Co-Op Interest for L-Rider Lavatubes for $30 each unit!!!
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Just to update since i havent in like 90 pages im in for whatever it turns into for a min of 2 
Well, if you're referencing AW cells and want to get technical.....then let's get technical!
18650 battery test 2011
The Samsung ICR 3000 (4.35V) & the Panasonic NCR 2900 all but DESTROYED the AW IMR 1600, in bench tests!!
All 3 cells are almost exactly the same size and all 3 will fit perfectly into an LT.
The Samsung can be purchased for about $12/ea:
Samsung 18650 ICR18650-30A 3000mAh Li-ion Battery x2 | eBay
The Panasonic can be purchased for about $10/ea:
Panasonic NCR18650 18650 2900mAh Li-ion 3.6v Battery x2 | eBay
And if you want either of these with protection circuits, add a couple bucks...MAX!
But now, the AW IMR is gonna cost you about $10 plus shipping:
Super T Manufacturing, Innovative manufacturer of electronic cigarette products.
Or $17-$18 for the ICR's plus shipping.
So you do the math.....
AW is not the best battery, nor is it the best one for the money!
bdl are made by samsung?that's the first i've heard that
aw is a panasonic battery i think, no?
No BDL is a totally different manufacturer.
I'm trying to get quotes from all kinds of makers.
And yes, AW uses Panasonic cells....
But the interesting part was that the Panasonic's that were tested against the AW's BEAT them in performance tests.....so kinda makes ya wonder, hmm?
I respectfully disagree. You're statement that the Samsung and Panasonic destroy the AW IMR 1600 is done so on an uneven playing field, and quite frankly dis-informing.
Let's take a look at the facts.
1) AW IMR 1600 - Nearly HALF the capacity of what you are comparing it to. A Congressman can look at those charts and come to the same conclusion.
2) The discharge rates on the AW IMR 1600 are much more uniform across the board, compared to the Samsungs and the Panasonic.
3) You want to talk about destroying? The AW IMR 1600 destroys EVERY battery tested at a 5A discharge rate. I too can make things look favorable.
4) Even at the 500mah mark, the AW IMR 1600 is still performing better than the Panasonic and Samsung (4.2V), and is quite comparable to the Samsung (4.35V).
5) Level the playing field. Look at the AW 2900 vs the Panasonic 2900 and Samsung 3000 (4.2V). It compares with the Panasonic, and is only slightly less in the charts due to the protection circuit. Both the AW 2900 and the Panasonic 2900 flat out beat the Samsung 3000 (4.2V). Where are the charts on the protected versions?
6) Buyer beware! Not all chargers can charge a battery to 4.35V.
I don't know what you are basing the fact that the AW IMR 1600 was destroyed on, but it's definitely not there. The only thing the Samsung and Panasonic batteries do, is beat AW in price/capacity.
Yeah, but we don't need 5 amps do we?
The LT maxes out at 2.63 amps (rated for 2.5 amps).
THERE'S your playing field!
So everyone can draw their own conclusions based on the charts and graphs given for the discharge rates at 2A.
Sure, no other battery can beat a high quality IMR at 5 amps because of it's internally low resistance, but if you don't need a 5A continuous drain, then why spend all of that extra money for high drain power that you really don't need, for the LT?
And yes, the AW 2900 is equal to the Panasonic 2900 and the Samsung 3000 in performance...with or without a protection circuit.
But look at the price differences: AW 2900 $17 + shipping, Panasonic 2900 $10 + $0 shipping, Samsung 3000 $12 + $0 shipping (and those are the lowest retail prices that I'm aware of for all 3).
By the time you add in shipping charges to the AW battery, you're at double the price compared to either the Panasonic or the Samsung! (even with a PCB added)
And if you didn't notice in a previous post, AW was one of the first that I requested a wholesale offer, but AW refused to sell to a Co-Op.
Can't say the same for Panasonic OR Samsung, cuz they both DESTROY the AW in price for exactly the same performance in the ICR's!!
So I'm sure that you can imagine the savings with a wholesale bid on either of those makers against the AW, currently at twice the price of retail??
So in my opinion, there's truly no comparison!
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If this is still running, count me in please. Location Brisbane, Australia. Dollar is the same for US and AUS at the moment, so all good
You are correct, we don't need a 5A draw, hence my rhetoric about making something look good. That still does nothing to level the playing field.
I'm not disputing the cost difference, and that is a very valid argument. I am disputing the claim that the Samsung and Panasonic batteries destroy the AW IMR 1600. That is pure disinformation, because in reality it outperforms both of the batteries, just in a shorter time period due to it's lower capacity, even at 2A.
It's fine to have options, just don't go spreading fallacy as fact.
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You're up early today, arenchya?
I presented the evidence from 1 man's point of view and you gave a valid rebuttal.
But there's no fallacy in my opinion or yours, only a difference of opinion based on the validity of the LT playing field.
So we agree to disagree.
Got paged in the middle of the night and can't get back to sleep.You're up early today, arenchya?
I presented the evidence from 1 man's point of view and you gave a valid rebuttal.
But there's no fallacy in my opinion or yours, only a difference of opinion based on the validity of the LT playing field.
So we agree to disagree.
In terms of the AW IMR 1600 and performance, it is fallacy to say that the Samsung and Panasonic outperform. If going only on cost, you have a case. If comparing AW 2900 with the other two, you have a case on both fronts. That is all I can agree on.
Got paged in the middle of the night and can't get back to sleep.
In terms of the AW IMR 1600 and performance, it is fallacy to say that the Samsung and Panasonic outperform. If going only on cost, you have a case. If comparing AW 2900 with the other two, you have a case on both fronts. That is all I can agree on.
This is my opinion:
"The Samsung ICR 3000 (4.35V) & the Panasonic NCR 2900 all but DESTROYED the AW IMR 1600, in bench tests!!"
I didn't state it as a fact because I provided the actual bench tests charts and graphs.
A high quality IMR has better performance in maintaining a higher voltage, due to it's chemistry.
And a high quality ICR has better performance in producing significantly longer storage capacity, due to it's chemistry.
But there's still no fallacy in our opinions.
The true FACT still remains....which one is better for YOU?
Here's another reason why I'm very interested in Panasonic cells:
The Panasonic CGR18650CH & CGR18650CG have the same characteristics as an IMR, but with a much higher capacity like an ICR!
The technology is so new that I can't find any comparison charts for these anywhere, but they may be a consideration for this coop.....once I get more data from Panasonic.
Here's one of two retailers carrying them at a reasonable price:
Panasonic CGR18650CH 2250mAh Li-ion Battery [Panasonic CGR18650CH] - $8.76 : Led Flashlight-International Outdoor Store
But I don't recommend buying these just yet for the LT, as I just don't have enough clear data on how they'd perform in a boosted MOD.
The Panasonic CGR18650CH & CGR18650CG have the same characteristics as an IMR, but with a much higher capacity like an ICR!
The technology is so new that I can't find any comparison charts for these anywhere, but they may be a consideration for this coop.....once I get more data from Panasonic.
Here's one of two retailers carrying them at a reasonable price:
Panasonic CGR18650CH 2250mAh Li-ion Battery [Panasonic CGR18650CH] - $8.76 : Led Flashlight-International Outdoor Store
But I don't recommend buying these just yet for the LT, as I just don't have enough clear data on how they'd perform in a boosted MOD.
Have you been given a spec's on this mod yet? There is a vender in the usa other than volcano selling these now. The new improved version. They claim they used them at 6 volts with 2 ohm twin carto's all day and no drop back of voltage
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