Fair Pricing
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OK, I can speak from some experience, first hand at this...
Yes you can start up an e-cig business for 10K.
In fact you can start one up for less, but you will be starting with a very limited supply, and will have to rely ALL on word of mouth, and your customer service better be the best or it's over before you start. Don't expect to make oodles money, but you can HOPE for enough to pay for your next order, and after about 5 or so of this cycle, you will be making a few dollars. But not enough to rely on it as your sole income, however it's a nice boost. If you start spending that income on anything but your business, you can't grow... so forget about any proffits for a long time.
If you expect to have a website, and sell, you better have a bigger start up fund because you will have plenty of unhappy customers, when you are emailing or calling them to say, I'm all out of X or Y, would you like a substitute??? Not many will walk away happy with that option. I challange anyone to have an online business with options for under 25 - 40K. Sure you can sell a black eGo kit, but if you want to have options for the vast majority, you will need to buy other colors... that's the issue, with 300 kits in an order, and having to order multiple colors, you better have money to put where you mouth is... and then you better have juice or you've just lost that return customer. Sure you can make your own juices, but what if you mess up a batch, or what if what you make isn't selling... then you sit on it, and as mentioned above, who wants year old juice... even you you sell it on clearnce, you may break even.
I don't like to see anyone overpay for anything, but some things, you may sell more of which has to offset what you sell less of in order to keep the business afloat. This market changes month to month, there's a new PV on the market all the time, and like computers, it's simply hard to keep up. Everyone has differnt needs, and you can't expect to cater to each and every vaper out there, but you want to be able to cater to as many as possible. It's simply not cheap "to keep up with the jones".
Yes you can start up an e-cig business for 10K.
In fact you can start one up for less, but you will be starting with a very limited supply, and will have to rely ALL on word of mouth, and your customer service better be the best or it's over before you start. Don't expect to make oodles money, but you can HOPE for enough to pay for your next order, and after about 5 or so of this cycle, you will be making a few dollars. But not enough to rely on it as your sole income, however it's a nice boost. If you start spending that income on anything but your business, you can't grow... so forget about any proffits for a long time.If you expect to have a website, and sell, you better have a bigger start up fund because you will have plenty of unhappy customers, when you are emailing or calling them to say, I'm all out of X or Y, would you like a substitute??? Not many will walk away happy with that option. I challange anyone to have an online business with options for under 25 - 40K. Sure you can sell a black eGo kit, but if you want to have options for the vast majority, you will need to buy other colors... that's the issue, with 300 kits in an order, and having to order multiple colors, you better have money to put where you mouth is... and then you better have juice or you've just lost that return customer. Sure you can make your own juices, but what if you mess up a batch, or what if what you make isn't selling... then you sit on it, and as mentioned above, who wants year old juice... even you you sell it on clearnce, you may break even.
I don't like to see anyone overpay for anything, but some things, you may sell more of which has to offset what you sell less of in order to keep the business afloat. This market changes month to month, there's a new PV on the market all the time, and like computers, it's simply hard to keep up. Everyone has differnt needs, and you can't expect to cater to each and every vaper out there, but you want to be able to cater to as many as possible. It's simply not cheap "to keep up with the jones".
OK,
In light of further reading, i'm going to refine my statement... I did miss that this was starting off on par with the big boys... with that in mind 30K would have to be a bare minimum to make ends meet and have the full functionality that the big boys have...
like Anaconda said above... When i was getting ready to open a shop... we were not looking to get paid a penny for at least 3-6 months... We were planning to offer 510's and eGo's and a few accessories, a product line of maybe 15 items (atties, batteries, PCC's and Cases, etc). As for our Juice offering, we were going to start off with 5-6 juices in 4 strengths (36mg, 24mg, 18mg and 12mg).
we expected that sales would be, not stagnant, but difficult in the beginning... All of the co-investors had full time jobs and we were going to run this in shifts (one of our co-investors is mainly nighttimes so he was going to run the "shop" during the day" and we had a succession plan for what order we were going to quit our day jobs when we hit certain sales figures.
So, Please accept my appology, i misinterpreted... one can start a grassroots startup business for under 10k but to start off being competitive on the grander market and "running with the big dogs' straight out of the gate, i don't think i would want to do it for under 40k...
