Dr. Siegel's New Website!

[BigJimW]

I fixed the gender. You are now a woman. Whoot!

I still on occation use a good kick in the .... to my kids as an attention getter. Granted, they're 20 and 21 respectivally and sometimes can kick MY .... as well, but discipline can sometimes be a two way street with me.

 

[ladyraj]

ask any child who's parents smoke if they like the smell of cigarettes.....just ask and they will tell you no because everything they have rinks of it. there clothes, toys, and there hair rinks of tobacco smoke. they have to go to school smelling like an ash tray. Is that fare for that child i dont think so.

The Surgeon General's report supports your statements:

The evidence is sufficient to infer a causal relationship between secondhand smoke exposure and odor annoyance.

Peer pressure for stinkyitis from smoke is bad.
Stink from sweat in gym is bad.
Stink from cafeteria taco day is bad.
Children who smell like wet puppy dogs when they come in from playing is bad.
All kids who go to daycare smell strange so that is bad.
No more campfires for the scouts because the smell clings and is bad.
Wood-burning fireplaces leaves an odor that is bad.
Eating at a authentic Asian restaurant leaves odors that cling, it's bad.
Cooking fried fish at home leaves odors for hours...it's bad.

...and the list goes on and on....

Smells are in the nose of the smeller, just as beauty is in the eye of the beholder. When I smell a cigar I foundly recall my father. My great-aunt smelled of lilacs and a touch of cigarette smoke...not offensive to me even in the age of no air conditioning. Our senses are a gift to us but our perceptions of what we sense can become good or bad depending on how we file them away in our memories. I prefer to associate good memories with what I sense. I can only hope my loved ones do the same...otherwise call me stinky pants Ruth.

 

[Stric9]

Okay believe what you will....bottom line is there are 4000 chemicals in 2nd hand smoke. so knowing this your still placing your child at risk. Regardless what you think or say. We know the risks of smoking...2nd hand smoke carries the same risk because they contain the same chemicals. Again children cant simply tell mom and dad to put out there smokes. You guys are lucky not to have problems as many other have had. Im not some activist. I simply believe that knowingly placing your child around an environment that can cause many ailments is child abuse.

Please explain this one....
60% of the population of Asia smokes. 20% of the population of America smokes. How is it that the instances of lung cancer and heart disease are 1/10 per capita in Asia as compared to America?
These results were compiled during a 10 year study that was conducted by John Hopkins University between 1985~1995. The study concluded that the actual cause was a combination of diet, lack of excercise, and smoking. ALL were contributing factors. Any one was not a big deal... but put them all together and you're a goner.
Respects

 

[tromboneking]

Smoking is bad, in general. I think we all agree on that point. The issue is the "forcing" of a bad habit onto our kids.

It might be true that 2nd smoke could lead to cancer and whatnot but could not going out and getting a tan/burn do the same thing? Both could lead to cancer or death down the road. I guess the trip to FL or the Caribbean is out of the question.

I believe it was said already but if you live in a city, heck, if you live ANYWHERE that there are cars or machinery that uses gas or diesel fuels you are breathing in toxins that could cause serious issues in life, even if it's in minute portions, you are still breathing in harmful toxins. Not sure where you're located but even in PA they have cars and smelly trucks, not to mention farming machines...I've seen them. Have you ever sat at a light with a box truck or a diesel truck is in front of you or next to you? Not even sitting at a light, just driving past them, their fumes alone seem to be enough to kill! LOL!!


Grimmer said "Again living in the City is voluntary."

Bull. Sometimes you HAVE to live in the city for various reasons. Not all of us can own a house in the country and have an easy commute or have a house in the country and a house in the city. Sometimes it is financially better for people to live in the city so that the family relationship does not suffer (and as an FYI, I'm referring to commuting from NJ to NYC as an example, which can entail over $5,000 worth of commuting costs a year not including food unless you brown bag it every day (an estimate from about 3 years ago)...this is in regards to taking the bus or train and not driving into the city). What would be better? Living in the city and being able to spend time with your kids and go on nice vacations or having to work two jobs to be able to afford the commuting costs and NOT be around your kids or spend time on a vacation with them?

