How do you inhale?

[JerseyGirl]

reading through this, everyone does realise that "mouth inhalers" do inhale into their lungs right. The difference between the two is like the difference between drinking a pint and dowining it, both still get the drink into your stomach.

I think the difference is in how long the vapor is spending in your mouth, vs. in your lungs. (Assuming that the nicotine in the vapor is absorbed more efficiently by the lungs than the mouth, as is the case with cigarette smoke.) Of course, that assumption is based on another assumption - that mouth-inhalers take drags of the same duration as lung-inhalers, and hold the vapor for the same amount of time before exhaling. Since I'd never heard of mouth-inhaling until yesterday, I have no idea if that's the case. Drag duration varies so much among smokers anyway that it might be impossible to tell.

I just checked and the longest mouth inhale I can do is around 10 seconds, as I can continue taking vapour into my mouth while breathing

This is confusing. If you're breathing at the same time that you're taking vapor into your mouth, then aren't you lung inhaling? Or is there a way to keep the vapor separate from the air you're breathing, such that the air goes into your lungs while the vapor stays in your mouth?

Because that sounds like a really neat trick...

 

[annah]

in response to previous post about nicotine levels: I think we mouth smokers get less nicotine, because the amount of time we hold the smoke in our lungs is less, than if it is direct inhaled. So the amount of time the smoke is in our mouths, there's no absorbtion. It's only for the second or 2 that it's in the lungs.

I don't hold the smoke in my lungs for an extended period of time, so it's only maybe 1/2 the time that a direct inhaler has smoke in their lungs. So if absorbtion rates were equal, then I would only get 1/2 the nicotine that a direct inhaler gets.

 

[yoshimi]

This is confusing. If you're breathing at the same time that you're taking vapor into your mouth, then aren't you lung inhaling? Or is there a way to keep the vapor separate from the air you're breathing, such that the air goes into your lungs while the vapor stays in your mouth?

Because that sounds like a really neat trick...

I am breathing through my nose while taking vapour into my mouth. You know how when you suck on a straw you close the back of your throat so that you don't choke, it's the same principal, I then open my throat and breath in through my mouth to take the vapour back.

I just tried mouth and lung draws and can't see any difference in the amount of vapour.

 

[annah]

I think the difference is in how long the vapor is spending in your mouth, vs. in your lungs. (Assuming that the nicotine in the vapor is absorbed more efficiently by the lungs than the mouth, as is the case with cigarette smoke.) Of course, that assumption is based on another assumption - that mouth-inhalers take drags of the same duration as lung-inhalers, and hold the vapor for the same amount of time before exhaling. Since I'd never heard of mouth-inhaling until yesterday, I have no idea if that's the case. Drag duration varies so much among smokers anyway that it might be impossible to tell.




This is confusing. If you're breathing at the same time that you're taking vapor into your mouth, then aren't you lung inhaling? Or is there a way to keep the vapor separate from the air you're breathing, such that the air goes into your lungs while the vapor stays in your mouth?

Because that sounds like a really neat trick...

That's what I do too- I breathe through my nose, into my lungs, and inhale smoke into my mouth, then it all gets kinda mixed when I inhale into my lungs. That's probably also why I can't direct inhale- it'd be like trying to breathe through a straw- not enough air. LOL

 

[Hangtime]

reading through this, everyone does realise that "mouth inhalers" do inhale into their lungs right. The difference between the two is like the difference between drinking a pint and dowining it, both still get the drink into your stomach.

I just checked and the longest mouth inhale I can do is around 10 seconds, as I can continue taking vapour into my mouth while breathing, I also used to take down a cig in 10 or less drags when I felt the need.

If mouth inhalers really did get less nic, then we would have been getting less nic from analogues too, so it wouldn't manifest that we needed to vape more.

The only difference I can see mouth inhaling making to direct lung inhaling is that mouth inhalers probably do less damage to their lungs as they would have been taking in cooler smoke. Also at 26 you can add me to the "never knew such a thing as lung inhaling existed until v. recently" thing.

I got 14 seconds, I must have a big mouth

 

[JerseyGirl]

I have diluted down my juice, and am puffing away on 9mg. I haven't made a dent in my 10ml bottle of juice (vaping for 24 hours now), so I don't know how much I'm using, but it's not much. Definately no more than 2ml, probably only 1 in the 24 hrs I've been vaping. I smoked 4 analogs yesterday, at 3 hour intervals. And those were just because it seemed like I should, not because I needed it.

All of the (admittedly sparse) evidence indicates that we absorb less nicotine with vaping than with smoking. So if you're still smoking cigarettes, it will be hard for you to judge whether your liquid is strong enough. Also, it does take some time for the body to get rid of the chemicals from cigarettes - including nicotine - so you may not see real withdrawal symptoms until a few days or even weeks after you quit. I'm currently dealing with some oily skin issues that popped up 3 weeks after my last cigarette, and that was the first withdrawal symptom I noticed at all...

 

[yoshimi]

I got 14 seconds, I must have a big mouth

Damn it. I just tried really hard to get to 15, but 10 is my absolute limit Does that mean your mouth is 40% bigger than mine?

Re the nic amount absorbed, based on the fact that we don't absorb any through our mouth, if a LI and MI (lung inhaler and mouth inhaler) both hold the vapour in their lungs for the same amount of time surely they absorb the same amount of nic?

If we assume that MI's are holding it in their lungs for a shorter amount of time, what are we basing that assumption on?

 

[wdave]

I draw until the vapor starts to barely trickle down my throat, then I do a full inhale.