Cheers,
In light of further reading, i'm going to refine my statement... I did miss that this was starting off on par with the big boys... with that in mind 30K would have to be a bare minimum to make ends meet and have the full functionality that the big boys have...
like Anaconda said above... When i was getting ready to open a shop... we were not looking to get paid a penny for at least 3-6 months... We were planning to offer 510's and eGo's and a few accessories, a product line of maybe 15 items (atties, batteries, PCC's and Cases, etc). As for our Juice offering, we were going to start off with 5-6 juices in 4 strengths (36mg, 24mg, 18mg and 12mg).
we expected that sales would be, not stagnant, but difficult in the beginning... All of the co-investors had full time jobs and we were going to run this in shifts (one of our co-investors is mainly nighttimes so he was going to run the "shop" during the day" and we had a succession plan for what order we were going to quit our day jobs when we hit certain sales figures.
So, Please accept my appology, i misinterpreted... one can start a grassroots startup business for under 10k but to start off being competitive on the grander market and "running with the big dogs' straight out of the gate, i don't think i would want to do it for under 40k...
Cheers,
I've also researched this area. 10 K is enough but you'd better make sure you have the exact products/ juices that are popular. Product sits on the shelf it ends up costing the vendor $$. This is known by anyone that has run a business. Also at 10k investment profit margins would be dismal because bulk orders with a reasonable discount would be impossible. The bottom line with a 10k investment you'd have to be perfectly target market specific and NOT expect profits for quite awhile IMO. If one were to open a business with the greatest profit margin expected asap minimum investment approx 45-50k. As far as juices go a mixing/ filling machine would be a plus but is there a market here for that type of investment? I know many, if not all, of the U.S. vendors already have these so they can mix custom batches in a pinch and are not stuck with batches of unsold juice.
and with a cigarette hangin out of your mouth while pumping!!
theres one thing to do DIY for yourself, small scale, easy to maintain cleanliness... but running an operation out of the house mixing juice... A) you're going to spill a gallon of the stuff on yourself and kill yourself or B) the cat's fur will get into the juice and contaminate it and you'll make a ton of people sick....
If i was going to mix my own on a large scale operation, i'd open up a little factory shop, nothing fancy but definately have a fume hood and PPE for safety...
that 44K doesn't really equate properly... i have a buddy who opened up shop, his business was big enough to go to Vapercon and guess what... of the 800 (10 & 30ml)bottles he brough, less than 200 sold... at $8.00 a bottle(assuming he only sold the 10ml bottles), thats only 1600.. and i can tell you that he paid more than that in product testing, labelling, bottling and website design... and his stuff was fan-friggin-tastic juices... everyone loves them... but sales just didn't reflect public opinion. he now has 600 bottles of juice on hand and sales, even after vapercon are sluggish... and he has 8 different juices available in 5 strengths... he basically made 20 bottles (probably 10 each of 10ml and 30ml) of each flavour and strength...
that said i have a buddy who makes his juice for giveaway... and as a parttime hobby he couldn't keep up... now he's just opened a shop to sell it and his sales are through the roof and all he sells is 5 or 6 different juices... rolling in cash with basic setup...
point is, you just never know... its a gamble... even to open a shop in eastern canada where theres a virtual void it would still be a huge gamble...
theres one thing to do DIY for yourself, small scale, easy to maintain cleanliness... but running an operation out of the house mixing juice... A) you're going to spill a gallon of the stuff on yourself and kill yourself or B) the cat's fur will get into the juice and contaminate it and you'll make a ton of people sick....
If i was going to mix my own on a large scale operation, i'd open up a little factory shop, nothing fancy but definately have a fume hood and PPE for safety...
that 44K doesn't really equate properly... i have a buddy who opened up shop, his business was big enough to go to Vapercon and guess what... of the 800 (10 & 30ml)bottles he brough, less than 200 sold... at $8.00 a bottle(assuming he only sold the 10ml bottles), thats only 1600.. and i can tell you that he paid more than that in product testing, labelling, bottling and website design... and his stuff was fan-friggin-tastic juices... everyone loves them... but sales just didn't reflect public opinion. he now has 600 bottles of juice on hand and sales, even after vapercon are sluggish... and he has 8 different juices available in 5 strengths... he basically made 20 bottles (probably 10 each of 10ml and 30ml) of each flavour and strength...
that said i have a buddy who makes his juice for giveaway... and as a parttime hobby he couldn't keep up... now he's just opened a shop to sell it and his sales are through the roof and all he sells is 5 or 6 different juices... rolling in cash with basic setup...
point is, you just never know... its a gamble... even to open a shop in eastern canada where theres a virtual void it would still be a huge gamble...
ROTFL 20mg nic on average? How nice its a surprise in every bottle
Whats the range? 0mg - 40mg Just kidding with you.
What you have there you could turn into what you claim. But its going to take a whole lot of work and time. Online market is moving towards lines of juice, in different strength avalible all the time, not a we'll do the DIY for you. I think trying to market what you have listed online is like a gas station with a lightbulb and truck. But if you were to market that to friends and people around that you know, you might do very well.
