Getting discouraged :(

[oddballzwife]

since you have some vendor juice you like now there is no harm in just playing around. the reason i asked is I learned almost the hard way you really wont know what you like and you dont like until you have tried them as single flavors. recipes you find are good reference points but you are going to probably not like it as much as the original poster. try a handful of 3 ml or 5 ml flavors at like 10% maybe even 5 % since you are doing mostly TFA and see how you like it by itself . then add some of one to another and see if thats ok , and so on. everyone is different tho but Im sure you will find a system and some good flavors you like enough to start vaping your mixes and eventually one good enough to replace vendors. you got this just read and read and read and try over and over. it will happen sooner than you think

You just reminded me that the first juice I made was grape only at 5% with 0mg nic and it was good. I think I will try your suggestion!

 

[Hoosier]

How many batches did it take you until you found something you REALLY liked? One that you craved the taste of?

Um, average 10 batches per mixing session about 3 times a week for 5 months, so somewhere close to 600.

So you're about 1/60th of the way there...no problem...

 

[wllmc]

grape, black cherry and fresh cream.....mmmmmmm

You just reminded me that the first juice I made was grape only at 5% with 0mg nic and it was good. I think I will try your suggestion!

 

[VapieDan]

Stick with single flavors first. Walk before you run.

 

[cramptholomew]

'Just to clarify - the additives above do enhance flavors...but it's temporary.

Regarding the addition of sucralose (and other additives that diminish flavor)

I'm not sure I agree that they "diminish" flavors, as much as they round off the hard edges. Many, many, flavors I find too harsh, and sometimes antiseptic, and they need some "flattening", as it were. I've tried them both ways, and I've found that I prefer to add sweetness, and/or smooth them out. I've tried some of the flavor molecules, and none have done what simple acids and sweeteners do.

Again, "taste is subjective"...

 

[JeremyR]

Lots of good advice here.. You do have a bit of a backwards problem.. You have too many flavors.. Where do you start.. You have to pick one and them move one when you know what that one takes.

If you liked the one flavor but then became overpowering you need to use less Flavoring, 3/4 - 1/2 as much, and let it steep a while. If some flavors are too strong I find that they quickly become unlikable....

18 mg unflavored nic base should have a good nicotine flavor; if its a Decent nic.

I use the hs desert ship at 5-6% and let steep a week. Try TBA @ 3-4%, and the Indian I've heard @ 6-9%

 

[VapieDan]

Lots of good advice here.. You do have a bit of a backwards problem.. You have too many flavors.. Where do you start.. You have to pick one and them move one when you know what that one takes.

If you liked the one flavor but then became overpowering you need to use less Flavoring, 3/4 - 1/2 as much, and let it steep a while. If some flavors are too strong I find that they quickly become unlikable....

18 mg unflavored nic base should have a good nicotine flavor; if its a Decent nic.

I use the hs desert ship at 5-6% and let steep a week. Try TBA @ 3-4%, and the Indian I've heard @ 6-9%

Tweaking is one thing. Getting a good base first is the best start.

 

[oddballzwife]

You are right I have too many to choose from. I look and its almost overwhelming on where to start! The ONLY reason I got so many is because I got started with my tax refund and my goal was to get enough supplies to last a year. I wanted to make sure I had enough to make whatever I wanted for a year, I don't want to have to buy anything else. My husband and I both vape

Another question, what % should I start with for RY4 Double, 555, and M-Type? I am really aiming for these for my husband, but want to try them myself. He doesn't give me any pointers to go on about what he likes and doesn't like. He just says make whatever. We are both newbies. I want him to find one he likes too, to keep him off the stinkies.

 

[VapieDan]

You are right I have too many to choose from. I look and its almost overwhelming on where to start! The ONLY reason I got so many is because I got started with my tax refund and my goal was to get enough supplies to last a year. I wanted to make sure I had enough to make whatever I wanted for a year, I don't want to have to buy anything else. My husband and I both vape

Another question, what % should I start with for RY4 Double, 555, and M-Type? I am really aiming for these for my husband, but want to try them myself. He doesn't give me any pointers to go on about what he likes and doesn't like. He just says make whatever. We are both newbies. I want him to find one he likes too, to keep him off the stinkies.

