think. This is easily small enough for a vendor to use.

 

[moonlight]

Excellent post, rolygate!



When I was very young, I had severe asthma. It was so bad that my parents were seriously thinking of relocating from the Chicago area to Arizona or New Mexico. When I was five years old (in 1953), my father's company transferred him to Genoa, Italy, to consult with Olivetti on setting up a typewriter factory. When there, the American Consulate found us a family doctor, a kindly avuncular sort who was pushing seventy, so his medical training occurred around the turn of the 20th century. He instantly diagnosed me as asthmatic, then he took five-year-old me into his office and taught me how to smoke a cigarette. Needless to say, my parents were both aghast when they found out. But in post-War Italy, apparently prescribing cigarettes was the first thing a doctor tried on a patient to get severe asthma under control. I don't remember all that much about our year-long sojourn in Genoa, but I do remember that I felt really decent for several days -- no breathing problems, no cough, no gasping or wheezing. Then, over months of living in what seemed to Americans to be a filthy city, my asthma gradually lessed, probably from the workout my immune system got in Genoa. Since then, I just have had to not strenously exercise in the cold and I've been mostly okay. Mo meds, no inhaler.

Long before both my parents died, I did verify with each separately that this actually occurred and wasn't a figment of my imagination.

And every time I tried to quit cigarettes during adulthood, a week to ten days after the quit date, my asthma would return. But not when I started to vape. Yes, I had "quitter's flu." But if you've had asthma, it's easy to tell the one from the other.

I found this story fascinating! Thanks

 

[tim_man]

Well, I tried practically everything - cut out PG completely, cut out VG, lowered flavoring, no flavoring, switched vendors, nothing helped. Only other option ---quit vaping completely---which I did about a week and a half ago (no analogs either). I still get tired/winded easily, but symptoms seem to be less now. I am still not 100%, but getting better for sure. Hopefully sob symptoms will subside over time. Something about vaping definitely screwed up my lungs, this I know for certain. Whether this is an isolated incident, I don't know...

BTW, going cold turkey was easier than I thought. A couple of days of anxiety and then I was free.

 

[SloHand]

Hey tim_man, sorry to hear all that, although quitting it all is not a bad thing at all. Curious though about your problem and how similar it sounds to a problem that a local vapor here had.

Not sure what your vaping style was but he started getting into RBA's and was using a VV device. His problem was vaping at way too high a voltage, with coils way too loose on the wick, and a wick that was way too tight ..... all this resulted in him vaping red hot dry coils all the time, resulting in 'burning' out his lungs. All those problems were taken care of but it did take him quite some time to get rid of that raw burnt feeling.

 

[tim_man]

I was using RBAs but mainly at low voltage. I never got dry/burning hits with my setup, so I think my situation is a bit different than the local vaper you mention. Anyway, lungs are feeling even better today... I'll report back in a couple of weeks. Hope I'll be able to get 100% back to normal.

 

[AzrielProne]

I too have a shortness of breath currently. I have only been vaping for about 4 weeks. I have seen a doctor about my Shortness of Breath, Light-Headedness and Tingling in Fingers. All my results were just fine and normal. So I too have been wondering about this.

I have tried PG, PG/VG and Straight VG liquids and it all seems to do the same. Mainly it is a tightness in my chest which make me feel like I have to breath deeper than I really do. I was checked for Panic Attacks and it was not that either.

I dont think its my Nicotine Level, as I am at 18mg and I was a pack and a half a day smoker of American Spirits before.

So if anyone has any info or has the same experience and has advise please do let me know. Thanks!

 

[JimSmith94]

I started vaping this past January after being off tobacco cigarettes for four years. I had shortness of breath too, but as of maybe a couple weeks ago, it seems to have gone away. I'm very happy about that as now I'm addicted to vaping!

 

[puchox]

I've been vaping for a month, i feel better than before. I play football with friends on the weekend(the real one, not hand egg ) and while i know there is some placebo effect i have more stamina and don't get as exhausted as before.

 

[jamie]

I dont think its my Nicotine Level, as I am at 18mg and I was a pack and a half a day smoker of American Spirits before.

There is no correlation known between ones former smoking habit and their comfortable ecigarette nicotine level. There is no translation table that allows you or anyone else to make that assumption, so please don't.

Anyone who has uncomfortable symptoms that seem related to vaping should be lowering their nicotine level (to zero if necessary) as part of their problem solving.

 

[SuperLuckyLady]

Just found this thread - I have been vaping for 2-3 years now, and have COPD. I get shortness of breath in many different situations - air pollution, paint fumes, cutting onions etc, etc, etc. My doctor is delighted that I am now a vaper instead of a smoker.

In general, my lungs are MUCH better than when I smoked, but I have had two sustained periods of breathlessness that I can attribute to vaping. By this, I mean not only that when I stop using the relevant item my breathlessness goes away, but that if I use it again, the breathlessness comes back almost right away.

The first incident was due to a particular brand of cartomiser. I won't name it as many others have used the same thing without problems. To be safe, however, I no longer use cartos and have had no problems with clearomisers.

The second, more recent, incident was due to my switching to a variable voltage/wattage mod. Oh, how I loved it - great hits and flavor! I kept it around 3.6V, but what an improvement over my Egos! Unfortunately, I also began to develop a cough, breathing became more and more difficult, and I has a lot of fluid in my lungs. Finally went back to my trusty Egos, and all the symptoms gradually went away. A couple of days ago I tried using the mod again, and was stricken before the end of the day. I guess my lungs just can't take those great hits.

Damn!

 

[cags]

......
The second, more recent, incident was due to my switching to a variable voltage/wattage mod. Oh, how I loved it - great hits and flavor! I kept it around 3.6V, but what an improvement over my Egos! Unfortunately, I also began to develop a cough, breathing became more and more difficult, and I has a lot of fluid in my lungs. Finally went back to my trusty Egos, and all the symptoms gradually went away. A couple of days ago I tried using the mod again, and was stricken before the end of the day. I guess my lungs just can't take those great hits.

Damn!

that is interesting. I've been wondering for a long time if the higher volt devices were causing some people's health issues, but I"m too lazy to do the research.

 

[SuperLuckyLady]

Yeah, me too. I'm curious if anyone with less damaged lungs has felt the same effects.

I do notice that the wimpier vapor from the egos mainly stays in my mouth and throat - mot much is getting to my lungs. I still get the nicotine hit though. This may have a lot to do with it.

I also notice that I went through quite a bit more juice with the mod, even at lower ego-type voltages. Makes sense - bigger hits = more juice. This may also be a contributing factor. I mean, we have to admit that anything going into your lungs except for clean air is probably not good. We are talking about harm reduction, not harm elimination, right?

 

[SloHand]

There are soo many variables in your 'issue'. Is it just carto's that your vaping? I know that cranking an RBA at 15+ watts with a sub or near sub ohm coil can produce a pretty hot vape. You may not notice it at first but after a while it gets to your lungs. Also the draw affects to sensations .... loose draws make me choke after a while. Another possible factor with RBA's is not having the air hole lined up properly, this can also be very harsh .... hot spots on coils .... dry hits .... in carto's, burnt coils/wicks, dry spots, coils touching filler material .....

 

[fatherdano]

asthma is a sympton of acid reflux, you could be ingesting to much ejuice.

just a thought, I was having similar issues. MMinus the copd.