((point is, you just never know... its a gamble... even to open a shop in eastern canada where theres a virtual void it would still be a huge gamble...))
Exactly, why would you want to chance $40Gs when you can do $10Gs for the test flight. No use wasting brick and mortar, gas and extra light bulbs when you don't have to. Makes little sense.
Mismanagement is a force to understand... do it U lose. Why would someone not knowing how and what, even try to start up. Common sense and how to play your dollar is the main stage of any biz. Screw up, you "will" pay. Play your margins properly and you will succeed and profit if you know how to manage your overhead. If you don't and get lazy and sloppy( as some do with continuity), the biz lags and a slowdown will be a certain. If you want to start at $10Gs, it will work(not for a single income) for those that have the time and the knowhow. Everyone doesn't have to run with the big dogs. Extra cash is all some are looking for. Trying to be the "Walmart of Ecigs" takes more than a few ppl. And doing so will injure the ecig biz altogether, when and if that happens...I hope to be vape free by then. I'd hate to see Ma and Pa businesses fall to one major vendor as has happened in the majority of communities we have now.
Exactly, why would you want to chance $40Gs when you can do $10Gs for the test flight. No use wasting brick and mortar, gas and extra light bulbs when you don't have to. Makes little sense.
Mismanagement is a force to understand... do it U lose. Why would someone not knowing how and what, even try to start up. Common sense and how to play your dollar is the main stage of any biz. Screw up, you "will" pay. Play your margins properly and you will succeed and profit if you know how to manage your overhead. If you don't and get lazy and sloppy( as some do with continuity), the biz lags and a slowdown will be a certain. If you want to start at $10Gs, it will work(not for a single income) for those that have the time and the knowhow. Everyone doesn't have to run with the big dogs. Extra cash is all some are looking for. Trying to be the "Walmart of Ecigs" takes more than a few ppl. And doing so will injure the ecig biz altogether, when and if that happens...I hope to be vape free by then. I'd hate to see Ma and Pa businesses fall to one major vendor as has happened in the majority of communities we have now.
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I don't know that the Ma&Pa biz's would neccessarilly fail if there were to be one huge super-vape-mart site...
first, i don't think that the canadian market could bear a large company like that sustainably IMHO, and second, i don't think that they could ever eliminate all the small niche stores... super-vape-mart is unlikely to get the darwin, the GG, the "name your favorite mod" all under one roof... I also don't see the Juice vendors going belly up to the bar to join forces and have their juices sold side by side with each other on a grand scale...
first, i don't think that the canadian market could bear a large company like that sustainably IMHO, and second, i don't think that they could ever eliminate all the small niche stores... super-vape-mart is unlikely to get the darwin, the GG, the "name your favorite mod" all under one roof... I also don't see the Juice vendors going belly up to the bar to join forces and have their juices sold side by side with each other on a grand scale...
Super Vape takes no prisoners. They would probably cut in on any mods, etc. Walmart hammered the buck stores remember. They underpriced the $ store goods to make quite a few go under. Now they are $1 and up stores.
The problem is they will take away the bread and butter of the business. I'm not even scared of price, its availability that is the issue on this one. Overnight they could have stock in their stores which are withing 5 mins of 95% of all vapers. Reach is what is scary about them.
There are markets that Walmart doesn't compete in. If you want a high end stereo, BBQ, bike computer ect. they don't offer those, there are still small specialty stores for those. Would be much the same with the high end mods you mention.
But those specialty stores you are left with are really just fighting for scraps. Its a viable owner run business with at most a handful of employees, not a growing and expanding business.
I guess I don't see anything to fear - either in the existance of a "super vape-mart" nor in that mart closing up smaller businesses.
In all the countries where ecigs have been normalized (with nicotine) and can be openly sold and advertised - not a single "super vape-mart" has appeared.
And those are countries with huge populations in smaller areas - (compared to Canada's miniscule numbers - spread out over the 2nd largest land mass nation on earth). They are nations with greater commerce and far more active retail, more streamlined regulatory frameworks and cheaper advertising.
Those countries have, in fact, increased the number and viability of the small business market in this industry.
If - however - there was a super vape-mart - how would it negatively affect smaller businesses?
I've been to towns with populations of less than 500 - with 10 cigarette venues and 3 grocery stores - all doing good business.
So far the only industries where small business gets swallowed up by super stores is in higher priced goods and services that we normally only purchase every couple years (like furniture, computers, TV's, stereo's) - or irregularly.
Consumables - that we purchase each day or week - that market remains unhindered for solid small businesses - even when the price match point is higher.
