How can some be expected to quit smoking, if they can't get a $50 Vapor Flask? The nerve of some suggesting aiding and abetting counterfeiting is wrong...
Clone Versus Authentic Discussion
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How can someone be expected to quite smoking by spending $50 on hobbyist class equipment? People do spend around $20 on entry level kits to quit. Then decide if it's worth it to vape or just ditch nicotine. Then again, there's plenty of people who spend $0.
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Please give me examples of some authentics that are "original". They all just copied something else.
Pointless. I don't think you understand the terminology, concepts or controversy...
I easily get bored when some don't understand all cars aren't clones of the first car, or all wheels aren't clones of the first wheel, and who don't understand that there is a difference between a concept- an atty, and a copy made to look like the authentic, sold as a 'clone' of the authentic, with the same engravings...
You first said counterfeit, now you say clone; apples and oranges. You are avoiding my point; you aren't giving examples of "original" authentic products because there aren't any, they're just minor variations on the same theme and in now way should cost what they do; the price of the clones are PROOF.
You could say authentic low-yield manufacturing costs are one reason there are clones. Not to mention the cloners already has a company up and running that only needs to reallocate worker and machine time to making a clone.
I'm not trying to ignore the fact that there are price gaugers out there. Or me-too people who may know CAD software or has a buddy that does... but have no experience designing for economically viable manufacturing.
Most arguments in clone vs authentic threads are only valid if backed by generalization.
As for nitpicking the term 'clone'. It's a term that has several meanings. Nothing organic about computers, yet hard drives can be cloned. Which has nothing to do with clonebabies or counterfeit products.
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Really?
The proof that you can't answer is evidenced by the fact that you don't answer.
What part about concept and copy/counterfeit do you not understand? A Kayfun is a genuine atty. It is an atty, and has a similar concept as nearly all other RTAs. A fastech Kayfun is a counterfeit- made to look like the authentic, but with differences in machining and materials. There is no such thing as a clone in the vape world...
Yep. I once had a chance to try making costume props and such, but when I learned of a company/team that was based out in asia with both menpower and dirt-cheap materials, I no longer saw a point in busting my chops for effectively 6$/hr when they could do as good or better product at 50/hr. Market saturation is indeed key in this price range.
Finally, an example. Now let's see if you can stop the elliptical rambling and personal attacks and stay on task for a second.
Websters defines Counterfeit as: "made in imitation so as to be passed off fraudulently or deceptively as genuine; not genuine; forged: counterfeit dollar bills" you can't possibly think that Fastech is trying to "counterfeit" an authentic Kayfun when they sell a tank for 10s of dollars instead of 100s of dollars?
Come on, get real.
My thought is that this debate is as fruitless as debating religion or politics. The clone mods are not counterfeit in general; they are not presented or marketed as genuine. The vast majority of authentic manufacturers do not hold patents or trademarks on their product. In that way even a true 1:1 clone is not illegal under our laws.
If it isn't illegal you're left with a morality argument, right vs wrong. The problem is that both sides think, know, and believe they hold the moral high ground. No one wins.
Personally, I have been buying exclusively authentic for the last few months. That has nothing to do with morality, but that I've fallen into a small niche of extreme wattage(400+) vaping. Clones exist, some are very good, but in my usage I need niche products designed to perform in those circumstances.
Really, it's not important what hardware you have, it's important you vape. Having an argument no one can win helps no one, and divides the community.
If it isn't illegal you're left with a morality argument, right vs wrong. The problem is that both sides think, know, and believe they hold the moral high ground. No one wins.
Personally, I have been buying exclusively authentic for the last few months. That has nothing to do with morality, but that I've fallen into a small niche of extreme wattage(400+) vaping. Clones exist, some are very good, but in my usage I need niche products designed to perform in those circumstances.
Really, it's not important what hardware you have, it's important you vape. Having an argument no one can win helps no one, and divides the community.
Can one legally buy knockoff Nikes, Rolexes, purses or clothing in the US? Of course not, because they are not legal. There is no 1:1 'clone' Maybe in general appearance, but a true 'clone' would be indistinguishable from the authentic. If it is a well made authentic, like a Kayfun, all but the blind can see the differences when compared to an original...
You do know Hana Modz recently won a lawsuit against a vendor selling knockoff Hanas, right?
Yes, they won, so there is some precedent. However it only applies because Hana Modz is trademarked now. Note I said vast majority do not have those protections. It is those very protections that allow Nike to take action on fakes.
That feeds into the morality argument; me saying anything but "Clones are bad" set you off to correct me. The idea behind my post was that no one is right or wrong. Also, it's a bit disingenuous to compare buying clones to buying blackmarket counterfeits. When you can only buy clone mods from shady street vendors that'll be more accurate
That feeds into the morality argument; me saying anything but "Clones are bad" set you off to correct me. The idea behind my post was that no one is right or wrong. Also, it's a bit disingenuous to compare buying clones to buying blackmarket counterfeits. When you can only buy clone mods from shady street vendors that'll be more accurate
Setting up production is what every company in every industry does. Cost of doing business. Much is tax deductible here in the US.
They do his to make a profit. It's no excuse for a poor business model.
Yes the same rules apply. It's business, not sports where you support your home team when they lose.
Lost me there, but I agree semantics are irrelevant.
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