There's a lot of numbers bandied about from CDC and different state agencies. And the numbers change as more patients are admitted.
CDC Finally Saying Stop Vaping THC
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One other point to consider is that while Vitamin E acetate was found in all those samples, there's very little, if any, data to show what the effects are, if any, let alone acute respiratory failure or lipoid pneumonia like seen in these individuals. Especially when vaped, which involves heating, rather than by passive exposure in say the workplace, or in lab tests with nebulized tocopherol acetate.
While it still is highly likely that it will turn out to be that, or some breakdown product formed when heated, it remains speculation it's even the cause without more testing, including determining if it's even capable of causing the type of lung damage being seen. So it's still a leap of faith for the CDC, or anyone in this thread or forum, to say with absolute certainty that's it. The correlation is high (but not 100%) but causation remains to be established. Take that statement, and the media can easily twist it to say "the cause remains unknown" and still be "accurately" reporting.
While it still is highly likely that it will turn out to be that, or some breakdown product formed when heated, it remains speculation it's even the cause without more testing, including determining if it's even capable of causing the type of lung damage being seen. So it's still a leap of faith for the CDC, or anyone in this thread or forum, to say with absolute certainty that's it. The correlation is high (but not 100%) but causation remains to be established. Take that statement, and the media can easily twist it to say "the cause remains unknown" and still be "accurately" reporting.
I think Vitamin E Acetate was found in the majority of samples, not all.
Thinking about it more it’s not impossible that it isn’t in place at the moment. Congress could have blocked it or Trump could have countermanded it. A confirm or deny would be a seriously deep dive I’m not equipped to make. Is there a bat signal for library scientists? There should be. It would be cool.
UPDATE: there IS a bat signal! If you live in NYC
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True, not all samples that have been tested showed Vitamin E Acetate --- however, of the 13 samples of THC products that the Wadsworth Center lab obtained from 8 actual patients, all contained Vitamin E Acetate ... up to 50% of the liquid in some products.
Any oil would theoretically do it. That MCE garbage comes to mind. Plus there are apparently samples with vastly higher than labeled THC amounts, and several other even more dangerous things.
Where did you read that? I read the exact opposite. THC is much more expensive than cutters. It doesn't make sense for drug dealers to sell a purer product than they advertise.
It's necessarily not I'm a minority, it's about when I started vaping. Back then tobacco was the biggest seller as flavored eliquid was simple, usually single flavor mixes that tasted bad.
I would take hangsen RY4 over cherry cough syrup any day [emoji16]. That's how it was back then.
No it does not follow. If contaminated alcohol was the problem does it follow that dairy products may also be contaminated. WHat about water does that follow as well.
Why? E-liquid vendors say "Hey let's put vitamin e acetate in our nic-juice. It is substantially more expensive then all the other ingredients and serves no purpose whatsoever."
Do you think the same people are mixing e-juice and c-juice. They are not.
The entire reason there is vitamin e acetate in c-juice is because the concentrate has been cut so heavily that consumers could tell it was garbage ( low thc) by the viscosity.
I take great exception to your statement "several other even more dangerous things". THC is not a dangerous thing.
While I agree in general with what you're saying i.e. pg and vg are much cheaper than the diluents used to dilute THC/CMD, there's a small chance that the same people who sell black market THC, are also selling fake Juul Pods, and there may be some cross contamination, if it's mixed in the same location.
Journey of a Tainted Vape Cartridge: From China’s Labs to Your Lungs
Between East 3rd and Boyd, it’s all vapes, vapes, and more vapes. It only takes a wad of cash and an hour of haggling to buy everything you need to begin harming consumers with an illicit market THC vape cart, a fake JUUL pod, or something advertised as CBD.
In addition to the low quality hardware, LA’s Toy District vape wholesalers sell the dangerous additives not approved for human inhalation— including dubiously sourced terpene flavorings and hazardous diluent thickeners like vitamin E oil. You can also purchase more traditional diluents like propylene glycol, polyethylene glycol, and vegetable glycerin.
The point wasn't "why", nor was it "statistical probability". The point is there could be something else, including but not limited to Vit-E-a from the nic-side. Given what they "knew" at the time. Nobody asked for, nor did they publish, their intuition.
This is a "Let's work the problem, people. Don't make it worse by guessing [assuming]!" situation, to paraphrase quote Gene Kranz from Apollo 13 movie.
This is about the CDC building a decision tree or whatever tool they use in their epidemiology. And they try real hard not to assume anything and make an error. They go-wide.
At least that's my
.
There was one claim somewhere of one sample with something like 110 times the potency of the claimed strength. Didn’t make a ton of sense to me either. Hard to do even. Using straight pure material in something intended to be heavily titrated maybe.
It only does if they don’t know what the heck they are doing, which is apparently part of the problem.
Viscosity. Vitamin E Acetate is thicker than VG. Consumers of black market products, have come to view viscosity as a proxy for purity.
There's this thing in the Cannabis world where PG/VG is considered "bad". So maybe for dual users....
Who knows?
Maybe it was space dust from a meteor flyover. Doesn't matter. What matters is that they couldn't factually exclude another simultaneous contaminant on the nic side, even if they guessed that it was 100% cannabis side.
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OH, you mean on the c-side. They're nuts.
Thickness supposedly == potency, but it equaled death in some cases.110 times the potency of the claimed strength!? What did they claim the THC percentage is in their product? That implies a claimed potency of well under 1%!? No one would buy such a product. I'm willing to bet that was a reporting error.
Possible. I know next to nothing about non-nic e-cigarettes.
I suggest it is a vanishingly small chance that the same groups are producing both products.
The profit and risk are orders of magnitude apart.
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