You sure did!
I'm so glad you're OK! Thanks for letting us know!!!
[And thanks to Sea and Rose for tracking him down.
]Houston, we have a problem...BE nic titration results
- Thread starter Kurt
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You sure did!
I'm so glad you're OK! Thanks for letting us know!!!
[And thanks to Sea and Rose for tracking him down.
]
I think any use of that forum would be good.
If suppliers want to use it in any way, they are welcome. Likewise members.
I live in hope that one day vendors will publish details of their QC, and some test results. Perhaps I'll hear it on my deathbed, then I can die happy...
Before the discovery of a serious deficiency in the industry, the e-cig community that visits this forum was nice and comfortable thinking the industry was made up of all conscientious folk that knew what they were doing, giving us the feeling we were safe and the products we purchased were good. Well, that has changed. We now realize the evidence Kurt produced shows there are some serious matters in the industry that demand being addressed. Testing e-liquid is just one out of many. This thread is still in its infancy discovering all the aspects that make the industry safe for and responsible to the consumers. Things need to be talked out, opinions need to be listened to and us consumers with the money that sustains the industry must insist on some form of regulation. Whether regulation is by the government or the industry is a major concern to many. That IMHO is what the topic of this thread is all about.
I tried to go to the new forum, but ran into an error saying it doesn't exist...just thought you'd like to know.
Roly, you may have to die unhappy, but you are a happy dreamer when alive. I don't think vendors will publish their QC procedures. That opens them up to criticism (bad for PR), and there will always be criticism be someone with more knowledge that wants to strut their stuff. You are on the right track, so keep thinking out loud.
Sarge, now you really got my curiosity up. Would you please tell what you believe to be the topic of this thread? TIA
I was at 2 sig figs. That 121 mg should really be read as 120 mg. No matter, the solutions I standardized for this had to be standardized for the labs I am running coming up anyway. They use 4 sig figs.
How about opening a thread in the QC forum on the topic of industry regulation and then this can be discussed, but away from here. Ok ?
Debating whether and how self-regulation / independent organisation / trade body / FDA might work, pros and cons, etc., as it relates to QC.
Quick1 :
My thoughts are:
- first some multi-level standards need to be defined.
- then some method/procedure to "certify" conformance with the above.
Sounds like a good starting point for how a trade body or somethin like that might work. Would make a good second thread over at the QC forum.
1) Can self-regulation work ?
2) How might self-regulation work ?
Then maybe a mod can move these QC posts over to there.
Debating whether and how self-regulation / independent organisation / trade body / FDA might work, pros and cons, etc., as it relates to QC.
Quick1 :
My thoughts are:
- first some multi-level standards need to be defined.
- then some method/procedure to "certify" conformance with the above.
Sounds like a good starting point for how a trade body or somethin like that might work. Would make a good second thread over at the QC forum.
1) Can self-regulation work ?
2) How might self-regulation work ?
Then maybe a mod can move these QC posts over to there.
Last edited:
Vendors (most, if any) are VERY unlikely to post up their QC and procedures in an open forum. Why expose yourself to that and get dragged into a game of innuendo and one upmanship by your competitors? Not to mention the implied obligation to respond to any level of laymen (with respect to QC) customers. That whole thing about credit card fraud/theft and online store billing systems we went through a while ago is a fine example...
It's not going to be a simple problem with an overnight answer.
My thoughts are:
- first some multi-level standards need to be defined.
- then some method/procedure to "certify" conformance with the above.
The above would need to be hammered out with some people with expertise in this field along with participating vendors. Doable but will require quite some effort, coordination, and participation of qualified people and willing vendors ... and some time. It's not going to happen with just everybody posting up "I think they should do this or that". Without that it will more than likely just blow over in the same way previous flaps have with no significant long term change. There is a little inertia right now with a couple of people with some expertise. Vendors would have an incentive to participate if it looked like it was going anywhere.
It's not going to be a simple problem with an overnight answer.
My thoughts are:
- first some multi-level standards need to be defined.
- then some method/procedure to "certify" conformance with the above.
The above would need to be hammered out with some people with expertise in this field along with participating vendors. Doable but will require quite some effort, coordination, and participation of qualified people and willing vendors ... and some time. It's not going to happen with just everybody posting up "I think they should do this or that". Without that it will more than likely just blow over in the same way previous flaps have with no significant long term change. There is a little inertia right now with a couple of people with some expertise. Vendors would have an incentive to participate if it looked like it was going anywhere.
There is some kind of a fault with the new forum. Some can see it, some can't. It will have to wait until the Form Manager can take a look - sorry.
Sarge,
Sir, not to rile you up, sir!
Sir, permission to speak freely, sir?
The original poster posted about his NIC being way too strong. He purchased a consumer product that was defective, poisonous and lived to tell the tale. If this was any other product manufactured for ingestion by the human body, it would be regulated by the FDA.
Look how long this has taken to sort out and actually find out that the was an issue with BE nicotine. If memory serves me, the first instance of bad BE nicotine being shipped was April or May of this year. It is now November and we just now discovered the problem? That is way too long! I bet most consumers of vaping products keep 1 months supply on hand at any one time.
And just what was THE CEO's initial response when this life threatening situation was brought to his attention? Blame everyone else but himself! "THERE IS NO WAY THAT THE JUICE IN QUESTION WAS SHIPPED FROM BE!" (Okay...I paraphrased a bit.)
There may be others like THE CEO and Box Elder out there. Using his POCKETBOOK as his QC department. We just have not stumbled upon them yet. That is a very scarey thought. If the only regulation is self regulation and it is voluntary, it is just a matter of time until it happens again.
Sir, regards, sir,
Pete
well... i just got a email from gourmet vapor. 50% off sale and they are now stating "We also recommend using my freedom smokes "or any other honest and accountable nictotine provider for all your other DIY needs." Does this mean they no longer think box elder is not a "honest and accountable nictotine provider"..
i deleted out the my freedom smokes link that was in the email.. i was not sure if i could post a link or not....
WOWZERS
Very curious indeed.
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