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Eliquids, the subjectivity of taste and The Emperor's New Clothes

Discussion in 'General E-Liquid Discussion' started by Silent Scream, Feb 4, 2014.

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  1. Silent Scream

    Silent Scream Super Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 12, 2013
    Like everyone else, when I first started vaping I knew nothing about it so I read forums like this one to get up to speed. I quickly discovered (outside of all the hardware options) there were premium (i.e. luxury) liquids for sale, and then all the 'other ones'.

    I have been painstakingly going through the premium liquids for the last couple of months having already tried the ne'er do wells and have found some of the cheaper ones to be of much, MUCH higher quality.

    I am still amazed how much some sites charge for 10mls of liquid on the basis they are self proclaimed superior products which they actually label 'premium' on the basis of... of what? Maybe their mum told them their eliquids are totally the best and they should rip people off for every cent?

    So weird. I wonder what the world would be like if Justin Beiber declared himself a 'premium' musical talent. Millions of little girls would still pay extra to listen to his drivel. I suppose everything's worth what you're prepared to pay for it.

    I don't really know where I'm going with this other than to say eliquids that sound too expensive are expensive because the makers want them to be. Then you get self-perpetuated myths about how amazing they are because the people who buy them have to somehow justify why they're paying way over the odds for something that's kind of ordinary.

    It's all a bit of mess. I hope somebody sorts it out, I was going to but I can't be bothered.
  2. Sbowlden

    Sbowlden Full Member

    Dec 30, 2013
    Atlanta, Ga.
    I once had a condo in Miami that I tried to sell for $239k for 5 months. I changed the ad to say $749k and it sold in less than a week.
  3. ScottP

    ScottP Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Apr 9, 2013
    Houston, TX
    I buy all of my juice at Mt Baker Vapor. $4.99 for 15ml bottles with completely configurable ratios, all nic levels , and lots of good flavors.
  4. Tinkiegrrl

    Tinkiegrrl Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Nov 18, 2013
    New York, NY
    For me, it isn't about the money the liquid costs. It's about the reputation of being consistent. I usually buy all my liquids at around the middle range. Sometimes upper. I'll vape mtbakervapor once in a while, but I don't have much patience for steeping. Being in NYC, I can vape Five Pawns exclusively and I'll still be in the green compared to smoking. $14 per pack, pack and a half a day equals a LOT of money. If I count my husbands pack and a half a day too, there's a lot more. As long as I'm within my former cigarette budget, I'm happy.

    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
  5. deanthemachine

    deanthemachine Super Member ECF Veteran

    Sep 26, 2013
    OKC, OK
    Yeah as a part-time flipper that is pretty hard to believe. A 240K condo with comps of 750K would have brought all my people out of the cracks we infest for at least a looksie.

    To the OP: I have a friend who prefers Taco Bell to Qdoba. Taste is subjective as your title says.
  6. minimalsaint

    minimalsaint Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 4, 2012
    Ever since I started DIY it makes me sick how much a bottle of liquid costs. Especially the "premium" lines.
    If you have the means and are willing to experiment, I highly suggest giving DIY the old "college try".
  7. TheReign

    TheReign Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Dec 31, 2013
    Kaua'i - Nevada
    gotta try making my own flavors, Liquid just gets a little too expensive some times. How much does it cost for pg/vg and flavoring?
  8. Grimwald

    Grimwald Vaping Master ECF Veteran

    Aug 12, 2012
    Lawrence KS
    Once I discovered that unflavored was the "flavor" I liked most, and I can make 30 mil for less than $2.00, I don't have much tolerance for premium liquids. That has completely changed my vape I get to play around with all of the other shiny objects.
  9. minimalsaint

    minimalsaint Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 4, 2012
    Depends how much science you are willing to throw at your DIY. Right now I'm around .04 per ml for finished liquid.
    500ml 24mg nic base in 100%PG = $25
    500ml VG = $10
    Flavorings vary in cost but are generally cheap.

    I buy base nic at a pretty low strength because I only vape around 8mg and don't really see the need for anything higher, but there are tons of options to consider. Check out the DIY sub forum in the eliquid discussion forum here. Lots of good info, recipes, tips and tricks.

