- Status
Got my ravens today.
I have not been following this thread since they dropped because I JUST KNEW these would work like my other phoenix bottom coils. So I did not feel the need, on this item, to follow this thread to see HOW these little boogers were working for folks. WISH I HAD!!!!!!
FIRST thing I noticed... droplets of liquid inside the tube.. OH BOY
I got a few of these. I have not checked those for liquid in the tube yet.
Needless to say, it got a bath right out of the package...
After its bath, I filled it up, let it sit a few minutes and took a LONG, what I thought would be glorious hit. UMMMMM nope. My throat still burns for that massive dry hit.
my juice is 80/20 PG/VG if that matters.
So i said, ok, I will let this sit a little longer.
Vaped my vivi for about 30 minutes and picked up the Raven again. MASSIVE dry hit.
That's when I thought, based on the review's (Lord Davon, Chris etc) I MUST be doing something wrong. So off to this thread I go.
To my SURPRISE, I now see why I am not having the results as the testers.. these are not the SAME Ravens they tested.
I was so excited to get these, AND was so SHOCKED to see liquid inside the tube, I did not even notice the seal not being in there. I ripped the package open, saw the droplets of liquid, gave it a bath and filled it up.
So...I am going to abide by Thumpers rule here "If you can't say nuthin nice, don't say nuthin at all"
OH BOY.. Off to the "No GO Box" these go...I am going to need a bigger box if this keeps up.......................
Thanks for trying Dan and Chris.
I have not been following this thread since they dropped because I JUST KNEW these would work like my other phoenix bottom coils. So I did not feel the need, on this item, to follow this thread to see HOW these little boogers were working for folks. WISH I HAD!!!!!!
FIRST thing I noticed... droplets of liquid inside the tube.. OH BOY
I got a few of these. I have not checked those for liquid in the tube yet.
Needless to say, it got a bath right out of the package...
After its bath, I filled it up, let it sit a few minutes and took a LONG, what I thought would be glorious hit. UMMMMM nope. My throat still burns for that massive dry hit.
my juice is 80/20 PG/VG if that matters.
So i said, ok, I will let this sit a little longer.
Vaped my vivi for about 30 minutes and picked up the Raven again. MASSIVE dry hit.
That's when I thought, based on the review's (Lord Davon, Chris etc) I MUST be doing something wrong. So off to this thread I go.
To my SURPRISE, I now see why I am not having the results as the testers.. these are not the SAME Ravens they tested.
I was so excited to get these, AND was so SHOCKED to see liquid inside the tube, I did not even notice the seal not being in there. I ripped the package open, saw the droplets of liquid, gave it a bath and filled it up.
So...I am going to abide by Thumpers rule here "If you can't say nuthin nice, don't say nuthin at all"
OH BOY.. Off to the "No GO Box" these go...I am going to need a bigger box if this keeps up.......................
Thanks for trying Dan and Chris.
I had 2 orders in.....one just showed up, the other one did not. I did have one Raven in this order....added a third one when I went back to get the filly funnel. Just checked it out....definitely the big open tube. Filled it with butterscotch bon bon (didn't want to chance my new Hush sample...lol), 3 primer puffs, and lots of vaper off the first couple of hits. Not much flavor yet....so going to let it sit for a little while and then go back to it.
I expect my Ravens will arrive about 3PM here in western rural NM today, that would be 4pm Texas time. I'm going to try them and report here back to Danno as requested. Let us all be a help, not a hindrance!
I have rather heavily invested in the Ravens as have most of you. Danno has stated that he is going to make things right, I believe him. BUT he needs sane, honest input to assess the case. Let's please be adults and respond thusly, as he requested.
I am concerned for GV that they may have little legally bound recourse with the Chinese. Very sticky situation I would think. In this country such work is done by contractual agreement with specifications that must be met else it can go to litigation, the non-performer generally loses. What can be done with the off-shore manufacturer in a communist country I haven't the slightest idea, never been involved with foreign contracts, so I wouldn't know. This has to be a most difficult thing for GV, glad I don't have to figure it out.
