Do you have energy to defend your VP?

[HighHeeledGoddess]

It appears to be very difficult for them to accept that although we're still nicotine slaves, we have chosen a less harmful way to feed our addiction. She, and others, have a hard time comprehending the difference.

This is why I lie to people and tell them that I use 0 liquid, and that my device simply provides the hand-to-mouth action to keep me from getting it via food, and gaining weight. That is partially true, and I am all the way down to 11mg from 24, so I may as well be at 0 at this point. Its not really anyone's business what/why we are doing what we do anyway!

 

[Shatt]

@ HighHeeledGoddess - thats a good way to put it. And its true, tests have been done to show that it is safe for bystanders. "Its not really anyone's business what/why we are doing what we do anyway! " I agree all the way on this one. But the non smokers, or the ex-smokers (reformed smokers) are horrible at judging without knowing the facts. Its sad really. And a but annoying that your a judged rate off the bat!

Rate now, im in the middle of trying to convince my HR team at my job to allow us to vape at our desks. Im not sure how well its going to go over, but if they do their home work, they will see how safe it really is to the vaper and to the people around. Not to mention they are making Smoke free on the grounds in a few months...ek!

 

[jpargana]

You still inhale, you still take smoke breaks, you are still a "smoker one that puffs on something" It maybe vapor, but you still are a smoker like I am still a smoker, but it is vapor.

It's just an alternative to the real thing, but you still have the habit of smoking.


I like smoking I always have, and this lets me continue to be a smoker without the harm of being one.

Sorry, but no. If an alchoolic kicks his habit by drinking only non-alchoolic beer, he can no longer be considered an alchoolic, because there is no alchool in that beer - no matter how it resembles 'real' beer. He may still be 'addicted' to a nice, cool, refreshing beer... but without the alchool. Alchool was destroying his life and health, not the beer by itself... people may call me a nicotine addict, or tell me that I still have that same oral fixation that smokers have. All that is true, but it is not the oral fixation, or even the nicotine, that is killing people... smoke is. But, because I use a smokeless alternative to cigarettes, I cannot, and will not, be called a smoker. When people tell me that I am still a smoker, I try to educate them. Mostly, they say that out of ignorance of what an e-cig really is. Other people have already understood what it is about, and will ask me, "Does it really work for you? Does is really keep you from smoking? Or do you cheat? Do you still smoke a cigarette sometimes?"
Once, I went thru a carbon monoxide medical test, and the result was a typical non-smoker result. In the last year and an half, I felt my health greatly improving, like all my ex-smokers friends did. I no longer inhale tocacco smoke. How, then, can I be still a smoker?

 

[D4rk50ul]

I'm not naive to the point that I think vaping is safe. Nicotine can cause serious health conditions with prolonged exposure, and can cause abrupt issues if taken in too large of a dose. I also can't tell you what prolonged exposure to PG/VG in vapor form can do to the human body.

With that being said, I can tell you for sure what smoking did to me. I can tell you what it does to over 40 million people in the US as well. I can say this without a doubt because it is not based on a theory about the future, it has been proven with death and disease over 400,000 times a year.

I would NEVER recommend a non smoker to use a PV because its addicting, and I'm using it to feed my addiction in what I perceive to be a safer way. I will educate every smoker I come across to this new alternative, that after 1 puff has left me smoke free for 3 weeks. These smokers can use the information here and on other credible sites to make educated decisions about their own addiction, and I hope they see the obvious like I did.

I don't care if people still call me a smoker, I know what vaping does for me and how different I feel. I didn't start vaping to gain acceptance by non smokers or to vape in places I couldn't smoke. It was a personal choice to better myself and improve my quality of life. The FDA approved and continues to allow the product that caused my addiction, and I will fight to the death if they try to ban the only thing that has ever freed me from it.

 

[SgtDeadeye]

This may end up being another threat entirely, or perhaps there already is one, but Defending vaping is a laborius task. It's a mental connection people automatically make. They see you put something cigarette (or cigar) like in your mouth, they see "smoke" they think smoker. You should have seen the look on one of my co-workers faces when I stepped inside after my vape break after just exhaling the vapor and dropped my 510 right into my pocket. She flipped out thinking I was going to burn myself!! I had to laugh, but then I had to explain it to her.

My question is, many of you say you vape in your office. Do you stealth vape or have you fully explained it to the powers that be? And follow up would be a two parter. If you stealth, have you ever had to explain yourself when a wisp of vapor is seen by a co-worker, and if you went the other way and talked to the "boss", how did that conversation go?