And yes, I know that jobs in NYC can pay a bit more than jobs in suburbia NJ I don't think that's really the point. The point is that living in a city environment is necessary for families to survive and thrive. Not everyone has the ability to get a job outside of a city environment where the air is clean without any harmful emissions or toxins.

Anyway, sorry for babbling. Thanks Grimmer and everyone else who served our county. My father served his time in Vietnam with the Coast Guard on River Patrols. He, like all of our service men and women deserve a pat on the back and some thanks...something that not all military personnel see.

 

[grimmer255]

The Surgeon General's report supports your statements:

The evidence is sufficient to infer a causal relationship between secondhand smoke exposure and odor annoyance.

Peer pressure for stinkyitis from smoke is bad.
Stink from sweat in gym is bad.
Stink from cafeteria taco day is bad.
Children who smell like wet puppy dogs when they come in from playing is bad.
All kids who go to daycare smell strange so that is bad.
No more campfires for the scouts because the smell clings and is bad.
Wood-burning fireplaces leaves an odor that is bad.
Eating at a authentic Asian restaurant leaves odors that cling, it's bad.
Cooking fried fish at home leaves odors for hours...it's bad.

...and the list goes on and on....

Smells are in the nose of the smeller, just as beauty is in the eye of the beholder. When I smell a cigar I foundly recall my father. My great-aunt smelled of lilacs and a touch of cigarette smoke...not offensive to me even in the age of no air conditioning. Our senses are a gift to us but our perceptions of what we sense can become good or bad depending on how we file them away in our memories. I prefer to associate good memories with what I sense. I can only hope my loved ones do the same...otherwise call me stinky pants Ruth.

so what your saying its okay for your child to smell like an ashtray.. sweating is something your body does when it gets hot. dont compare sweat to a nasty smelling ashtray.

 

[grimmer255]

Smoking is bad, in general.
I think we all agree on that point. The issue is the "forcing" of a bad habit onto our kids.

It might be true that 2nd smoke could lead to cancer and whatnot but could not going out and getting a tan/burn do the same thing? Both could lead to cancer or death down the road. I guess the trip to FL or the Caribbean is out of the question.

I believe it was said already but if you live in a city, heck, if you live ANYWHERE that there are cars or machinery that uses gas or diesel fuels you are breathing in toxins that could cause serious issues in life, even if it's in minute portions, you are still breathing in harmful toxins. Not sure where you're located but even in PA they have cars and smelly trucks, not to mention farming machines...I've seen them. Have you ever sat at a light with a box truck or a diesel truck is in front of you or next to you? Not even sitting at a light, just driving past them, their fumes alone seem to be enough to kill! LOL!!


Grimmer said "Again living in the City is voluntary."

Bull. Sometimes you HAVE to live in the city for various reasons. Not all of us can own a house in the country and have an easy commute or have a house in the country and a house in the city. Sometimes it is financially better for people to live in the city so that the family relationship does not suffer (and as an FYI, I'm referring to commuting from NJ to NYC as an example, which can entail over $5,000 worth of commuting costs a year not including food unless you brown bag it every day (an estimate from about 3 years ago)...this is in regards to taking the bus or train and not driving into the city). What would be better? Living in the city and being able to spend time with your kids and go on nice vacations or having to work two jobs to be able to afford the commuting costs and NOT be around your kids or spend time on a vacation with them?

And yes, I know that jobs in NYC can pay a bit more than jobs in suburbia NJ I don't think that's really the point. The point is that living in a city environment is necessary for families to survive and thrive. Not everyone has the ability to get a job outside of a city environment where the air is clean without any harmful emissions or toxins.

Anyway, sorry for babbling. Thanks Grimmer and everyone else who served our county. My father served his time in Vietnam with the Coast Guard on River Patrols. He, like all of our service men and women deserve a pat on the back and some thanks...something that not all military personnel see.

do you know what a tan is really.....its dead skin. Simply going out in the sun for a couple of hours is not bad for you. its the lathering up to cook your skin that worries the docs.