So, let us faithfully support Danno and GV as he has good faith committed to do right by us. Y'all, try not to whine, piss and k'vetch all the time. Let's be pro-active as we are able. I may have to eat the expense of about a dozen of these too. Life goes on, POOP HAPPENS. (Moral-thought-police won't let me say it how I wanted, we're in church? Oh well).
Sempre Avanti!
Ciao.
I have rather heavily invested in the Ravens as have most of you. Danno has stated that he is going to make things right, I believe him. BUT he needs sane, honest input to assess the case. Let's please be adults and respond thusly, as he requested.
I am concerned for GV that they may have little legally bound recourse with the Chinese. Very sticky situation I would think. In this country such work is done by contractual agreement with specifications that must be met else it can go to litigation, the non-performer generally loses. What can be done with the off-shore manufacturer in a communist country I haven't the slightest idea, never been involved with foreign contracts, so I wouldn't know. This has to be a most difficult thing for GV, glad I don't have to figure it out.
So, let us faithfully support Danno and GV as he has good faith committed to do right by us. Y'all, try not to whine, piss and k'vetch all the time. Let's be pro-active as we are able. I may have to eat the expense of about a dozen of these too. Life goes on, POOP HAPPENS. (Moral-thought-police won't let me say it how I wanted, we're in church? Oh well).
Sempre Avanti!
Ciao.
Ill help you talk with them Dan. Usually my talk just gets me banned from their shipyards for a few hours till they realize they cant proceed with the FAT [and get the check] without the engineer representing the customer. And over there Ive blown my cover and they know I understand a lot of whats being said in the meetings and not being translated into English with the same attitude it was said in Chinese. In defense I never caught the Chinese really lying about what was going on, just deep shading of what was being said to get me to accept some of the tests. If I found something obviously wrong they were on it.
Started another Raven tank, 70-30 PG VG, doing OK but if it was a Phoenix Id be filing a slot in the bottom of the tube for more flavor BUT no dry hits. If that outer tube could be rotated the slot size could be changed.
Get back to your other work.
I went and opened up my other baby raven. Droplets of liquid in that one as well. My Daddy Raven is dry.
This may be part of the Funky taste I am getting even though I gave it a bath.
I am going to drain the juice and wash this puppy again. Dry burn a few times and give it another go.
Before you fill em up, check for primer in the Baby Ravens. This may be the funky taste....
This may be part of the Funky taste I am getting even though I gave it a bath.
I am going to drain the juice and wash this puppy again. Dry burn a few times and give it another go.
Before you fill em up, check for primer in the Baby Ravens. This may be the funky taste....
It's not just the "it's better this way, trust us" thing. It made it cheaper for them to make while still charging GV the same amount, unless I'm mistaken. I'm pretty ticked off on GV's behalf, actually.
As for the quality, this flat out cannot be left as it is. It's completely unacceptable. At first, it was alright. There was a primer taste (by the way, that's the droplets you saw in the tube) but it was gone within about 5 hits. Then, I got the flavor of my juice for maybe 5 or so more hits. Then, dry hits. Ugh. Like, BAD dry hits that kill your throat. I let it sit for a bit and I got a few more good hits, then it did it again.
Tried to fit a 1.3ml Phoenix metal tube in, it's too long. Not only that, it doesn't fit into the bottom securely, it's just loose in there. Too small in diameter.
Tried a 3ml Phoenix metal tube since it's a bit shorter and it is a decent length for this thing but still too lose. I thought, meh. I'll just set it in there and use the rubber seal to hold it in place. Couldn't fit the drip tip in securely.
Broke out my rubber drip tip to hold the post in place and this worked as far as fitting it in goes. Didn't help at all with the dry hits.
Investigated the holes in the casing. One side is almost completely open. The other side is only halfway open with some sort of metal tube inside of the tube partially blocking it. I'm assuming that this is what you all were talking about when you were mentioning it being adjustable.