Now we enter another realm. Tobacco blends are hard and require the most steeping time. M-Type has a bad rap as a single. I would say do 10% of RY4 and one 10% 555. I do 3% on these but 10% will give you cigarette after taste as well. I hate to tell you this but it will take 1 to 2 weeks before they taste right. Steeping is long for tobacco.

 

[oddballzwife]

Now we enter another realm. Tobacco blends are hard and require the most steeping time. M-Type has a bad rap as a single. I would say do 10% of RY4 and one 10% 555. I do 3% on these but 10% will give you cigarette after taste as well. I hate to tell you this but it will take 1 to 2 weeks before they taste right. Steeping is long for tobacco.

I don't mind the wait, we have a good 200ml vendor juices to get us through the wait. Thank you for your help

 

[we2rcool]

I'm not sure I agree that they "diminish" flavors, as much as they round off the hard edges. Many, many, flavors I find too harsh, and sometimes antiseptic, and they need some "flattening", as it were. I've tried them both ways, and I've found that I prefer to add sweetness, and/or smooth them out. I've tried some of the flavor molecules, and none have done what simple acids and sweeteners do.

Again, "taste is subjective"...

'Sorry, we have to disagree - taste is not subjective on this (at least not on the aspect we were attempting to explain). Of course, our preferences ARE subjective - and we all can mix & vape whatever we like. But the additives mentioned definitely diminish flavor intensity (as well as smooth & round-off-edges).

Take 5 bottles and mix 5 single flavors with your standard vg/pg/nic base. Set them aside.

Take 15 bottles and duplicate everything 3 times...but add sucralose to one set; EM to another; vinegar or lemon juice to the other.

Compare them on day 1, day 3, day 5, day 7 and day 10. The flavor intensity of the first set (the ones without additives), will consistently have more flavor intensity after the 4th-7th day; however the ones with additives may initially be stronger.

 

[JeremyR]

I find the m type to be pretty good at 3% in a rba. So you could be Anywhere from 2-5% depending on how your setup performs and how strong you want your flavor.

The steep depends on the flavoring. Some 2-3 days is fine some of the more difficult 3-4 weeks. I thought the M-Type was fine after a few days to a week.

 

[cramptholomew]

'Sorry, we have to disagree - taste is not subjective on this (at least not on the aspect we were attempting to explain). Of course, our preferences ARE subjective - and we all can mix & vape whatever we like. But the additives mentioned definitely diminish flavor intensity (as well as smooth & round-off-edges).

Take 5 bottles and mix 5 single flavors with your standard vg/pg/nic base. Set them aside.

Take 15 bottles and duplicate everything 3 times...but add sucralose to one set; EM to another; vinegar or lemon juice to the other.

Compare them on day 1, day 3, day 5, day 7 and day 10. The flavor intensity of the first set (the ones without additives), will consistently have more flavor intensity after the 4th-7th day; however the ones with additives may initially be stronger.

Alright, alright. I'll try it. Next time I mix up my ADV, I'll split the batch, and leave 1/2 without ACV and sucralose. We'll see....

 

[Blueser]

I'm a firm believer that the quality of the juice is only as good as the quality of your device. When ascertaining mix results, the person's device is seldom or never a consideration. Even an outstanding mix will taste gross in a poorly performing device. If someone has never experienced the difference in taste between a high quality device (rba/rda) vs entry level devices or cheaply performing clones, they often find fault in the less obvious.

I didn't see where anyone asked what type device the OP was using, the freshness of the coil, battery, voltage etc...there are more factors than just percentages in the end results as to the quality of the mix/juice. What I've found (imo) is the taste of juice is mediocre to poor in all those $10 - $20 devices...juice delivery to the wick and coil degeneration being the main culprits....let alone the fact that voltage is a major consideration as it pertains to the density of different liquids.