Forcing someone to breath in 2nd hand smoke is simply wrong. Anyway why would anyone want there child to smell like an ashtray and why would you want your child to breath in smoke?...

Living in the city.....
Even if it is there reason of survival its still there choice. How do you think people lived before there were cities and technology. You do not need the city to survive. Where you live after 18 is by choice of that person. Unless you lose your job and have to move back home....
Of course the air in cities are very bad....but that is to blame of the oil companies working with the US car companies (ford, GMC) For buying out most of the patents to have cleaner and more efficient cars. Now GMC and Ford are beginning to understand why there going under. Hopefully within 40 years NYC (the most beautiful city in my opinion) will be the cleanest city on earth...if Obama has his way.

 

[tromboneking]

You are right, a tan is burned skin...however, it can lead to skin cancer. The AAD stated "there is no safe way to tan." I have not read the whole article yet but you can see it here (Sun Tanning | LIVESTRONG.COM). Add to the fact that many dermatologists have said that tanning, especially excessive tanning/burning CAN lead to skin cancer.

And yes, YOU may not need the city to survive but some might. It is typically (at least I've found it this way), easier to find a job in a city than in suburbia. To get a job as a Police Officer, is typically easier to get in a city environment than in a suburban environment. To get a job in most parts of NJ, as a PAID Firefighter, is easier to get the cities as most of NJ has volunteer firefighters. Also, I know people that have HAD to get a job in a city so don't tell me that it's a choice. Especially in this economy you DON'T always have a choice.

You are right, people did live before cities and tech came about. With increased technology came larger cities. I'm sure they had cities where it was toxin free. Where the air you breathed was pure and clean. As for GM/Ford, etc...don't get me started...they CAN mass produce a clean car that is inexpensive enough for those on smaller incomes to afford (as most smaller incomes don't need to worry too much about horsepower, they just need the economy)...they just don't want to. And I don't think their hands are tied as much as you want to believe.

I'm not disputing that kids will smell like an ashtray, hell, my GF's father and brother smoke in the house and she used to smell like an ashtray. I'm not saying that smelling like an ashtray is effin' pleasant. However, I don't think you should judge people on what they do. Judging people, especially when it comes to kids, is a very sensitive subject by all. A parent normally does not want to be told how to raise their kids, be it discipline or habits which is why all the negative responses.

Grimmer, I'm assuming you have been around long enough to know that people are going to do what they want, no matter who says otherwise. I'm sure you have heard about Prohibition as well. Despite the Gov't telling us alcohol was bad for us, people still drank. Well, the Gov't has been telling us that analog smoking is bad for us...still we smoke. Going back to the original reason for the opening post, the Gov't is telling us that e-cigs are bad due to some limited testing despite what the NZ report shows and says, which is opposite. What the Gov't isn't telling you or reminding you is about all the bad chemicals in an analog cig. The Gov't would rather you smoking an anlog cig is better for you (with it's thousands of chemicals) than smoking an e-cig (with significantly less). The Gov't would rather you pollute the air we breathe and force e-cig smokers to analog cigs that can cause cancer and death than have cleaner cars and smoke/vape a cig that is better for the environment, better for the smoker, AND better for the kids. E-cigs are better for your kids health since, as you probably already know, they do not produce smoke, hence no 2nd hand smoke! What a solution for the kids, yes!

I'm not saying that you are entirely wrong in your assessments. Where you are wrong is in that everything is black and white with no gray in between when it comes to 2nd smoke. It was said it was "child abuse" and while you could say that and theoretically it could be considered abuse if you go by letter of the law or definition of child abuse but try using that in court. Try bringing up your neighbors who smoke in the house with their kids on charges of child abuse to the Police department or to Court and say that they are abusing their children because they are smoking inside and forcing the kids to smoke 2nd hand. The Police will laugh at you...or politely ask you to mind your own business and the case will be thrown out immediately! This is one area that you will not be able to win, not because you are passionate about this and not because you could be, by the letter of the law, correct but because you are judging others for their actions. No one likes to be judged by their actions unless it is sufficiently warranted.