Tried to push the metal to the side and it wouldn't budge no matter what I did. I seriously don't know what to do. Maybe I'll try to thread a short piece of wick through the holes and hope it doesn't pull out of them when I push it back into the tank.
Dan, that's my take on this and my mind is totally open. It looks amazing and the build seems really sturdy. It's simple to fill and all of my tips fit really well. It just sucks otherwise.
(disclaimer: standard eGo battery fully charged, 80pg/20vg maple flavored juice that's as thin as 100pg)
As for the quality, this flat out cannot be left as it is. It's completely unacceptable. At first, it was alright. There was a primer taste (by the way, that's the droplets you saw in the tube) but it was gone within about 5 hits. Then, I got the flavor of my juice for maybe 5 or so more hits. Then, dry hits. Ugh. Like, BAD dry hits that kill your throat. I let it sit for a bit and I got a few more good hits, then it did it again.
Tried to fit a 1.3ml Phoenix metal tube in, it's too long. Not only that, it doesn't fit into the bottom securely, it's just loose in there. Too small in diameter.
Tried a 3ml Phoenix metal tube since it's a bit shorter and it is a decent length for this thing but still too lose. I thought, meh. I'll just set it in there and use the rubber seal to hold it in place. Couldn't fit the drip tip in securely.
Broke out my rubber drip tip to hold the post in place and this worked as far as fitting it in goes. Didn't help at all with the dry hits.
Investigated the holes in the casing. One side is almost completely open. The other side is only halfway open with some sort of metal tube inside of the tube partially blocking it. I'm assuming that this is what you all were talking about when you were mentioning it being adjustable.
Tried to push the metal to the side and it wouldn't budge no matter what I did. I seriously don't know what to do. Maybe I'll try to thread a short piece of wick through the holes and hope it doesn't pull out of them when I push it back into the tank.
Dan, that's my take on this and my mind is totally open. It looks amazing and the build seems really sturdy. It's simple to fill and all of my tips fit really well. It just sucks otherwise.
(disclaimer: standard eGo battery fully charged, 80pg/20vg maple flavored juice that's as thin as 100pg)
I think I need to go dig up some of my "okay but not great" juice to try with this thing when it comes in. I would be really upset to waste my cheesecake...lol.
I learned a while back not to use good juice in new cartos etc. I have a 80/20 Pg/Vg mix i use just for the cause. No nic and no flavor. If It passes the dry hit and funky taste test, then I add in my good juice. 
Keep up the hard work Dan and Chris. We all Love you and appreciate all you do for the Vaping Community !!!!!!!!
Keep up the hard work Dan and Chris. We all Love you and appreciate all you do for the Vaping Community !!!!!!!!
I agree yiddle , I will try it open minded , I was just trying to make sure I was clear on how Danno wanted us to proceed . I didn't have a lot of time this morning to read a bunch of post , just caught bits and pieces of what the problem was. Normally people here and the entire ecf forum are kind enough to answer questions no matter how stupid , ignorant , or how many times they already been asked, or how obvious the answer maybe. But anyways , will give them a try when I get home .
Can we all take a deep breath and calm down, please?We're all a little bummed by this, Chris and Dan have got to be for sure. Most of us don't even have them in our hands yet, but should be receiving them today. So far we're only hearing from two people who received them. Danno has asked that we try and approach this with an open mind and try one when received and report back here. Having the opinions of many will help them decide how to approach the situation and what to do about it.
Most of us don't have money to burn, I sure don't. I live on SSI and I ordered a bunch of the cartos. Dan and Chris bend over backward trying to help resolve any issues we might have with any of their products, so that makes me want to try and help them on this in return.
Time for my 2 cents.
The Raven's were so highly anticipated because of the huge success on the XL's and the 3ml BC's. How could a tank go wrong if they stuck with the same basic, simple concept. How do you say in Chinese "If it ain't broke ... don't fix it". What the F.....!
I get the 8 I ordered today along with 8 spare carto's and I can honestly say this is one vapemail that I could care less if it get's delivered or not. Well actually I got three juices in there and I do care about them. I'll try one just cause Danno wants more opinions but I can not see any other result coming from me that has not already come from experienced vapor's in previous posts of this thread.