    I cringe at the thought of paying retail for liquids again LOL
  10. ScottP

    ScottP Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Apr 9, 2013
    Houston, TX
    To me the reason for buying high nic base is to stretch the nic juice further. If you started with a nic base of 100mg/ml instead of 24mg/ml then your nic base would last roughly 4 times longer while using more of the cheaper ingredients (0 nic pg and vg).
  11. minimalsaint

    minimalsaint Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 4, 2012
    I completely agree. I stashed a bottle of 100mg base for emergencies but to keep it simple I use the lower strength. 60% VG / 40% PG base and I'm done. I'm the lazy DIY type and I prefer to keep the science to a minimum.
    Even still..... $1.20 for 30ml VS. $15+ for 30ml makes me happy :)
  12. ScottP

    ScottP Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Apr 9, 2013
    Houston, TX
    I just noticed how much you are getting at those prices... where are you getting those deals?
  13. minimalsaint

    minimalsaint Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 4, 2012

    And you can always find a 10% off coupon on the interwebs!
  14. ScottP

    ScottP Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Apr 9, 2013
    Houston, TX
    I week definitely be checking them out. Thanks.
  15. Buggainok

    Buggainok Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Jan 1, 2014
    oklahoma city ok usa
    I get it! Human nature just seems to work that way. I asked my hubby one time how can they possibly sell Rolls Royce automobiles that cost hundreds of thousands of dollars. He said, because there are people who NEED to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on a car. You found that out - someone needed a $749k condo.

    On a far lesser note, we used to always have cats when our kids were little. Which meant that we always had kittens. There are lots of jokes about how hard it is to get RID of kittens. On weekends when there were 50 ads in the paper trying to give away FREE kittens, I ran ads to sell our kittens. They weren't anything special, just cute healthy kittens. I charged $25 and our phone rang off the wall with people wanting to buy our kittens, when there were perfectly nice kittens to be had for free.

    An older, farm-type couple came to get one. The hubby reached into his overalls and handed me the $25. The wife smiled and hugged the kitten and said: "We've never had a cat this nice before."

    So, I think that many times what people are willing to pay for something says far more about them than it does about what they are buying.

    Didn't mean to stray so far from e liquid, but I think the same principles apply somewhat.
  16. Silent Scream

    Silent Scream Super Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 12, 2013
    I started this thread then haven't had a chance to come back to it so sorry for bumping a thread that's a couple of days old just wanted to say to Buggainok no problem you didn't stray at all you actually hit the nail right on the head. If you give people something that's cheap (or free) the first thing they want to know is 'what's wrong with it then?'.

    I think the same applies to eliquids. If you're not being ripped off for 10 dollars for 10mls with something that cost less than a dollar to make it must be 'bad'. Weird. Human beings are weird. There's no getting away from it.
  17. mobocracy

    mobocracy Senior Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 21, 2013
    Managers in an organization where they use a lot of volunteers often pay them, even something nominal, because they get more out of them. Even when "volunteering" people tend to step it up a bit when they're getting something for it.
  18. NiNi

    NiNi Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Feb 4, 2013
    Paulden, Arizona
    Some of us can't set up a "mixing lab" due to animals, children, space, whatever. Others have time constraints. And others just want to make vaping as simple as possible, open the bottle, load the juice, vape.
    All the "gray water" from my house goes to vegetation, NOT the septic, I don't dump harsh or dangerous chemicals down any pipes that drain out to areas my animals may wander.
    I thought I'd be set up the 1st of January, didn't happen.
    After going through a sample run on many, many vendors back in August, I found a vendor, considered to be "Premium", (Not that it mattered) who has ejuice I really enjoy vaping. I probably have enough bottles to get me through the next 6-8 months. Maybe I'll be set up to make my own ejuice, maybe I won't even want to. Been lurking on the DIY threads for months, and it's pretty easy to figure out with my livestock background, mixing this and that, and I already have most of the hardware I need.
    It doesn't matter to me if I pay $$$ a ml, I started vaping to quit smoking, get healthy again, Not save money, even though I'm saving tons compared to gum, patches, or Chantix. And even purchasing this "Premium" ejuice, I still spend less than I would on analogs.

    *Whatever keeps you off the cigs*
  19. retired1

    retired1 Administrator Admin Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Apr 5, 2013
    Moved to General E-Liquid Discussion
  20. xanderxman

    xanderxman Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 10, 2012
    Ptown, VA
    At first I railed against the "so-called" premium liquids. I have recently (in the last month or so) gotten into dripping and my perspective changed. I can truly taste a difference between a "premium" liquid and a not so premium liquid. I hate using the word premium because of the connotations but it is what it is.

    Not every expensive liquid is going to be worth the extra cash but some of them are, for me. There are two liquid suppliers that charge what most consider a rather healthy amount of money per ml that I truly think are worth the extra money. I have tested dozens of brands of liquid and the ones from these two vendors are something I would truly miss vaping.

    I pay damn near $1 per ml for these juices and to me it is worth the difference. They are so complex and tasty that I refuse to give them up. I also vape less expensive liquids and enjoy them as well, just not as much as the expensive ones.

    I look at liquids like others look at wine or beer. I have seen my father pay well over $100 for a bottle of wine because it was a good vintage and the grapes were perfect that year. I would be just as content with a $10 bottle of wine. It all comes down to what the person making the purchase wants.
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