 

[Vidi]

Sorry, but no. If an alchoolic kicks his habit by drinking only non-alchoolic beer, he can no longer be considered an alchoolic, because there is no alchool in that beer - no matter how it resembles 'real' beer. He may still be 'addicted' to a nice, cool, refreshing beer... but without the alchool. Alchool was destroying his life and health, not the beer by itself... people may call me a nicotine addict, or tell me that I still have that same oral fixation that smokers have. All that is true, but it is not the oral fixation, or even the nicotine, that is killing people... smoke is. But, because I use a smokeless alternative to cigarettes, I cannot, and will not, be called a smoker. When people tell me that I am still a smoker, I try to educate them. Mostly, they say that out of ignorance of what an e-cig really is. Other people have already understood what it is about, and will ask me, "Does it really work for you? Does is really keep you from smoking? Or do you cheat? Do you still smoke a cigarette sometimes?"
Once, I went thru a carbon monoxide medical test, and the result was a typical non-smoker result. In the last year and an half, I felt my health greatly improving, like all my ex-smokers friends did. I no longer inhale tocacco smoke. How, then, can I be still a smoker?

While I no longer considered myself a "smoker", your argument may have changed my mind. You seem to have proven the point of those who say we are still smokers.

Smoke/alcohol may be what was killing us. But nicotine isn't exactly good for us either. It has negative health effects as well.

I just think we are all caught up on semantics here. Vaping simulates smoking, that I think we can all agree on. Therefore, maybe we are simulated smokers lol also known as vapers.

All that matters is: are we healthier? I would say yes.

Will be stay healthier? WE DON'T KNOW. no one knows. Vaping is new. We have no idea what the long term effects will be. 20 years from now, we may find that PG or VG or the flavorings cause some weird new fatal condition.

Or we may find that vaping is indeed safe and we all made the right choice.

Either way, I haven't bought a pack of smokes in two months and that, in and of itself is saying something.

 

[Jack Fraust]

just tell them the fog they see is purely theatrical.

 

[Pav]

Just wait till your over a YEAR in, and you still can't quit the vapping habit. I wake up in the morning now with the same damn nic fits I had when I used cigs.

The novelty does wear off at some point, and when it does you realize that you are still a smoker. Like someone else said in this thread it's Smoking 2.0. Yes, I feel better, but I still have a nasty habit that I still can't seem to drop.

You have an addictive habit yes, but is it nasty? It's way healthier and doesn't stink. What's so nasty about it? The addiction? OK, I can buy that to a point, but it's not really nasty. Just ask my girlfriend. She can sit next to me and I don't stink and am not killing either of us.

 

[Pav]

The smoker-not a smoker debate is ongoing as usual, but I look at it this way.

Being a vaper and a smoker are obviously two different things. The point about going back to cigs if vaping was taken away is probably true for many or most. However, I just work that into the definition of "vaper".

Smoker = someone who inhales smoke from a cigarette, cigar, etc (combustion must occur) and can be addicted to nicotene.

Vaper = someone who inhales vapor with or without nicotene. Mental and physical addiction to nicotene/smoking habit is still present.

 

[Saintscruiser]

I have a doctor's appt. next Tuesday. I can't wait to tell him that I haven't smoked an analog in 35 days and watch his mouth drop to the floor. If only I could express to everyone what a sheer miracle this is.....me not smoking analogs. My husband can't smell it, my mother-in-law can't smell it, and I'm not putting either of them in danger . For the first time in 42 years, I have control, and not the other way around. I am not coughing, which does make me feel better since I have fibromyalgia. Coughing is awful on fibro. I can go anywhere and vape. I am not putting tar and carcinogens into my body. I plan to cut my nicotine down in a methodical way as not to have withdrawal symptoms. I pray that by this time next year that my nicotine will be 0. At that time, I will make an assessment of if I wish to continue vaping or not.

HOWEVER, I also know that if I take that 1st drag off of an analog, I'll go right back to it, which is what an alcoholic does when they fall off the wagon. I know this to be fact because it happened like that to me. So, I consider myself a recovering smoker. At this point, I don't crave an analog and I don't want one. I take it a day at a time. When I have a craving or just miss them like I did the other day, I choose not to pick up one, because I know what would happen. My mom went for 3 months and picked them back up on more than one occasion.....even after open heart surgery. For those of you who are new, my mom died of lung cancer last Oct. 5th.