I've been disappointed by some past items I have tried, but this whole situation is ludacrous. I am not unhappy ... I am truly saddened.
The Raven's were so highly anticipated because of the huge success on the XL's and the 3ml BC's. How could a tank go wrong if they stuck with the same basic, simple concept. How do you say in Chinese "If it ain't broke ... don't fix it". What the F.....!
I get the 8 I ordered today along with 8 spare carto's and I can honestly say this is one vapemail that I could care less if it get's delivered or not. Well actually I got three juices in there and I do care about them. I'll try one just cause Danno wants more opinions but I can not see any other result coming from me that has not already come from experienced vapor's in previous posts of this thread.
I've been disappointed by some past items I have tried, but this whole situation is ludacrous. I am not unhappy ... I am truly saddened.
Payday didn't fall in line with the Raven drop, so I won't have a chance to see for myself what the problems are with this unit.
I just wanna say that GV's has some of the best customer service I have witnessed in any "mom & pop" type establishment. Dan was here into the wee hours of the morning trying to sort this out and was back with the roosters (that is if he even slept!). Between the telescope last week and the raven this week, these guys have done a great job! Quick to respond, accurate and genuinely interested in customer support. To me, this kind of thing separates the AMAZING companies from the, well, everybody else.
My 8 years of QA Manager has me brainstorming on how these events could be avoided in the future. I have a suggestion. Perhaps the events of the last few weeks could serve as a lesson a bit in the QA department (another one of Dan & Chris's many hats). The highly awaited arrival of the Raven had them out the door before the boxes cooled off from the hot plane trip. I understand not every product should need to go through Alpha, but I do think every *new* product should be thoroughly examined before it hits the shelves. I don't think the customers would complain one bit if they were told...."The Ravens are here, we need 3 days to sample 5% (or even 3%) of the shipment to insure consistency and craftsmanship of this new product launch." That percentage of 'gently used' items could then be offered at a slight discount, or in this case full price with a free sample of the juice that was used to test.
The biggest problem I see with the Ravens is that only Chris sampled the product. Dan never handled them until the day they arrived. He had no way of knowing the difference. Chris tested and gave the A OK as he had it in hand. We knew there were some kind of changes during production to 'prevent leaking'. Again, I don't think customers would have had a problem with waiting the few days for Chris to retest the newest revision and give a final stamp of approval.
Lessons learned of course GV's is growing and with that will be growing pains. I know we will all look back in a few years with the ..... 'gosh, remember when this happened' ......and be amazed at how things were handled and how far they will have come!!
Can't wait for this to be ironed out and have a few pretty Raven's sitting proudly on my desk!!!!
I just wanna say that GV's has some of the best customer service I have witnessed in any "mom & pop" type establishment. Dan was here into the wee hours of the morning trying to sort this out and was back with the roosters (that is if he even slept!). Between the telescope last week and the raven this week, these guys have done a great job! Quick to respond, accurate and genuinely interested in customer support. To me, this kind of thing separates the AMAZING companies from the, well, everybody else.
My 8 years of QA Manager has me brainstorming on how these events could be avoided in the future. I have a suggestion. Perhaps the events of the last few weeks could serve as a lesson a bit in the QA department (another one of Dan & Chris's many hats). The highly awaited arrival of the Raven had them out the door before the boxes cooled off from the hot plane trip. I understand not every product should need to go through Alpha, but I do think every *new* product should be thoroughly examined before it hits the shelves. I don't think the customers would complain one bit if they were told...."The Ravens are here, we need 3 days to sample 5% (or even 3%) of the shipment to insure consistency and craftsmanship of this new product launch." That percentage of 'gently used' items could then be offered at a slight discount, or in this case full price with a free sample of the juice that was used to test.
