FDA seizing new shipments

[reverendg]

Yvilla already mentioned this, reverend. IIRC her thought (and someone correct me here if I'm wrong) was that if the suppliers got it together they could intervene on the Judge Leon case, which hasn't been finalized yet. Considering the fact that he's on our side, one lawyer with the fees split amongst all participating suppliers might be all it takes to get the FDA off their backs.

Well I'm in if we can ever get it together.

 

[Petrodus]

Dear Sen. Kohl:

Thank you for your kind offer to be of assistance. Would you please launch a Senate Investigation into acts of misfreasance on the part of FDA officials. Ask Margaret Hamberg and Joshua Sharfstein why the FDA misrepresented the science regarding the FDA's limited testing of electronic cigarettes in 2009.....

Outstanding letter KUDOS

I archived the letter and will use it as an outline and resource
when communicating with officials in the future.

 

[Rosco]

Outstanding letter KUDOS

I archived the letter and will use it as an outline and resource
when communicating with officials in the future.

I saved it as well. It is outstanding!!!

 

[PlanetScribbles]

Let's just hope he wasn't speaking rhetorically when he offered to be of assistance

 

[Petrodus]

Want to watch an elected official break out in a sweat,
shake like a leaf on a tree, and crap their pants?

Insist they oppose the FDA on any issue

 

[Lazerrred]

Outstanding letter KUDOS

I archived the letter and will use it as an outline and resource
when communicating with officials in the future.

+ 1000 and same here.

 

[Vocalek]

Let's just hope he wasn't speaking rhetorically when he offered to be of assistance

LOL. Oh, I'm quite sure he was. But it is always fun to assist an opponent in placing his shoe firmly into his mouth by taking him literally at his word.

 

[PlanetScribbles]

LOL. Oh, I'm quite sure he was. But it is always fun to assist an opponent in placing his shoe firmly into his mouth by taking him literally at his word.

I like the way you think Vocalek.

 

[Drewsworld]

Dear Sen. Kohl:

Thank you for your kind offer to be of assistance. Would you please launch a Senate Investigation into acts of misfreasance on the part of FDA officials. Ask Margaret Hamberg and Joshua Sharfstein why the FDA misrepresented the science regarding the FDA's limited testing of electronic cigarettes in 2009.

The FDA succeeded in convincing the public that e-cigarettes are likely to cause cancer and/or poison users by employing pejorative words such as "carcinogens" and "antifreeze" in their press conference. They also failed to tell the whole truth. In a court of law, that is considered perjury. Hamberg and Sharfstein may not have been under oath when they lied, but causing harm to public health is not a lawful act on the part of an employee of a Federal health agency.

Ask Hamberg and Sharfstein how the quantity of "carcinogens" in a days supply of e-cigarette liquid (about 1 ml) compares to the same carcinogens in an FDA-approved nicotine patch. The correct answer is that both contain about 8 nanograms of tobacco-Specific Nitrosamines (TSNAs).

Ask them how the 8 nanograms of TSNAs in a day's supply of e-cigarette liquid compares to the quantity of TSNAs in a pack of cigarettes. The correct answer is that a pack of Marlboros contains 126,000 nanograms. By my calculations that makes one day's worth of smoke over 15,000 times more carcinogenic than e-cigarette vapor.

Ask them whether 1% of the tobacco humectant diethylene glycol, incorrectly referenced as "antifreeze" in the FDA's press release, presents any danger whatsoever at that quantity. The correct answer is "no."

Ask how many e-cigarette cartridges that contain 0.01 ml of diethylene glycol would be required to fatally poison a 150 pound adult. The fatal dosage of diethylene glycol is 1 ml. per kg. of body weight. Thus, the correct answer is 6,600 cartridges, consumed in a single day.

Thousands of smokers who had been considering switching to an electronic cigarette continued to smoke, because the FDA's disinformation led them to falsely believe that smoking is less harmful than using an e-cigarette. Several foreign countries banned e-cigarettes, citing the FDA's "health concerns" as the reason. One has to wonder how many smokers who did not switch have developed irreversable lung damage or cancer during the 18 months that the FDA's disinformation has remained unchallenged.

Dr. Michael Siegel of Boston University has reviewed the available scientific evidence on the safety and effectiveness of e-cigarettes. You can access a copy of his article that was published in the December 2010 issue of the Journal of Public Health Polilcy at http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/centers-institutes/population-development/files/article.jphp.pdf

Dr. Siegel's finding was that "a preponderance of the available evidence shows them to be much safer than tobacco cigarettes and comparable in toxicity to conventional nicotine replacement products."

Several surveys of e-cigarette consumers reveal that between 63% and over 80% are using e-cigarettes as a complete replacement for smoking. Furthermore, more than 90% of users report that their health has improved. This is understandable when you stop to consider that e-cigarette users no longer inhale tar, carbon monoxide, particulates, and thousands of chemicals created by the process of combustion. Nothing is burned in an e-cigarette.

Again I thank you for your offer to be of further assistance. I look forward to your spearheading the investigation into the behavior of FDA officials in this matter.

This is fantastic...Packed with clear and concise points...Im really curious if you will get a reply to this one?