So whatever words you associate with the e-cigs, smoker or vapor, I haven't smoked 1504 analogs since I got my e-cig. My husband is so very thankful and I am too.

 

[stayahead]

Vaping isn't smoking, although to the untrained eye, they appear to be similar.

While we have quit smoking, we haven't quit nicotine. I believe this put us in the same category as people who are trying to quit cigarettes by using nicotine gum or patches. So we haven't lost our dependency on nicotine (like the gum chewers) however we have quit smoking.

It's all semantics really.

 

[Jonmo1]

I am really tired of this argument.

The main argument people seem to have is that we still have a habbit.
It's a different habbit to satisfy the same addiction.

Society has labled smoking as a 'Bad Habit', and rightfully so.
It was labled a bad habit because it stinks and causes cancer and a wide variety of other health issues. Not only to the smoker, but to others around the smoker.

But over the years, society has been brainwashed to associate "Habit" and "Smoking" as being the same thing.
They are NOT the same thing.

Having a "Habit" is NOT necessrily a bad thing.
It's what the habit is that makes it a good or a bad thing.

Putting on your seatbelt is a "habit", but it's a good one.


Vaping IS still a habit, but is it a "Bad Habit" ?

I don't think so
My body doesn't think so
My Wife doesn't think so (she likes kissing me now)
My family doesn't think so (I don't stink anymore, and have less health risks)


And the argument that says
"If you lost all your PV's and couldn't get anymore would you go back to smoking"
That is just not a valid argument.
No one can answer that unless it actually happens.
And it will not happen.
Ecigs will not dissappear from the face of the planet.
Once the knowledge and know how is out there, it cannot be erased from existence.
As long as we want them, there will be someone there to provide them.
Even if we have to go underground, it will still be available.
If the government wants to make me a criminal, so be it.
I would rather be a criminal than dead.


OK, that's my 2 cents.

 

[Shatt]

As much as I agree with you Jonmo1, my HR department just informed us that we are not anble to Vape in side...ok, I can deal with that. But they also followed up with, as for out side, we will need to research the issue further to determin of Vaping is the same as smoking...these kinda comments bothered be. I was not happy. I still feel very descrimanted. Espitally when this doing MORE good then harm. How often has anyone said that about anything they smoke? Exactly. It is intimidating to explaine the case about the eCig to these people...HR of a global company, and a lowly grunt worker like my self, not exactly a chance in h*ll!

But, we shal see. All I know, is that for the first time in a VERY long time, i havent had a smoke at work, morning or last night. I hope to what ever various gods you believe in they do NOT erase them from exsistance! I do not want to smoke again!

 

[Hygroscopic]

What health risk would it pose for someone to start vaping with 0 nic juice though? I understand vaping nicotine juice is for people that are already addicted to nicotine, but starting to vape 0% juice if you were never a smoker harms you how? Also, it could be argued that Nicotine is no worse for your health than all the caffeine people take in. They are both stimulants, are both addictive, and both cause withdrawal symptoms when use is stopped. So, anyone who has anything negative to say about my nicotine intake better stop drinking pepsi, or coffee.

The debate on health risk boils down to having no studies on long term exposure. We are all familiar with the studies on nicotine.

My perspective is one of cautious optimism. I consider all of the possible side effects in each ingredient, and while however low or high risk, that serves as my baseline. I have an idea of what I am getting into, but I also was tired of coughing up in the morning with signs of blood. The risk with this offsets all the "Black box warning" inhalers that one of them landed me in the ER. Since vaping it has stopped, sense of smell has come back, and I sometimes have the normal battle with vapor taste. Also I'm now able to run up and down the stairs without turning lobster red.

I'm a strong beliver that if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is. But we are talking about lighting carcinogens on fire and breathing it in. Either way you run the risk of dying. You run the risk of possibly dying crossing the street without looking. Generally it boils down to playing the odds. It is rather sad that society is so quick to fear monger first, then investigate later.

If people taking the step with vaping helps lay the groundwork to collect that needed medical data then so be it. We already know about the harms of smoking analogs. My opinion is that at this stage vaping is done "at your own risk" until more information can be gathered. It doesn't need to take several years of case studies in controlled environments. I have had no issue telling my primary care that they are welcome to take notes on my use.