As for President Obama....well, let's not go there as he may want us to find ways to die after we all reach senior citizen age.

 

[ramblingrose]

Grimmer255
Living in the city.....
Even if it is there reason of survival its still there choice. How do you think people lived before there were cities and technology. You do not need the city to survive. Where you live after 18 is by choice of that person. Unless you lose your job and have to move back home....

Again, its the world according to Grimmer. If someone lives in a city for your one little reason its not choice, but everything else is choice. You must be living in your own little world. One where there's room for every person to survive on what they grow on their own land. Make sure you throw out your TV, lights and electronics. Create your own heat and cooling (oops - burning wood might pollute the air). Yes, we do need cities to survive. They are an integral part of society, economics and technology. You cannot eliminate core elements; it all meshes together.

Grimmer255
so what your saying its okay for your child to smell like an ashtray.. sweating is something your body does when it gets hot. dont compare sweat to a nasty smelling ashtray.

You can't pick and choose to suit your ideas. Other people will find sweat offensive. The sweater can clean himself up; walking around smelling like a gym is "voluntary". How about bad breath. Or alcohol if a parent drinks - should a kid have to be around that? Don't put fish, onions or garlic in the lunchbag.

Grimmer255
Simply going out in the sun for a couple of hours is not bad for you. its the lathering up to cook your skin that worries the docs.

Forcing someone to breath in 2nd hand smoke is simply wrong. Anyway why would anyone want there child to smell like an ashtray and why would you want your child to breath in smoke?...

Wrong again. Docs say to always wear sunscreen because damage starts immediately.

How other people handle smoking in their home is their business, not yours. Take care of your own. If you send your kids out smelling like a gym, onion, or anything else not everyone likes and tolerates well, there are people who will take offense. Maybe someone will have a reaction to something you think is honky-dory.

If you believe the Surgeon General's report is based on unbiased facts, you're wrong. If you believe the report and feel everyone should act accordingly, you had no business smoking. You were polluting the air others breathe.

You should probably stop vaping to make sure you're not violating your own lofty principles. I hear e-cigs are dangerous.

 

[grimmer255]

Again, its the world according to Grimmer. If someone lives in a city for your one little reason its not choice, but everything else is choice. You must be living in your own little world. One where there's room for every person to survive on what they grow on their own land. Make sure you throw out your TV, lights and electronics. Create your own heat and cooling (oops - burning wood might pollute the air). Yes, we do need cities to survive. They are an integral part of society, economics and technology. You cannot eliminate core elements; it all meshes together.

You can't pick and choose to suit your ideas. Other people will find sweat offensive. The sweater can clean himself up; walking around smelling like a gym is "voluntary". How about bad breath. Or alcohol if a parent drinks - should a kid have to be around that? Don't put fish, onions or garlic in the lunchbag.

Wrong again. Docs say to always wear sunscreen because damage starts immediately.

How other people handle smoking in their home is their business, not yours. Take care of your own. If you send your kids out smelling like a gym, onion, or anything else not everyone likes and tolerates well, there are people who will take offense. Maybe someone will have a reaction to something you think is honky-dory.

If you believe the Surgeon General's report is based on unbiased facts, you're wrong. If you believe the report and feel everyone should act accordingly, you had no business smoking. You were polluting the air others breathe.

You should probably stop vaping to make sure you're not violating your own lofty principles. I hear e-cigs are dangerous.

