Can We Stop Recommending the Subtank/Atlantis to New Vapers Please? IT'S NOTHING LIKE A CIGARETTE

[AndriaD]

maybe we should recomend the subtanks minis now. I do agree that a wide airy lung hit vape would have not pleased me when i first tried vaping. I still dislike it as of this day. When I first started Ecigds i wanted something like a cigalike, but as soon as i got one i wanted to puff on it constantly and the battery just kept running out, maybe its just me but i doubt there are any cigalikes that will keep most heavy smokers happy, unless they buy like 10 of em and keep em in rotation lol.

I agree; I started with an eRoll, and it got me to the point of quitting, but it was so dang annoying with those .4ml tanks and short-lived batteries; if I hadn't gotten an iTaste vv3 and kanger T3S the first day I actually didn't smoke all day, I dunno if I could have maintained. But everyone has their own individual ideas of what they think they need, so whatever works, right? I thought the size and shape would be important, turned out to not be nearly as important as great hits with great TH, a battery that delivered the same hit every time until it needed recharging, and convenience in both battery life and tank capacity. I get all that with 5 vw mods and 2 mechs that both have a Kick, 3 kayfuns, and my new magma -- but a newbie has to work up to that point, you can't just start right out knowing everything about vaping, and what you really need in order to abstain from smoking -- you have to work out all the different variables. But you gotta start somewhere, and if nothing else, a cigalike is, at the very least, "proof of concept" -- this stuff can work!

Andria

 

[DavidAmonettNashville]

I just did exactly what you suggested and cranked it down to a single hole. I ALSO turned the wattage on my mod down to 10 watts. It vaped fine. And by fine, I mean vastly superior to a protank, or god forbid anything with a CE at the beginning of it. I stand by my statement that there is absolutely no reason a newbie should have to suffer with crappy hardware. There's no reason a newb should have start with an EGO battery either, for that matter. For the price of a starter kit at most B&M's, they could get something that most vapoers would be far happier with in the short AND long runs. We went through all of the trial and error so that they don't have to.

I stand by my statement that an Istick or mvp with a nautilus mini atop is a Great newbie set up.... And for the record I never advocated "Crappy hardware"

 

[renacer]

I've been seeing this more and more. "Oh get a Subtank, it has such great flavor!"
A newly ex-smoker doesn't want a Subtank. They want to emulate a cigarette. Even with the airflow turned down to a quarter of one hole on my Subtank it's still waaaay more airy than I wanted when I started vaping. I've come to find that the Atlantis/Subtank are basically worthless if you aren't lung inhaling. Most smokers don't lung inhale, ergo most recently quit smokers won't either.

Sure these new cloudomizers (see what I did there? I want credit for that) are cool and lots of fun, but the great majority of people coming blindly into vaping will not be interested in them. Had you handed me a Subtank when I started vaping I would have found it unusable, not just because of wattage issues but because of the airflow.

Just something to consider when giving out advice, solicited or otherwise.

Are you saying most smokers don't lung inhale when vaping or don't lung inhale cigarettes? Cause lung inhales is how all smokers do cigarettes.

 

[TheJakeBailey]

I stand by my statement that an Istick or mvp with a nautilus mini atop is a Great newbie set up.... And for the record I never advocated "Crappy hardware"

And I agree with YOU. A Nautilus and a an MVP is a GREAT starter setup. Also vastly superior to what most of us started with. I am running my subtank on my MVP3 right now, as a matter of fact.

 

[Coldrake]

Are you saying most smokers don't lung inhale when vaping or don't lung inhale cigarettes?

I would say yes. I never even heard of lung inhaling until I started vaping.

Cause lung inhales is how all smokers do cigarettes.

I don't think you are understanding the difference between lung inhaling and mouth to lung inhaling.

