Can we stop recommending RBA's and mechs to beginners please?

[zahzoo]

I still remember how confusing everything was at the beginning. So much jargon and acronyms and just generally new concepts. I'm a techie and gadget freak, so I think I caught on fairly quickly, but still there's a lot to learn all at once. I can barely imagine how intimidating the whole scene is for those who are not technically inclined.

( nice to be back home and on a real computer again! )

^^This^^

The jargon, acronyms and "pet" names people throw around can be very confusing for anyone new to all this. I recall when I came into this realm almost 2 years ago just getting familiar with terms like atomizer or cartomizer... then clearomizers, then glassomizers which quickly morphed into atty's, carto's, clearo's...

I'd read posts like " I only use this atty on my nemie" and I started wondering if I'm attending a 3 year old's tea party where every other word has to have that "ie" sound added to it.

For this reason when I venture into the New User's forum I force myself many times to use the full proper name for things followed by it's known acronym in parentheses... like Atomizer (Atty). I find that approach helpful... I'm sure other would too.

 

[HecticEnergy]

I agree that cigalikes work for some. However, In my experience success stories from those seem to be few and far between.
In my personal experience, it was "good" for about a month but when push came to shove I needed something more.
I have family members who had a similar experience, only they just went back to smoking.
Most on this forum have seemed to have a similar experience, at the end of the day it just want enough - anemic vapor production, short battery life,small selection of flavors.
I know they work for some, but I don't recommend them because they don't seem to work for most.

My suggestions to new vapers is to give them a reliable vape that they will be happy with for a while so they don't have to follow my progression of cigalike to ego to APV. I also don't want to overwhelm them with everything that is available with these advanced mods.

That's why I do it...


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[DoomiteAsh]

I started vaping in May, after hearing ads for a new B&M here in town. Right off the bat, I told the people there that I had no vaping experience and was just curious to try it out. Luckily, these guys weren't out to make a fast buck by pushing a mech mod/RBA to a newbie. They let me try a bunch of their juice, getting a feel for the act of vaping. The more I tried, the better I liked it. I ended up getting an ego-type VV battery and a Kanger T3S clearo, along with some basic instructions on how to fill the tank, charge the battery, ETC. I walked out of there that day with a good starting point for a new hobby, and again, I wasn't pressured to buy a mech mod and risk blowing my hand off.

My point is that there ARE good places for a noob to get their feet wet vaping. I'm lucky that the first dedicated vape shop I went to was one of those places. Now, thanks to some research from here and on YouTube, I've got an MVP and a respect for what can happen if people who don't know what they're doing dive in head first into potentially dangerous waters. Just my

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[Shootist]

I agree with the OP as long as we define beginner a someone who jumps into mechs head first and asks questions later. There are people who have been vaping for years that are beginners in my book. The key to being safe is to know your equipment and Ohm's law and not ask it to do more than it can. Most of this is not very complicated and it really can be picked up pretty quickly. ECF is a great place to learn.

Just fyi i have been vaping for 5 months and got my first mech and dripper after a month or so

The OP is saying he sees older more experienced vapers suggesting to brand new vapers that they get a Mech Mod and a RDA to start with.

Although I do come to this site a lot and sometimes visit the New Members forum I personally haven't seen many of those type responses but I have seen a few.

Not sure why these establish members are suggesting that to newer people. I have been vaping for 5 months and will never buy a Mech and more than likely never buy a RDA. I've thought about getting a RDA a few times and then said What For. I like what I'm using, I've already spent way to much money on the stuff I have, I have no need or desire to constantly drip liquid into something just to get a Vape to stay off cigarettes, the vapor I get from the tank systems I use is fine with me. As to the vapor production I get from my tank systems I sometimes I think it is to much for where I am and what I'm doing.

 

[tj99959]

It's kind of a double edged sward tho'. While we need to keep things simple at first, we also have to push them into learning more. If we try to keep things to simple, they will probably end up smoking again. It's easy to tell someone to get an ego and a box of cartomizers, but what did we teach them by doing so? What we do have to keep in mind is that learning is a process .... not an event.

Remember those "101" classes in school? Spending a month teaching them the difference between a carto & a clearo would make for a very dull world. Well, I remember all to well spending half of a semester learning the difference between a bell crank, lever, and a cam, all of which do the same thing ... just in a different way. Can I say ........ BORING ! ! !

 

[CabinetGuyScott]

^^This^^

The jargon, acronyms and "pet" names people throw around can be very confusing for anyone new to all this. I recall when I came into this realm almost 2 years ago just getting familiar with terms like atomizer or cartomizer... then clearomizers, then glassomizers which quickly morphed into atty's, carto's, clearo's...

I'd read posts like " I only use this atty on my nemie" and I started wondering if I'm attending a 3 year old's tea party where every other word has to have that "ie" sound added to it.