 

[Petrodus]

If the Appeals court says that the Injunction remains in place, and the FDA continues product seizures, we can all write to the Appeals court and ask them to jail Margaret Hamburg for "contempt of court" until the FDA ceases and desists from illegal product seizures.

The FDA lost their appeal... YEA

That means we are 1 step closer to the time when we can start
requesting the Appeals court jail Margaret Hamburg for "contempt of court"

 

[Vocalek]

This is fantastic...Packed with clear and concise points...Im really curious if you will get a reply to this one?

Actually, I wrote this for phonojim who lives in Wisconsin and received one of those "form emails" back from Senator Kohl of WI. I understand that phonojim has sent it to Kohl. I am sure than anyone could take this and change the name to that of their senator or their representative, should they get one of those stupid things that says, "The FDA perfomed limited testing and found carcinogens and antifreeze..."

I have not heard back from my Rep and 2 Senators from Virginia. If any of them are stupid enough to send me the canned "FDA performed..." drivel, they will be recieving a personalized copy of the message I wrote for phonojim to send to Kohl.

 

[Drewsworld]

Actually, I wrote this for phonojim who lives in Wisconsin and received one of those "form emails" back from Senator Kohl of WI. I understand that phonojim has sent it to Kohl. I am sure than anyone could take this and change the name to that of their senator or their representative, should they get one of those stupid things that says, "The FDA perfomed limited testing and found carcinogens and antifreeze..."

I have not heard back from my Rep and 2 Senators from Virginia. If any of them are stupid enough to send me the canned "FDA performed..." drivel, they will be recieving a personalized copy of the message I wrote for phonojim to send to Kohl.

 

[Petrodus]

Actually, I wrote this for phonojim who lives in Wisconsin and received one of those "form emails" back from Senator Kohl of WI. I understand that phonojim has sent it to Kohl. I am sure than anyone could take this and change the name to that of their senator or their representative, should they get one of those stupid things that says, "The FDA preformed limited testing and found carcinogens and antifreeze..."

I have not heard back from my Rep and 2 Senators from Virginia. If any of them are stupid enough to send me the canned "FDA performed..." drivel, they will be receiving a personalized copy of the message I wrote for phonojim to send to Kohl.

Sometimes I feel like grabbing some of our
officials by the neck and ..... slapping them.
The name Linda Rosenthal comes to mind.

For those who might take offense of talk
like that... No apologizes!

 

[Uma]

Please, VocalTek, please put that on Casaa in an easy to find right in your face place for quick reference.

 

[Brewlady]

wrong thread. Nevermind.

 

[afrazier5]

I wonder if the FDA regulates and blocks shipments of glass smoking pipes at the borders? Being the closed minded state that Utah is, our local smoke shops have more glass pipes, bongs and water pipes than I have seen in my existence. Of course these are marketed as 'tobacco' smoking devices rather than nicotine vapor delivery systems.

 

[Aaeli]

I've wondered about that as well. We have two different head shops right here in Wichita, Ks. I don't understand how they're allowed to exist. I think we all know those bongs and pipes aren't meant for tobacco. Yet ecig paraphernalia is confiscated at the border?

The inconsistency makes me want to slap some sense into some officials as well.

 

[afrazier5]

I've wondered about that as well. We have two different head shops right here in Wichita, Ks. I don't understand how they're allowed to exist. I think we all know those bongs and pipes aren't meant for tobacco. Yet ecig paraphernalia is confiscated at the border?

The inconsistency makes me want to slap some sense into some officials as well.

Nice to see someone from Wichita. Moved to SLC from Wichita 6 years ago and have just converted my mother in law over who still lives there. PM me if you have time as I'd like to find out if there are local shops I can send her to for supplies rather than trying to teach her how to use the internet...

 

[Petrodus]

I've wondered about that as well. We have two different head shops right here in Wichita, Ks. I don't understand how they're allowed to exist. I think we all know those bongs and pipes aren't meant for tobacco. Yet ecig paraphernalia is confiscated at the border?

The inconsistency makes me want to slap some sense into some officials as well.

Someone told me they heard a couple of cops in Wichita singing the other day...

"I was going to raid the head shop... But I got High, I got High..."

 

[n2xe]

I've said it before, I'll say it again. Electronic cigarettes are not the issue, tobacco is. We must polarize the issue. If you are anti-ecig, you are pro-tobacco and pro-tobacco-death. Almost 100% of the general public knows the danger of tobacco and will see your point. Painting politicians with the broad pro-tobacco stain is fatal to their cause and a good way to not get re-elected. This has to be the major theme.

Once that is established, they will drag out the antifreeze/carcinogen argument which is easy to shut down with the "it's 1000 times less than a cigarette" antidote. This works like kryptonite but be well versed in the facts.

They will then try the old "we don't know enough about e-cigs" canard. This is a flat out lie. The FDA knows a great deal. They have been scouring the globe and every hospital bed on earth, trying to find someone... anyone harmed by this and they can't. So after 8 years and a million users, all we have are a couple of parts per billion of antifreeze. This is precisely why they keep losing in court. They can't demonstrate any harm.

Finish up with "senator, you are pro-tobacco and your position on this issue will kill people". By the way, a large percentage of the press smokes (it is a high pressure job) and they are sympathetic to the c-cig side.