When it comes time to seriously break it down to people: Vaping is the lesser of the evils. I am not a smoker, however I am a nicotine user. I explain the ecig as an "electronic vaporizer/electronic nicotine vaporizer" or EV/ENV to keep it short. If I say "inhaler" then people think nicotrol or albuterol. If I say "cig" or "cigarette" people think analog. So far EV/ENV has been the easiest way to explain that I'm not a smoker but I am still owning that I use nicotine. That and ENV does play well with "envy" when you are dealing in semantics.

I don't have to vehemently defend it because I have no problem stating that I am a nicotine user, and telling anyone giving me grief where to go. Just as I did when I smoked. As for the "unknown risks" then I volunteer to be proactive with my doctors.

 

[BlueMoods]

get over it, vaping is basically digital smoking, just like using email is digital letter writing. Just let non vapers think what they will. No writing email is not writing at all since you don't use a pen or pencil, but doe that bother you when people speak of writing emials to others? I doubt it, so why doe it bother you that digital smoking is still smoking?

 

[Hygroscopic]

get over it, vaping is basically digital smoking, just like using email is digital letter writing. Just let non vapers think what they will. No writing email is not writing at all since you don't use a pen or pencil, but doe that bother you when people speak of writing emials to others? I doubt it, so why doe it bother you that digital smoking is still smoking?

Personal standpoint I could care less what someone else believes with or without education on vaping.

The semantics come into play when it involves vapers being categorized under "smoker's stigma." That seems to be the crux of the issue for most.

 

[VapingRulz]

As much as I agree with you Jonmo1, my HR department just informed us that we are not anble to Vape in side...ok, I can deal with that. But they also followed up with, as for out side, we will need to research the issue further to determin of Vaping is the same as smoking...these kinda comments bothered be. I was not happy. I still feel very descrimanted. Espitally when this doing MORE good then harm. How often has anyone said that about anything they smoke? Exactly. It is intimidating to explaine the case about the eCig to these people...HR of a global company, and a lowly grunt worker like my self, not exactly a chance in h*ll!

But, we shal see. All I know, is that for the first time in a VERY long time, i havent had a smoke at work, morning or last night. I hope to what ever various gods you believe in they do NOT erase them from exsistance! I do not want to smoke again!

I can foresee a future class action by vapers against companies that force them outside to vape amongst the smokers, which is the scenario I hear about most often. Vapers are entitled to the same protections under the law as non-smokers in terms of avoiding exposure to the dangerous carcinogens from second-hand smoke. Lumping vapers together with smokers endangers vapers; it is a very real health risk.

The anti-smoking lobby and governments/businesses can't have it both ways. Either cigarette/cigar/pipe smoke is mortally dangerous and everyone is entitled to protection from the inevitable second-hand smoke - or it has never been the danger they've made it out to be. Which is it?

 

[NCC]

HOWEVER, I also know that if I take that 1st drag off of an analog, I'll go right back to it, which is what an alcoholic does when they fall off the wagon.

I wouldn't encourage you to try smoking a cigarette. However, I quit smoking seven months ago and during the first two months there were several times when I lit up. I actually had to force myself to finish one, and I just couldn't smoke the other one, putting it out after a few drags. I had smoked 1-2 packs a day for over 35 years, but they were that horrible ... for me at least, after a month or two of not smoking.

When I quit smoking I had a close to two month supply of cigarettes on hand.

 

[Hard31337]

Just wait till your over a YEAR in, and you still can't quit the vapping habit. I wake up in the morning now with the same damn nic fits I had when I used cigs.

The novelty does wear off at some point, and when it does you realize that you are still a smoker. Like someone else said in this thread it's Smoking 2.0. Yes, I feel better, but I still have a nasty habit that I still can't seem to drop.

I often wonder how many people really quit for good using these. Or is it just an Alternative which means it's the same as being a smoker.

What is nasty about vaping? It doesn't cause me to smell bad. It doesn't give me bad breath. It doesn't yellow my teeth. What makes vaping a nasty habit?

 

[Hard31337]

I disagree, if it is not smoking, then it is not a tobacco product so, is a drug delivery device and, that would need to be tested and FDA approved. If it's smoking, it's a tobacco product and will be taxed but, we won't lose it to the FDA.

So, yep, electronic cigarette is still a cigarette of some kind, keep it that way, just a new tobacco product, new lighterless, oderless (nearly), less disposable/expendable (super long lasting) brand but, yep cigarettes none the less.

For something to be a tobacco product, there has to be tobacco somewhere. Where exactly is the tobacco in an e-cigarette? Until you can show me where the tobacco is, then it's NOT a tobacco product.