For this reason when I venture into the New User's forum I force myself many times to use the full proper name for things followed by it's known acronym in parentheses... like Atomizer (Atty). I find that approach helpful... I'm sure other would too.

Very sound advice for everyone who gives of their time in the New Members forum!

We can relate to the confusion and frustration from the deluge of information that new-comers to this vaping world experience. Remember how your confusion meter was hitting the red-zone all the time?

Always always try and use Zahzoo's recommendations when helping the new folks out. That alone will be a great way to further support their learning and adoption of the terms and acronyms.

That and the pearls of wisdom you're sharing are invaluable!

To the OP: YES!

1) Read the question being posed and respond to it
2) Keep it "real", and appropriate to the user's level of knowledge, experience and goals

Great thread here...

 

[KenD]

I tried a cheap cigalike as my venture into vaping. Hated it, and thought that this isn't for me. Took me about a year before I tried a basic Ego with a ce4, as recommended by my cousin, and I was hooked. Basic Egos and an Evod (or some other basic clearo) is what I recommend to people who want to try vaping. Fairly affordable, and generally a better experience than cigalikes.

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[inswva]

I tried a cheap cigalike as my venture into vaping. Hated it, and thought that this isn't for me. Took me about a year before I tried a basic Ego with a ce4, as recommended by my cousin, and I was hooked. Basic Egos and an Evod (or some other basic clearo) is what I recommend to people who want to try vaping. Fairly affordable, and generally a better experience than cigalikes.

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Pretty much same story here. Before I was aware of the myriad of offerings in the vaping market, I tried a few Njoy cig-a-likes. They tasted like hot garbage and didn't do a thing for me. Figured I'd just keep smoking cigarettes... until a buddy of mine showed me his eGo type battery. Bought my VV eGo style starter kit 23 days ago and haven't touched a cigarette since.

I'm also prone to "hobby creep" by nature. When I get into something I tend to obsessively read everything I can get my hands on regarding the new venture. Thanks to ECF, I've now done enough research that I'm intimately familiar with all the terminology, technology, and safey practices relative to all modes of vaping. I'm 100% confident now in my ability to build coils and run an unregulated mech safely, should I choose to do so. I'm a bit more interested in the plethora of emerging high power regulated devices and plan to order one shortly. I'll be jumping from my VV eGo units straight into a high power regulated mod and RBAs.

I understand not everyone has the inclination to turn vaping into a full blown hobby and are perfectly content with more basic devices. However, not all newbs are incapable of diving into the deep end fairly quickly. I've only been vaping for 23 days and 23 days ago I didn't understand or recognize any of the terminology commonly used in the vaping world. I've now got healthy understanding of coil building, Ohm's law, battery safety, etc.

With all of that said, I do believe any recommendations of advanced kit to new vapers should at least include links to the excellent blogs some of the members here have penned - notably Baditude and State O' Flux. A bit of reading and research goes a long way.

 

[HecticEnergy]

Like I said, I think the best starter kit is an mvp with a protank or nautilus bvc. The mvp should last most people a long time, and give a great experience. Some people enjoy egos for years. I some like the cigalikes. To each their own, but by and large people on ecf eventually evolve to apvs... And rather quickly (probably a case of ooh! shiny!) the mvp should give most that mod experience with a low price tag and low learning curve. Plus they seem to be good quality, so it's a great value.
More on point: adding rebuildable to the plethora of devices they already have to weed through just adds time and frustration to that initial jump. If it was easy, they wouldn't be posting "what do I need to get" In the forum. I think most are can be satisfied with mvp.

 

[suspectK]

Figure out form factor, budget, capacity needs, technical ability, and other things my overheated brain can't think of before recommendations, and drop a vendor(s) for liquid, that you know works well with that gear.

It's hard not to just recommend the itaste vv 3.0 or MVP 2..I remember how amazed I was when the MVP 1 came out. But I've had a MVP get run over, and it is still working for a friend, about 9months after becoming one with a tire.

With the tech out today, it's kinda hard to find someone that can't pick up and run with the itaste stuff, reminding them to set to (real)power, and I like to add cartomizer tanks. Fill up a clearo's. Watch a video or read bad's blogs for carto priming...or even a kayfun..

But.. we'll still see people posting bs that don't make no sense.

I got burnt out saying the same things over and over again.. if I'm bored at work, I'll answer new threads that have been covered...but our search engine needs to work properly.

 

[tj99959]

I don't know if y'all have noticed, because of things like this lately, we have a new sub for New Vapers :

Simple Solutions





http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-beginners-ask-your-basic-questions-here.html



http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...591336-members-how-answer-questions-here.html

What I've noticed so far in "Simple Solutions" is that folks ask a question, and then run off ... never to be heard from again.