 

[medic181075]

For the record, I have had three people ask me for advice. Two being smokers and another being a reformed smoker who wants her husband to quit. My suggestion to all of them has been any traditional EVOD (no dual coils) style setup. I also suggested making sure they get two batteries. I think early on, even VV/VW can cause confusion. Keep it as simple as possible to start out. I know one guy who has been happily sucking on an EVOD for almost 2 years. He was part of my decision to consider using e-cigarettes to stop smoking.

 

[DavidAmonettNashville]

And I agree with YOU. A Nautilus and a an MVP is a GREAT starter setup. Also vastly superior to what most of us started with. I am running my subtank on my MVP3 right now, as a matter of fact.

On a side note and a bit off topic....What is your overall impression of the MVP3 ? Best feature? Worst ? I really want one as my Vape Apocalypse fall-back device. My Mvp2 has NEVER let me down..neither has my VTR.

 

[Rossum]

definitely must gauge a persons priorities here since we can't let them try our gear.

tough to tell whether a person needs to mimic a tight draw, throat hit, mouth full of texture or to breathe easier on their inhale... especially when they're guessing at best... and over the interwebz to boot.

for me, i tried...
a friends cigalike... no bueno... i chained smoked a few cigs after chain vaping to dry hits.
a friends ego... ditto...
regulated w/protank... too tight with anemic vapor... and too finicky... i smoked a lot before switching, but i made this work... i was far from pleasant to be around, though
TCC... hated it...
single coil dripper... kept plugging at this one... getting closer... getting closer...
every other category on the market at the time...
getting closer...
REO... almost there...
dual coil + REO... still getting closer...
sub ohm... closer
sub ohm + huge air... closer... (works on the mechs, but the REO needs daily care...)

Yeah, OK, but your nic habit was/is hardly representative of the average smoker who's considering switching to vaping.

 

[LMS62]

No the point is not Moot...A 0.5 ohm coil Needs a certain amount of airflow going across it. It was designed for that airflow... Your acting like its a "One tank fits all" type situation which it isn't. There is a reason why the tank doesn't have smaller stock airflow selections. Drop a .5 coil in an Rda and pinch off most of the airflow and then tell me it doesn't affect the quality of the vape. Even PBusardo and Demitri said it doesn't work well for most MTL's BUT...If you insist on the sub-ohm recommendation to newbies please be responsible and explain a bit of
ohms law and why it wont be safe to use on an ordinary Ego type battery. and just in case they purchase a mod with a removable battery explain to them about the c rating on Batteries and the dangers of inferior Batteries. You know, Do the right thing...

I agree, but keep in mind, the subtank mini also can use the 1.2ohm coil as well.

 

[crxess]

I just did exactly what you suggested and cranked it down to a single hole. I ALSO turned the wattage on my mod down to 10 watts. It vaped fine. And by fine, I mean vastly superior to a protank, or god forbid anything with a CE at the beginning of it. I stand by my statement that there is absolutely no reason a newbie should have to suffer with crappy hardware. There's no reason a newb should have start with an EGO battery either, for that matter. For the price of a starter kit at most B&M's, they could get something that most vapoers would be far happier with in the short AND long runs. We went through all of the trial and error so that they don't have to.

Now try that experiment for 3 days...............or even one day and see if the coil doesn't gunk up and the tank start leaking from over saturation. Been there, Know a bit about that.

Simplicity/Cost Shock Reduction
A POSSIBLE New vapor often needs two things
1) Easy of use - Even a Most Basic Battery/Clearo is more complicated than Lighting up
2) A Belief that switching will be affordable. - Often they do not see past the Per Pack cost

Heck, My first month I had jumped from cig-a-likes to Ego/Clearos and that was the simple part.
Ordering $$$ Hundreds in small bottles of flavors without a clue, in hopes of finding something I actually would like to Vape all day. That turned into a nightmare. Same e-liquid, next order - Different taste.(fresher/older/wrong mixing - who knows)
Thank goodness Step 1 was simple because step 2 got totally stupid.

2 and1/2 years later, I am still throwing out crappy liquids from the first round........ Thankfully I now DIY
I still have many of my first clearo's and use them often for work or on quick runs to the store/etc.
Also something about an Ego 450/carto in the pocket that makes you feel secure.

