PLEASE stop recommending RBAs and RDAs to beginners in the Newbie Forum

[Train2]

The trick, I think, is to read their question carefully, and/or get some more information about the noob's needs before recommending whatever you happen to think is "the best".

Some people will dive right in to wrapping coils and a mech.
MORE people probably should start out with an Ego or an MVP and a ProTank.

They usually can tell you what they'll be comfortable with - the trouble is when someone says they want something SIMPLE, they don't know an atomizer from a battery, and they've got $50. Someone will still recommend that person get a ProVari and a kayfun.

 

[espkh123]

I usually recommend a kanger evod set (a single set can run 15 dollars)
Some vapers dont stay very long and there is nothing to be done with that.

Also, new people can use mechs with RBA RDA's as long as they have the willingness to learn.

Teach these lessons to them:
-battery safety
-proper storage
-what kind of stuff they need (aka multimeters)
-what mech suits them
-what battery suits them
-etc..

Once they understand this and learn how to rebuild coils and understand the laws of sub-ohming they will be fine.

............

But for someone asking the general question
"What vape should I get"
Don't steer them to mechs.
If in a week (like me) they understand everything about it and have been vaping on regulated devices, then why not?

 

[Train2]

LOL - shoulda kept reading before I posted almost exactly the same thing.
Sorry for my nearly identical post!

It's about appropriateness, finding out what someone is capable of. Asking questions and actually listening to the answers. Too often someone posts telling people they have $50 and severe arthritis and people jump in to recommend a Provari and an RBA to build coils on.

 

[therealmuffinman]

You just described me to a tee and i can still build a coil without getting distracted by something shiny.

If you can build coils to different resistances and know how to tweak your rda, then you have more attention span than half of my generation, and even more so than the 2000's kids. Whats scary is to see all of my friends from college and see that alot of them are getting married and having kids... Knowing the parents, im scared to see how the kids will wind up.

 

[espkh123]

If you can build coils to different resistances and know how to tweak your rda, then you have more attention span than half of my generation, and even more so than the 2000's kids. Whats scary is to see all of my friends from college and see that alot of them are getting married and having kids... Knowing the parents, im scared to see how the kids will wind up.

That is very true, I am 18 and learned all that in a week.

 

[nobreak1970]

Just address, with common sense mind you, the question posed by the new vaper.

 

[emus]

I don't mind recommending a hot spring or fused mod w/ proper vents and batt to a newbie.
If they have dexterity and mechanical aptitude I'd like to recommend a small chamber rebuildable set up like my best.
Factory built toppers often produce lower quality/quantity vapor.

 

[amoret]

I think that the OP had a very good point. When I decided to try vaping I was lucky enough to find ECF before I bought anything, since it kept popping up in Google searches. I was also "lucky" enough to have serious hand problems, which meant that I had to ask some very specific questions about what to start with. (And I got generally great advice.)

That said, it can be very discouraging to first go through the new members forum. There are days where someone who was new could easily get the impression that unless they wanted to and were able to rebuild coils, they wouldn't be able to have a good experience with vaping. They could also get the impression that there is something inferior about not jumping right into mechanical mods.

I would like to really emphasize the idea of trying to clarify what the new person is asking. It is very confusing when you're starting out, and it can be hard to even know what to ask. There are a lot of new concepts and terms to figure out. It might help to have a sticky with links to the glossary and to the basic articles in the library (though those aren't necessarily that clear and up to date) for newbies to read.

I know that people are trying to be helpful, and I think that I can speak for most of the new members when I say that we're really grateful for the help, but it is hard to even know where and how to look for information at first. I'm still pretty new at this, and I keep learning. I also do try to add to discussions when I can. I think that it is great that there are this many people who are willing to help out but I do think that it is important to try to remember that not everyone is ready to dive into the deep end.

 

[Bosco]

I looked, "IMR battery venting", "Intentional IMR Battery Venting Vent". Didnt find it, link please?