First off when 9-11 happen I made a choice to join the army. I knew what I was getting into nobody forced me to do anything. Hell my father was all about it my mom was like what the heck are you thinking.
When I got out of active duty... I did the national guard trial 1 (sign up for a year) Durring this time I lived in Charleston SC, I was even offered one heck of a job/possible career. I turned it down later. I went up to Tobyhanna PA, for some computer/communications training. And thats when I met my girl. Short story short........... I made the choice to drop everything in my life, my family, my friends, my job and moved 726 miles with only the clothes on my back to start my life with her. That was more than 3 years ago. Dont tell me we dont have a choice in life...you make your own choices no matter what it is.
Yes people will do what they want. Thats why there are laws in place to help prevent people from getting hurt.....dont get me wrong there are some things that i disagree. But if you break the laws and get caught then you have to pay for it.
With already banning of indoor smoking you can bet with some time smoking in apartments, smoking around children in closed areas will become illegal. And Im hopeing this happens.....there are so many people with asthma who live in apartments b/c thats all they can afford. And have episodes b/c 2nd hand smoke gets into there apartment. Have you ever seen people with asthma. Have you ever watch them have flare ups and see them Ketch there breath. Its like having someone grab the back of your head and dunk your head over and over in water and trying to Ketch your breath. I understand why you disagree..with having the mentality....its my life I can do what ever I want to do....even if I hurt people or cause damage one way or another its okay because I can do whatever I want. That type of mentality was cause so much harm. I believe in freedom I also believe in rights of every human being. Which means people also have the right not to have 2nd hand smoke around them in buildings....If there is a chance that you could be harming another person by your second hand smoke then stop and go outside. Its there right also not to have second hand smoke around them.....it goes both ways folks.

 

[Sar]

First off when 9-11 happen I made a choice to join the army. I knew what I was getting into nobody forced me to do anything. Hell my father was all about it my mom was like what the heck are you thinking.
When I got out of active duty... I did the national guard trial 1 (sign up for a year) Durring this time I lived in Charleston SC, I was even offered one heck of a job/possible career. I turned it down later. I went up to Tobyhanna PA, for some computer/communications training. And thats when I met my girl. Short story short........... I made the choice to drop everything in my life, my family, my friends, my job and moved 726 miles with only the clothes on my back to start my life with her. That was more than 3 years ago. Dont tell me we dont have a choice in life...you make your own choices no matter what it is.
Yes people will do what they want. Thats why there are laws in place to help prevent people from getting hurt.....dont get me wrong there are some things that i disagree. But if you break the laws and get caught then you have to pay for it.
With already banning of indoor smoking you can bet with some time smoking in apartments, smoking around children in closed areas will become illegal. And Im hopeing this happens.....there are so many people with asthma who live in apartments b/c thats all they can afford. And have episodes b/c 2nd hand smoke gets into there apartment. Have you ever seen people with asthma. Have you ever watch them have flare ups and see them Ketch there breath. Its like having someone grab the back of your head and dunk your head over and over in water and trying to Ketch your breath. I understand why you disagree..with having the mentality....its my life I can do what ever I want to do....even if I hurt people or cause damage one way or another its okay because I can do whatever I want. That type of mentality was cause so much harm. I believe in freedom I also believe in rights of every human being. Which means people also have the right not to have 2nd hand smoke around them in buildings....If there is a chance that you could be harming another person by your second hand smoke then stop and go outside. Its there right also not to have second hand smoke around them.....it goes both ways folks.

Grimmer, but is it always clear that the smoker must give in? Lets say I have been living in an apartment for some time and legally smoke. Someone with asthma moves in next door. Does that mean that now I have to go outside to smoke?

 

[Boom!]

sorry to interrupt your off-topic conversations here but I'm interested in Dr. Siegel's new website. Please move topics of 9-11, sun tans, and sweaty kids to a more general forum. thanks!

 

[grimmer255]

Grimmer, but is it always clear that the smoker must give in? Lets say I have been living in an apartment for some time and legally smoke. Someone with asthma moves in next door. Does that mean that now I have to go outside to smoke?

anyone with respect for others would. Think about what that smoke will do to them. Think about if you had asthma would you want smoke around you. And ] nobody is taking away your smokes just where can smoke them.....its for safety of others. When I smoked I made a choice not to smoke in the apartment and in the car if my girl was in there because my girl has asthma. I always went outside to smoke and walked 50 ft from the building to make sure I wasn't causing her to flare up....if it was raining i went to my car. If it was cold and a blizzard outside I bundled up and chained smoked in my car. Because it was the right thing to do....was it a pain in my ... you bet but it was the right thing to do.