 

[Rossum]

every smoker who I've let try my Provari with Kayfun V2+ ... has said dayum, that is some serious smoke

then I tell them ... you gotta be serious about quitting smokes ... this thing costs 3 cartons

Right, most smokers who I've let try my setups end up coughing pretty good and my setups only provide MTL airflow with wattages in the teens.

My setups also cost multiple cartons, but a carton's worth of juice cost me under $10.

 

[Rossum]

My wife smokes Pall Mall Menthol 100's for $32 a carton.

Does she have a time machine to the 1990s, or do you guys live close to a reservation?

 

[KC33]

I wish the Subtank was around when I started vaping. Setting the Subtank Mini on the most restrictive setting is perfect for mouth to lung.

 

[AndriaD]

Are you saying most smokers don't lung inhale when vaping or don't lung inhale cigarettes? Cause lung inhales is how all smokers do cigarettes.

Not even close to "all" -- in fact it seems to be a decided minority. Most smokers draw on a cigarette as if they're sucking thru a straw, using the mouth muscles, and then inhale. That's why smokers get those vertical wrinkles in their lips.

Andria

 

[OlderNDirt]

Generally speaking, I don't think there is a one size fits all for a recommendation on a start-up system. I mentioned variables earlier and one very big one IMHO is the age of the person wanting to start vaping. Plunk a pen style and a sigelei 100W Plus with a Kanger ST in front of a person over 50 and see which they pick no matter what you say. What would a 20sometrhing grab?

I also wonder how many offering the advice to start with a sub system actually started with a sub system themselves. I seriously question if I would have even started if that was the only choice I had. But, then again, I am one of those older people that change in and of itself is a big enough challenge. I started small and simple and progressed to the subs and mods. I don't even think about "wasting money", because what I spent to get me off smokes after 40+ years was worth every single penny. Now I am just spending more on the hobby.

But, that's just my humble opinion.

 

[DavidAmonettNashville]

I agree, but keep in mind, the subtank mini also can use the 1.2ohm coil as well.

True that.... I still think the Sub tanks operate better with lots of airflow which feels strange to a new convert...But hey, I got off of smokes with a 3.7 V ego and a crappy CE4 clearo so anythings an improvement over that.

 

[Paramaniac413]

Cause lung inhales is how all smokers do cigarettes.

Are you sure about that? Having smoked for almost 20 years, I can tell you that's not true.

 

[AndriaD]

Are you sure about that? Having smoked for almost 20 years, I can tell you that's not true.

I smoked for 39, and never once "lung inhaled" a cigarette. Wouldn't even dream of it -- I have asthma, so I didn't actually inhale very deeply at all, which works out great for vaping.

Andria

 

[TheJakeBailey]

On a side note and a bit off topic....What is your overall impression of the MVP3 ? Best feature? Worst ? I really want one as my Vape Apocalypse fall-back device. My Mvp2 has NEVER let me down..neither has my VTR.

Honestly, i think it's a GREAT device. It's slightly bigger, and a little heavier than the last version. It has a really nice screen, the button is moved to the side, and it has a recessed 510. 30 watts is plenty for what I'm using it for. Mostly tanks, lemo, subtank,etc, but also single coil drippers. It's a little pricier than say an Istick 30 watt, but worth every extra penny in my opinion. If you want a 30 watt mod, I think it's hard to beat. My Hana clone is very close to death, and this will be a much better device as a replacement.

 

[Bob320]

I agree with this sentiment. I researched and started with a iStick 50w and Atlantis for my first vape, as I wanted something that could grow as my abilities did and so that I could save $$$, I could not afford several hundred on vaping gear.

I quickly became frustrated with this setup and realized it was probably overkill for a first time. It's getting easier, but coughing everything I hit on the vape makes it hard to quit the Menthol analogs, which are difficult for me to cough on. I had previously only had a Markten cigalike for a short time.


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