That sub-forum will loose it's appeal real fast if that continues.

 

[classwife]

What I've noticed so far in "Simple Solutions" is that folks ask a question, and then run off ... never to be heard from again.

That sub-forum will loose it's appeal real fast if that continues.

shrug...it's new still. Not many of our great helpers know it's there yet

bidget seems to be receiving wonderful assistance :
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...ew-forum-have-few-questions.html#post13892199


But, it's there and I hope it makes a difference for helping beginners

 

[AzPlumber]

What I've noticed so far in "Simple Solutions" is that folks ask a question, and then run off ... never to be heard from again.

That sub-forum will loose it's appeal real fast if that continues.

I've seen this happen throughout the forum. The one place they tend to stick around more is the new member area, I suspect because they are trying to reach their new member posts milestones.

 

[tayone415]

shrug...it's new still. Not many of our great helpers know it's there yet

bidget seems to be receiving wonderful assistance :
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...ew-forum-have-few-questions.html#post13892199


But, it's there and I hope it makes a difference for helping beginners

I just learned about that sub forum yesterday, and I did post in that thread too...lol!

My question is what or how is that better than posting in the regular new members forum?

 

[Lord Cardigan]

I'd like to point out that, despite the whole recommending mods thing, if I didn't get into dripping on an I go with my MVP I doubt I'd have become smoke free. For me the whole rebuild thing allowed me to obsess and get off analogs completely.

 

[ClippinWings]

Perusing the new member forum with people asking for help, it's quite often someone will recommend a Nemesis and a Kayfun to someone fresh at vaping. Like c'mon.

Mechs aren't meant for beginners. RBA's aren't meant for beginners.

Good regulated mod + clearomizer with replaceable coils seems the only viable starting point for someone flying solo. It's not a race, it's a marathon. Gotta compose yourself in the start and understand the journey before you jump to the end sprint :/

$0.2

Call me old school but:

ego/Clearo
18650 regulated/clearo
Mech/RDA

In that order

Real old school and you start at a 510 with blue aquarium foam stuffed in the cart ... But no one need be subjected to that crap anymore. LOL

 

[Kbennett65]

Great thread! I definitely get the point OP is getting at, too many threads in the new members forum from folks who are absolutely clueless and admittedly so getting tons of advice to buy a kayfun...no, buy a Russian 91, it's way better! ...buy an RDA and start dripping, it's the only way to go! [never mind the poor OP has no idea what an RDA is yet]...buy a ProVari..no, get a Reo! I'm sure you get my point. I'm sure by the time that poor OP gets through all the responses their head is spinning!
On the other hand, if it wasn't for some of those responses I might still be using basic starter equipment and not enjoying vaping nearly as much as I am. Thankfully even in those threads full of confusing and conflicting advice there does seem to be at least one or two responses from vets that chime in with actual good advice, so thanks!!!

 

[ClippinWings]

I don't know if y'all have noticed, because of things like this lately, we have a new sub for New Vapers :

Simple Solutions




http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-beginners-ask-your-basic-questions-here.html



http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...591336-members-how-answer-questions-here.html

Should probably just be the policy applied to the new member forum

 

[The Torch]

Perusing the new member forum with people asking for help, it's quite often someone will recommend a Nemesis and a Kayfun to someone fresh at vaping. Like c'mon.

Mechs aren't meant for beginners. RBA's aren't meant for beginners.

Good regulated mod + clearomizer with replaceable coils seems the only viable starting point for someone flying solo. It's not a race, it's a marathon. Gotta compose yourself in the start and understand the journey before you jump to the end sprint :/

$0.2

I didn't bother reading any replies to this, but I agree 100%. Getting a mod and using it with your first tank already makes a big enough difference (why is it I always feel I'm the only one to remember how it felt?). Rebuilding can seem like such a big step, it is better to let people become interested in it first. We are all free to love out setup, but why do most people feel necessary to push it like it is the only viable setup (and this is coming from a guy who went from an eGo twist to a Provari and Russian 91% within one month of quitting analogs BTW)

 

[Nana Gail]

Hi , I'm a newby (4.5 months) but I did alot of reserch before I ever bought my first kit (ego1100 with CE4 clearo, USB charger and needle bottle) but I am 58 yrs old and have alittle horse sense. What I notice on the forum is that the 5 post requirement may not be enough for newbys maybe keeping them in the begginers forum alittle longer will make them read more threads on the basics of Vaping and equipment,juices and safety issues with the process. Everyone wants to jump in with the BIG BOYS and talk about the big guns in particular the younger males. Testosterone being what it is you can't stop them from trying to jump off the roof and fly but you can slow them down. Maybe a 10 post threshold would curb the dash to the top of the heep alittle and cause them to learn more, even if it's by osmosis(from hanging around the baby pool)