 

[ramblingrose]

No, people do not always have the right to what they perceive as clean air. If the owner of a business wants to allow smoking, why should he not be allowed? It's his business, and non-smokers have the right to go elsewhere. Don't like that a landlord has tenants who smoke? Rent a different apartment. Voila, no one is hurt.

You have an amazing knack for putting blinders on and ignoring every point people make that don't fit in with yours. It's mind boggling how stuck in your ideals you are, and how intolerant of others.

Sure I've seen people with asthma. I've also seen anti-smoking moms whisper to their children to fake coughing when they see smokers come near just because it annoys them.

Body odor makes me physically ill. Do I have the right to ban those people from going about their business? Not last I checked. I guess I should ask for law to protect myself since my right to move away from it isn't enough.

I repeat:
-Why did you smoke if it hurts others? Unless you were in an isolated bubble you're a hypocrite, and as selfish as you say we are.
-Since you believe the BS that's published about second hand smoke and PVs, you need to give it up right now.
-You need to move to your own private island where you grow your own food and generate your own clean power. Almost anything you do in a real world feeds the machine you despise, and has aspects that can hurt people.

 

[grimmer255]

The reason they do these indoor bans b/c there are a lot people with health problems...Is it fair for them not to have fun because the smoker can do waht ever they want. What is so bad about you going outside to have a smoke so you can allow more people to enjoy themselves. You never know who may have asthma or some kind sickness that smoke could cause a flare up. Thats why they did that so everyone can have a good time. You can still go outside and have your smokes then go back inside and join the party. you say well why the smokers have to go outside....again its to benifit everyone including the smoker. You get fresh air while you smoke...think of that way....

 

[grimmer255]

No, people do not always have the right to what they perceive as clean air. If the owner of a business wants to allow smoking, why should he not be allowed? It's his business, and non-smokers have the right to go elsewhere. Don't like that a landlord has tenants who smoke? Rent a different apartment. Voila, no one is hurt.

You have an amazing knack for putting blinders on and ignoring every point people make that don't fit in with yours. It's mind boggling how stuck in your ideals you are, and how intolerant of others.

Sure I've seen people with asthma. I've also seen anti-smoking moms whisper to their children to fake coughing when they see smokers come near just because it annoys them.

Body odor makes me physically ill. Do I have the right to ban those people from going about their business? Not last I checked. I guess I should ask for law to protect myself since my right to move away from it isn't enough.

I repeat:
-Why did you smoke if it hurts others? Unless you were in an isolated bubble you're a hypocrite, and as selfish as you say we are.
-Since you believe the BS that's published about second hand smoke and PVs, you need to give it up right now.
-You need to move to your own private island where you grow your own food and generate your own clean power. Almost anything you do in a real world feeds the machine you despise, and has aspects that can hurt people.

okay fine let me ask you something. Why did you go to vaping....if smoking is not bad for you as you seem to claim yourself....then why do you vape....

 

[sherid]

The Surgeon General's report supports your statements:

The evidence is sufficient to infer a causal relationship between secondhand smoke exposure and odor annoyance.

Peer pressure for stinkyitis from smoke is bad.
Stink from sweat in gym is bad.
Stink from cafeteria taco day is bad.
Children who smell like wet puppy dogs when they come in from playing is bad.
All kids who go to daycare smell strange so that is bad.
No more campfires for the scouts because the smell clings and is bad.
Wood-burning fireplaces leaves an odor that is bad.
Eating at a authentic Asian restaurant leaves odors that cling, it's bad.
Cooking fried fish at home leaves odors for hours...it's bad.

...and the list goes on and on....

Smells are in the nose of the smeller, just as beauty is in the eye of the beholder. When I smell a cigar I foundly recall my father. My great-aunt smelled of lilacs and a touch of cigarette smoke...not offensive to me even in the age of no air conditioning. Our senses are a gift to us but our perceptions of what we sense can become good or bad depending on how we file them away in our memories. I prefer to associate good memories with what I sense. I can only hope my loved ones do the same...otherwise call me stinky pants Ruth.