In all the countries where ecigs have been normalized (with nicotine) and can be openly sold and advertised - not a single "super vape-mart" has appeared.
And those are countries with huge populations in smaller areas - (compared to Canada's miniscule numbers - spread out over the 2nd largest land mass nation on earth). They are nations with greater commerce and far more active retail, more streamlined regulatory frameworks and cheaper advertising.
Those countries have, in fact, increased the number and viability of the small business market in this industry.
If - however - there was a super vape-mart - how would it negatively affect smaller businesses?
I've been to towns with populations of less than 500 - with 10 cigarette venues and 3 grocery stores - all doing good business.
So far the only industries where small business gets swallowed up by super stores is in higher priced goods and services that we normally only purchase every couple years (like furniture, computers, TV's, stereo's) - or irregularly.
Consumables - that we purchase each day or week - that market remains unhindered for solid small businesses - even when the price match point is higher.
This industry is growing at a very quick pace. As it grows more and more modders are popping up to provide us with better, or different devices and accessories. A prime example is the tanks, when the first appeared they were around $50 some started popping up in the $20s now you can get a dual coil 6ml tank for around $12 including a cart and drip tip.
Mods are way overpriced in most cases. A plain black work box modded to a 510 connection and not variable volt, should cost no more than $15 bucks maybe $20...a Variable voltage maybe $45 to $60, but most want $120 to $140 for the plain ole box mod. (plastic boxes) Monkey boxes or Gripps that are custom made to order are very nice for the money.
I would love to see a super center online for mods and accessories, that would limit some of the gouging. Like $18 for a drip tip...or more in some cases...jeeeeez gimme a break....$8 for a pawn or ming plastic tip...Id just as soon buy a chinese made drip tip with a similar shape for a Buck....
Just my humble thoughts...LOL
Mods are way overpriced in most cases. A plain black work box modded to a 510 connection and not variable volt, should cost no more than $15 bucks maybe $20...a Variable voltage maybe $45 to $60, but most want $120 to $140 for the plain ole box mod. (plastic boxes) Monkey boxes or Gripps that are custom made to order are very nice for the money.
I would love to see a super center online for mods and accessories, that would limit some of the gouging. Like $18 for a drip tip...or more in some cases...jeeeeez gimme a break....$8 for a pawn or ming plastic tip...Id just as soon buy a chinese made drip tip with a similar shape for a Buck....
Just my humble thoughts...LOL
In all the countries where ecigs have been normalized (with nicotine) and can be openly sold and advertised - not a single "super vape-mart" has appeared.
That's because it's normalized but not completely legal. WMT was selling Ecigs for awhile until they found them to be "unacceptable" in the eyes of the FDA and other orgs.
I believe there are deep pockets sitting on the sidelines waiting for the moment Ecigs are approved or deemed acceptable by local authorities. As for WMT they have been importing in ever increasing #'s from China. If they chose, at the drop of a hat, they could import Ecigs by the boatload. They already have the connections and would know exactly who to approach and how to pressure them for good prices. The bottom line is North Americans may say they're patriotic but they still buy lots of stuff from WMT because it's cheap. I believe it's the same with vaping.
All IMHO and I have been supporting Cdn Vendors and have directed a ton of people to Cdn Vendors via posts and pms.
Hey Studio 52 - welcome to the Canadian forums.
There are some mass produced commercial mods at very good prices.
A true mod though, one that a skilled individual has taken the time to think up, to design, to create, to test and test again and custom make in a small workshop - that's worth (imho) whatever value that modder places on it.
Even in my dreams I don't think I could make a mod and have incredible respect for those who do. Whether it's a special custom made drip tip or a special battery - that's the one product I would hate to see mass marketed. I guess to me these things are like art - and you would never ask an artist to create a work for the cost of materials plus 10%. On the same premise, I would never expect a modder to take his/her time to custom make something special at a rock bottom price. That kind of time and attention just can't be bought (IMO).
i smoked cigarellos for years...hate to admit this but they were 15.50 a pack lol....id smoke a pack in a day to a day and a half..... 30 x 15 = 450 a month.... all of a sudden everything seems so cheap lol
Nobody has a gun to your head... BTW I would like one of your $60 VV mods, I would buy one in a heartbeat.
It would be hard to buy the parts to make it for that price, putting a value of zero on your labor.
Mods are a very different market. China does offer some mods at the price you are looking for. Mass produced products. On the other hand, many of the costly mods made this side of the ocean are made by hand.
Its a bit like saying a Rolls should cost that same as a Honda, and a Rolex should cost the same as a Timex.
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