People are always looking for advice on what's the best flavor, best pg/vg, best nic, best mix percentages but more often than not are less concerned with their devices. As an example, I know a guy that's been trying to quit smoking and having very little luck, he started vaping and has complained to me several times that he didn't like the taste of any juice. I took a look at his setup...a Kanger Evod starter kit...I pulled his coil and it was so gunked-up the battery would barely if at all deliver any heat to the coil. He was right, his juice tasted awful...nasty, burnt disgusting. He simply didn't know any better. I put in a new replacement coil I had, filled it with a juice I had mixed and let him try it. He said, "now that taste a lot better"...then I let him try the same juice I had in my KFL that had a week old build and he said, "d-a-m-n, there is no comparison, why does your's taste so much better than mine" ...some may say I'm F.O.S*it...those that have compared will know what I'm saying is true...

 

[JeremyR]

^^^ +1
Totally agree it is a fact. Your experience Hinges most on the coil, wicking, atty, & power. With a well set up rba you can easily be at half nic and flavor compared to a clearo.

48mg 20%flvr in a cig like .. my rba at 12 mg 3-5% flvr blows it away

 

[we2rcool]

Alright, alright. I'll try it. Next time I mix up my ADV, I'll split the batch, and leave 1/2 without ACV and sucralose. We'll see....

We've done some controlled testing on this - and we've extended it to different wicking materials/coils. The OP (buffaloguy) did extensive controlled testing, with various levels of PG & VG. Just remember, "one sample" in any test, is generally never enough to yield 'the truth'...however it may be enough to convince someone more testing is needed (or that one sample may convince them the opposite of what multiple samples reveal).

'Not being condescending (I realize you may already know all that) - but since it's "science stuff" we know that not everybody reading knows it

Of course, you may like it best exactly the way you've formulated it...and liking it is what it's all about!

 

[we2rcool]

I'm a firm believer that the quality of the juice is only as good as the quality of your device. When ascertaining mix results, the person's device is seldom or never a consideration. Even an outstanding mix will taste gross in a poorly performing device. If someone has never experienced the difference in taste between a high quality device (rba/rda) vs entry level devices or cheaply performing clones, they often find fault in the less obvious.

I didn't see where anyone asked what type device the OP was using, the freshness of the coil, battery, voltage etc...there are more factors than just percentages in the end results as to the quality of the mix/juice. What I've found (imo) is the taste of juice is mediocre to poor in all those $10 - $20 devices...juice delivery to the wick and coil degeneration being the main culprits....let alone the fact that voltage is a major consideration as it pertains to the density of different liquids.

People are always looking for advice on what's the best flavor, best pg/vg, best nic, best mix percentages but more often than not are less concerned with their devices. As an example, I know a guy that's been trying to quit smoking and having very little luck, he started vaping and has complained to me several times that he didn't like the taste of any juice. I took a look at his setup...a Kanger Evod starter kit...I pulled his coil and it was so gunked-up the battery would barely if at all deliver any heat to the coil. He was right, his juice tasted awful...nasty, burnt disgusting. He simply didn't know any better. I put in a new replacement coil I had, filled it with a juice I had mixed and let him try it. He said, "now that taste a lot better"...then I let him try the same juice I had in my KFL that had a week old build and he said, "d-a-m-n, there is no comparison, why does your's taste so much better than mine" ...some may say I'm F.O.S*it...those that have compared will know what I'm saying is true...

Preach it, Blueser! It's so very true (and SO commonly overlooked).

 

[dannyv45]

I think you are getting overwhelmed with all the selection and one flavor eventually bleeds into another. You seem to have over indulged in your buying. But it's not over yet. You just need to take a step back and take a deep breath and simplify. You need to go back to the basics and learn how to make a simple mix first then zero in on making it perfect for you.