Please sir, I would like some more

And thank you for the informative post. While I keep reading everything I can find about battery safety in relation to PV's the perpetually paranoid part of me still feels there are gaps. I know I am safe in my operating ranges, but I yearn to know more.

short circuit:
Callies Kustoms IMR Battery and AW short circuit observations - YouTube

overcharging (gotta watch out for overcharging!):
Lithium Ion Battery Explosion - YouTube

hit with hammer:
Two batteries Li-ion 18650 and hammer -simulation of crushing and hitting. Explode test (lithium) - YouTube

bunch of batteries in plastic drum heated to 500 C (gotta love youtube)
Chain reaction of Li-ion batteries at thermal runaway, packed with Vermiculite - YouTube

 

[Funk Dracula]

*edit* actually I just realized the day and age in which we live in... where ...... who desire instant gratification and have ridiculously short attention spans are the majority.... I completely take back my previous statement...

Everything in excess, always.... I want the best. I want it now. I want it at the best price.

SQUIRREL!

 

[WattWick]

(...)
I still want to see the guy'who posted in this thread, his Grandma rebuild a kayfun!

I'm more interested (hang on, let me blow a cloud in your face) in seeing a grandma (camera cut) endure a whole (hooold it, cloud in face / camera cut) episode (camera cut) of RiP Tripper.

 

[BillyWJ]

I'm more interested (hang on, let me blow a cloud in your face) in seeing a grandma (camera cut) endure a whole (hooold it, cloud in face / camera cut) episode (camera cut) of RiP Tripper.

WOOO DOGGY GRANDMA!

LOL, thanks for the laugh. And thanks to everyone for their thoughtful replies. There's been a process to this for me, its started out with the ebook chatter I was involved with, writing a "Ecigs for Dummies" ebook, which led to me watching the newbie forum for a casual "what are the most asked questions" survey, and noticing that A. newbies are DROWNED in helpfulness and advice from everyone posting their favorite gear (it's a good thing, but, poor overwhelmed newbies!) (Which i think indicates a blog might be better than an ebook), which led to noticing the B. the "Just get a Kayfun and a Magneto and fill that bad boy up with juice and vape all day!" responses to people asking where to get started, who haven't bought anything yet.

I think enough get it, and I think I made my point.

 

[rodsky77]

I really don't see someone who wants to start vaping to even want to try an RBA/RDA.
Anyone who smokes wants to be able to do it as easily as just buying a pack of smokes.
RBAs, mechs and more expensive PVs are for those who have decided that they need something better because that ego and that ProTank are really starting to be annoying. But then, everyone is different, and it's the responsibility of the more experienced vapers to ask the newb what he/she is looking for and provide them with the right suggestions

 

[Deviate3s]

I'm two weeks into vaping myself and have a couple RDAs coming in the mail. Like rodsky said above me, the ProTank thing is getting obnoxious for multiple reasons.

I'd like to think I've got a bit of a leg-up on most, though. In my spare time I do a lot of wiring on project guitars and effects pedals. I'm comfortable with circuits. My roommate is a 12v auto electrician and has been a good source of info for me over the years. And above all else, I've got a healthy respect for what can happen when things go wrong.

A few years ago I had a car battery in an old '67 Dodge truck explode in my face when something shorted on the trailer ride home. Hooked up the battery in this guy's field and the truck sounded like it was just about to fire over. Disconnected the battery and trailered it home. I unloaded it from the trailer, hooked the battery back up and BOOM! Not a fun experience. That was about 13 years ago and my hearing is still screwed up. Had my friend not been there to hose my blind/deaf ... down, it probably would have been a lot worse.

I have zero intent on getting into the 0.0000001 Ohm cloud-chasing thing or making ridiculous coils out of bailing wire. Not that I have anything against anyone that wants to go that route, but it's not what I'm after.

 

[Foodacris]

Dang this thread got heated fast.

I know a lot of people recommend RBAs not just because they like them themselves, but because if somebody is willing to learn how to use one, then they will most likely enjoy it more. Let's be honest, the coil heads coming from Kanger, Aspire, and Innokin are not anywhere near as consistent as the old EVOD/PT1 heads were when they first came out (my opinion). If a new vaper gets a crappy head and doesn't like the hit, they're more likely to quit vaping. With an RBA or RDA however, if not built horribly on a complicated device, you'll get the same vape every single time.