The biggest problem I see with the Ravens is that only Chris sampled the product. Dan never handled them until the day they arrived. He had no way of knowing the difference. Chris tested and gave the A OK as he had it in hand. We knew there were some kind of changes during production to 'prevent leaking'. Again, I don't think customers would have had a problem with waiting the few days for Chris to retest the newest revision and give a final stamp of approval.
Lessons learned of course
GV's is growing and with that will be growing pains. I know we will all look back in a few years with the ..... 'gosh, remember when this happened' ......and be amazed at how things were handled and how far they will have come!! Can't wait for this to be ironed out and have a few pretty Raven's sitting proudly on my desk!!!!
Wally, been waiting for you to show up. I knew how disappointed you would be, as all of us are that awaited this one. I am thinking I am going to try one of the 3ml phoenix since I love the xl's so much.
Well put, Ok I see now you weren't kidding when you mentioned you were a lawyer : )
Anyway please understand, no one will have to eat anything. We, Chris and I, promise you that. We will handle this as though we ourselves purchased these with the expectations represented and put forth.
I just want to get the full picture first. Then will probably release my video I made in the wee hours last night after my talk with them.
(btw, bolding OP was mine)
Anyway please understand, no one will have to eat anything. We, Chris and I, promise you that. We will handle this as though we ourselves purchased these with the expectations represented and put forth.
I just want to get the full picture first. Then will probably release my video I made in the wee hours last night after my talk with them.
(btw, bolding OP was mine)
I am curious to see this video, not for the content as I already have an idea of what you will be saying, but to see ANGRY DAN.
How simple it should have been IT. XL's - great. 3ml's - great. All they had to do was slip the same basic design in a tank. Doh...let's make it better...NOT.
Like my mom used to say "Que sera sera".
I let it sit for almost 40 minutes and tried again. I'm getting the same results as Bonnie.....dry hits, with a couple of decent ones interspersed after primer puffs. Tried priming the coil as Dan recommended in the video.....couple of good hits, and then back to nasty dry hits. It just doesn't seem to be able to get juice to the coil.....
Exactly. This was an established, proven supplier whom we had worked with on the release of one of the more widely accepted and praised cartomizers that have ever been released. I think they honestly goofed, wanting this thing to be 'perfect'. I think they felt pressure when they discovered more leakage than they expected.
Where they went off the rails is when they made such a radical change, didn't send us to test, much less even tell us a departure from the fundamental design of the Phoenix. They knew of the high anticipation for this, they follow our threads, so I think they felt pressure to get it out even though Chris and I told them, no matter how long you need, do this right the first time, don't care if it takes extra weeks or whatever...
Where they went off the rails is when they made such a radical change, didn't send us to test, much less even tell us a departure from the fundamental design of the Phoenix. They knew of the high anticipation for this, they follow our threads, so I think they felt pressure to get it out even though Chris and I told them, no matter how long you need, do this right the first time, don't care if it takes extra weeks or whatever...
Time for my 2 cents.
The Raven's were so highly anticipated because of the huge success on the XL's and the 3ml BC's. How could a tank go wrong if they stuck with the same basic, simple concept. How do you say in Chinese "If it ain't broke ... don't fix it". What the F.....!
I get the 8 I ordered today along with 8 spare carto's and I can honestly say this is one vapemail that I could care less if it get's delivered or not. Well actually I got three juices in there and I do care about them. I'll try one just cause Danno wants more opinions but I can not see any other result coming from me that has not already come from experienced vapor's in previous posts of this thread.
I've been disappointed by some past items I have tried, but this whole situation is ludacrous. I am not unhappy ... I am truly saddened.
HD. Probably not wicking right because air is being drawn through a huge opening instead of a skinny tube. Totally lacking any type of vacuum effect.
Irish, I do know the 3ml's aren't too VG friendly. Hubby uses and adores them, but they just won't work with my go to VG juices. There are mod's that can be done, but I haven't had the chance to get a few more 3ml's to play around with (hubby won't give up his for my testing purposes, lol). Also have instructions for moding the XL's, but haven't had 2 min of concentration time to mess with them. School starts Monday!
For now I'm sticking with the Vivi's and Stardust.- Status
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