So let’s start with a simple exercise. I read earlier you would like to make a simple RY4 so go to my blog and read it and follow the recipe. I will guarantee you will learn a lot.


Mixing 101, The Basics - A simple walk through on mixing a favorate standard... RY4

And here is some other helpful reading.

my blogs

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blogs/dannyv45/

hoosier's blogs.

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blogs/hoosier/

the stickies at the top of the page are also very helpful.

this reading material will explain a lot of the how's and why's.

 

[doots]

I'm a firm believer that the quality of the juice is only as good as the quality of your device. When ascertaining mix results, the person's device is seldom or never a consideration. Even an outstanding mix will taste gross in a poorly performing device. If someone has never experienced the difference in taste between a high quality device (rba/rda) vs entry level devices or cheaply performing clones, they often find fault in the less obvious.

I didn't see where anyone asked what type device the OP was using, the freshness of the coil, battery, voltage etc...there are more factors than just percentages in the end results as to the quality of the mix/juice. What I've found (imo) is the taste of juice is mediocre to poor in all those $10 - $20 devices...juice delivery to the wick and coil degeneration being the main culprits....let alone the fact that voltage is a major consideration as it pertains to the density of different liquids.

People are always looking for advice on what's the best flavor, best pg/vg, best nic, best mix percentages but more often than not are less concerned with their devices. As an example, I know a guy that's been trying to quit smoking and having very little luck, he started vaping and has complained to me several times that he didn't like the taste of any juice. I took a look at his setup...a Kanger Evod starter kit...I pulled his coil and it was so gunked-up the battery would barely if at all deliver any heat to the coil. He was right, his juice tasted awful...nasty, burnt disgusting. He simply didn't know any better. I put in a new replacement coil I had, filled it with a juice I had mixed and let him try it. He said, "now that taste a lot better"...then I let him try the same juice I had in my KFL that had a week old build and he said, "d-a-m-n, there is no comparison, why does your's taste so much better than mine" ...some may say I'm F.O.S*it...those that have compared will know what I'm saying is true...

Well said and very true..

 

[dannyv45]

I'm a firm believer that the quality of the juice is only as good as the quality of your device. When ascertaining mix results, the person's device is seldom or never a consideration. Even an outstanding mix will taste gross in a poorly performing device. If someone has never experienced the difference in taste between a high quality device (rba/rda) vs entry level devices or cheaply performing clones, they often find fault in the less obvious.

I didn't see where anyone asked what type device the OP was using, the freshness of the coil, battery, voltage etc...there are more factors than just percentages in the end results as to the quality of the mix/juice. What I've found (imo) is the taste of juice is mediocre to poor in all those $10 - $20 devices...juice delivery to the wick and coil degeneration being the main culprits....let alone the fact that voltage is a major consideration as it pertains to the density of different liquids.

People are always looking for advice on what's the best flavor, best pg/vg, best nic, best mix percentages but more often than not are less concerned with their devices. As an example, I know a guy that's been trying to quit smoking and having very little luck, he started vaping and has complained to me several times that he didn't like the taste of any juice. I took a look at his setup...a Kanger Evod starter kit...I pulled his coil and it was so gunked-up the battery would barely if at all deliver any heat to the coil. He was right, his juice tasted awful...nasty, burnt disgusting. He simply didn't know any better. I put in a new replacement coil I had, filled it with a juice I had mixed and let him try it. He said, "now that taste a lot better"...then I let him try the same juice I had in my KFL that had a week old build and he said, "d-a-m-n, there is no comparison, why does your's taste so much better than mine" ...some may say I'm F.O.S*it...those that have compared will know what I'm saying is true...

Very well said and very often overlooked and likely could be a big part of the OP's issue. I vape a dark chocolate mix in my KFL and when my KFL is fresh I get a strong chocolatly delightful vapor after a week the KFL is so gunked I get nothing but tasteless vapor and know I need to clean or rebuild it.