I do see your point though. I wouldn't recommend an RBA to a noobie unless I knew them, was there to help them, and believed that they held the mental capacity to learn 6th grade level electricity basics (less common than some might think). However, when it's becoming more and more rare to find cheap clearos that are anywhere near as reliable as a simple Igo-L, I can understand why some people may want to jump start a new user's knowledge level early.

I will say however that recommending a mech to a new user is awful advice. Rebuildables work perfectly fine on protected and regulated mods and are even preferable to a lot of veterans. But honestly, any idiot can wrap wire around a drill bit and put it on an atty. Whether or not that's something they're interested in doing is an entirely different story, but give people a little credit. I wasn't stupid before I started vaping, you know?

 

[WattWick]

Some people are hobbyists/tinkerers by nature. However, this is not the kind of person who makes a "I am so confused, where do I start"-thread in the New Members Forum.

What I believe most new vapers want, is a point of reference. Something to get a hands-on experience with so they can start to make heads and tails or vaping. Or atties and batteries, if you will. If it's not to their liking, they should now be able to have a better understanding of what questions to ask to get closer to what they really want. Yes, it may seem a bit wasteful, but in the long run, if someone really wants to quit them ciggies, that's what it takes. Hopefully, vaping will soon evolve to a level where there are several definite success setups that aren't riddled with hit'n miss heads and such. Until then... there will be some trial and error for all of us.

That's where I started out. With "something" (In my case, an eGo battery and a couple of CE4 clearos). Because I could stare at a screen and read all I wanted, but I knew none of it would really make much sense until I actually got some hands-on experience; being able to pick it apart and poke and prod a little to see what was going on.

 

[Myrany]

I'm more interested (hang on, let me blow a cloud in your face) in seeing a grandma (camera cut) endure a whole (hooold it, cloud in face / camera cut) episode (camera cut) of RiP Tripper.

Some of us ARE little old ladies and do watch rip tripper videos and rebuild kayfuns.

/me takes a puff on her REO and blows a big could before flipping her mostly grey hair and flouncing out

 

[tsunami987]

Vaping is, for the most part, complicated. I started 2-3 years ago with a single ego batt, a 3 ohm atty, and carts. Annoyed with the lack of vapor and the speed at which atties gunked up, I jumped from one "best thing ever" to the other. I spent a decent amount of money, finally getting a provari and sticking with carto tanks and bridgeless atties for a bit. I've been off and on as a smoker for a good bit of the time since then. Fast forward to the most recent christmas... I bought a smok e-pipe and an igo-w. Knowing how it worked, more or less, I looked up the battery stats for 18350s, realized they wouldn't cut it, and bought some extensions and a couple of 30 amp 18650s. The day they all came in is the last day I smoked. It hasn't been that long, but it's longer than I've gone in nearly three years. I now have an actual mech on the way and can't wait until it does. As a chain smoker, sub-ohm and coil building in general really helped me quit, but I've stumbled a lot over the years and had the experience to back it up once I started building.

One of the best things you can tell someone new is that there is no cure for the common smoker. Everyone has their thing that really helps them quit. They also all have their favorite stuff, and everyone thinks that what worked for them will work for everyone else. For me, it was having a nano-coiled optimus on my provari and a crappy semi-mech with an igo for time spent idle at home, which is where I smoked the most.

In the vaping world, a new fad surfaces every few weeks. The best thing you can do is give somebody a couple options to look into and hope for the best.

 

[spookyluke]

But they're better. I recommend rba's if someone is asking. I got my dad t switch to vaping. But I got my dad a protank because he doesn't want a hobby. He just wants something that works. My dad is crafty. He could build a coil. But he doesn't want to. I get him to try my diver and my R91. But he just doesn't care. He's perfectly happy with his vape experience using a protank2.

 

[rob33]

Vid please.

Chimney Micro Coil Build In A Kayfun Lite - YouTube
She's POed cause she didn't win the fazed box