Did you see this one, the ultimate stink? Ban on cremation smoke and smells in South Australia | South Australia News | News.com.au

 

[grimmer255]

No, people do not always have the right to what they perceive as clean air. If the owner of a business wants to allow smoking, why should he not be allowed? It's his business, and non-smokers have the right to go elsewhere. Don't like that a landlord has tenants who smoke? Rent a different apartment. Voila, no one is hurt.

You have an amazing knack for putting blinders on and ignoring every point people make that don't fit in with yours. It's mind boggling how stuck in your ideals you are, and how intolerant of others.

Sure I've seen people with asthma. I've also seen anti-smoking moms whisper to their children to fake coughing when they see smokers come near just because it annoys them.

Body odor makes me physically ill. Do I have the right to ban those people from going about their business? Not last I checked. I guess I should ask for law to protect myself since my right to move away from it isn't enough.

I repeat:
-Why did you smoke if it hurts others? Unless you were in an isolated bubble you're a hypocrite, and as selfish as you say we are.
-Since you believe the BS that's published about second hand smoke and PVs, you need to give it up right now.
-You need to move to your own private island where you grow your own food and generate your own clean power. Almost anything you do in a real world feeds the machine you despise, and has aspects that can hurt people.

Your right I have intolerance for people who smoke around others who do not. I use to smoke and I always went outside to smoke even before the ban. Why because I respect others who do not smoke.....why should I let them breath in my nasty habbit.

 

[Sar]

anyone with respect for others would. Think about what that smoke will do to them. Think about if you had asthma would you want smoke around you. And ] nobody is taking away your smokes just where can smoke them.....its for safety of others. When I smoked I made a choice not to smoke in the apartment and in the car if my girl was in there because my girl has asthma. I always went outside to smoke and walked 50 ft from the building to make sure I wasn't causing her to flare up....if it was raining i went to my car. If it was cold and a blizzard outside I bundled up and chained smoked in my car. Because it was the right thing to do....was it a pain in my ... you bet but it was the right thing to do.

Okay, lets take it a little further. I am severly allergic to pets. The people that live next to me are pet owners and although my allergy doesn't strike all the time, there are times when just being in the room that is next to them is making me sick. When I walk in the hallway to get to my apartment and they were there in the last 30 minutes, I feel it. Would it be appropriate for me to ask them to give up their pets?

 

[ladyraj]

sorry to interrupt your off-topic conversations here but I'm interested in Dr. Siegel's new website. Please move topics of 9-11, sun tans, and sweaty kids to a more general forum. thanks!

All of the above topics are on the Doc's website...it's just that some myths are hard to get rid of. It's why the Doc became disillusioned in the first place with tobacco control and was kicked off anti-smokers listserves for daring to question methodology. It seems some are intolerant of differing opinions, because the same can be said for Mr Godshall and his fight for harm reduction products. Mr Bill is a reformed heavy smoker and has a unique perspective on the tobacco control fight.

Doc Siegel has updated research for e-cig comparison at:

The Rest of the Story: Tobacco News Analysis and Commentary

 

[ladyraj]

The reason they do these indoor bans b/c there are a lot people with health problems...Is it fair for them not to have fun because the smoker can do waht ever they want. What is so bad about you going outside to have a smoke so you can allow more people to enjoy themselves. You never know who may have asthma or some kind sickness that smoke could cause a flare up. Thats why they did that so everyone can have a good time. You can still go outside and have your smokes then go back inside and join the party. you say well why the smokers have to go outside....again its to benifit everyone including the smoker. You get fresh air while you smoke...think of that way....

If you check the rules and regs for people with disabilities or severe health problems as you offer as justification for blanket bans....you will see they want equal access as healthy people. There is no right to mandate that all places be free of their specific irritant just in case they walk thru the doors of a privately owned business or rental property. If 20% of the population still smoke, shouldn't 20% of venues be open to that segment of clientele if the owner so chooses? You are proposing that we all should be mandated by law to defer to the ill ....rather than exercise good manners when the ill are present. Manners dictated by law are doomed to anger people and get an undesirable response.

After all, isn't pseudo-smoking an e-cig offensive to the nonsmokers who may become fearful by the sheer presense of a cigarette looking device?