Even I could figure this one out

 

[JerseyGirl]

I am breathing through my nose while taking vapour into my mouth. You know how when you suck on a straw you close the back of your throat so that you don't choke, it's the same principal, I then open my throat and breath in through my mouth to take the vapour back.

Oh, man... I'm trying here, I really am!

Looking at this from the perspective of my vocal training, I THINK what you all are referring to when you say "close the back of your throat" is raising and lowering your soft palate. Raising the soft palate is what happens when you yawn (and when a trained vocalist sings) to help air flow into the lungs more easily. Now, this is kinda hard to explain, but if you trick yourself into yawning, you can feel your palate stretching open. If you do the opposite of that "stretch" feeling, your palate will close. And if you then try to inhale through your nose, or through your mouth directly into your lungs, you'll find that it's not possible. If you find that it IS possible, then your palate isn't fully closed.

Since none of you are reporting that you choke when you try to do this, I have to assume that you're not really closing off the back of your throats, even though it may FEEL that way as you do it.

Which still leaves me a bit clueless as to what's actually going on...

 

[JerseyGirl]

If we assume that MI's are holding it in their lungs for a shorter amount of time, what are we basing that assumption on?

Nothing. We have no reason to assume that LIs hold the vapor in for longer. But we also have no reason to assume that they don't. And since MIs and LIs evidently have completely different ways of inhaling, it would be logical to expect a difference in the length of time the vapor spends in the lungs of each group.

My underlying assumption is that the total "length of drag" - from beginning of inhale to beginning of exhale - is the same for LIs and MIs, at least on average. But the LIs are going to spend a higher percentage of that time with vapor in their lungs than the MIs, since they're not holding it in their mouths first. Hence, more time to absorb the nicotine from each drag.

All of this is based completely on my own speculation, but I think it makes sense...

 

[annah]

I was assuming that a mouth inhaler has smoke in their lungs for less time, because the smoke doesn't get inhaled until the smoker has a full mouth- whereas a direct inhaler is getting the smoke directly there. So if I took 4 seconds to take a hit of a cig- 2 seconds would be filling my mouth, then 1 second to inhale to the lungs, and 1 second for holding it, before I exhale. (just an estimate, I've never counted the seconds) as opposed to someone who directly inhales for 4 seconds, all of their 4 seconds is having smoke into the lungs.

I'm certain I'm getting enough nicotine for now, or really close. I smoke approx 30 in a day normally, so my 2 for 9 hours today that I've been awake is great (I've *not smoked* perhaps 13 cigarettes already today). I would normally be getting edgy and jittery by now, and probably downright mean. I was referring to my 9mg being enough to hold off the immediate cravings and withdrawl. As I said, I have no idea why I even bothered to pick up a cig, I wasn't craving it at all. I think it's more that my brain doesn't want to accept that it might be so easy just to *not* pick one up. And admittedly, #1 this morning, was just because I forgot. So either way, having smoked 2 today or not, it couldn't have made that big of a difference. I doubt I'd need to jump from 1 ml of 9mg to 3ml of 36mg. And my avoiding the cravings has also been with dh sitting here smoking next to me (go me! yay) I'm not sure on the longterm withdrawl, I'll cross that bridge when I get there. For now, I'm happy to be cutting ANY cigs out!

 

[annah]

Yes- it is the raising of the palate, sort of. I can feel it raising, but not totally. (And I can breathe through my nose when I yawn by the way, not well but i can do it)

It would be exactly the same as a straw though, as other poster mentioned. You can breathe when you drink through a straw can't you?

 

[JerseyGirl]

Yes- it is the raising of the palate, sort of. I can feel it raising, but not totally. (And I can breathe through my nose when I yawn by the way, not well but i can do it)

I think you got it backwards, lol, sorry. Try to make your palate do the opposite of what it does when you yawn. Closed, not open. Then try to breathe in. It shouldn't be possible. If it is, your palate isn't completely closed. (It's actually kind of hard to do without practice, and I know I'm not explaining it right... Sigh.)

It would be exactly the same as a straw though, as other poster mentioned. You can breathe when you drink through a straw can't you?

Well, no. When you swallow, your palate closes to keep you from aspirating any liquid. So you can't swallow and breathe at the same time.

I CAN suck air through a straw and breathe in at the same time, but not through my nose, only through my mouth. So I'm just breathing in the air that's coming through the straw - and that IS direct lung inhaling! LOL... When I try sucking liquid through the straw, the only air that enters is coming through the corners of my lips. When I create an airtight seal with my mouth on the straw, no air enters, only liquid.

This has to be simpler than I'm making it seem - I'm starting to feel pretty dumb here...

 

[yoshimi]

it is definitely closing the soft palette, I can't close it to a degree where I can't breath at all though (even through my nose), can you? I wonder if this is one of those "can you roll your tongue" type things where some can and some can't? it would certainly explain why there are two distinct types of inhaling styles

 

[annah]

RIght about the straw, BUT what you're missing is simple. Just suck on the straw, and dont swallow immediately. You're putting liquid into your mouth, but not down your throat- so you can still breathe through your nose, until you shut off the nose portion, and swallow.

You don't normally suck liquid from a straw straight down into your belly- the suction only pulls it into the mouth. Then you have to pause to use your throat to swallow. See what I mean? You use mouth suction to get smoke into the mouth, but then pause to inhale it (just like with the straw) You don't actually breathe the smoke directly from the cigarette as a direct inhaler would.

Now, I'm not meaning that you can breathe and swallow at the exact same second, but that you pause in between doing so. But, you can still be pulling liquid into your mouth at the same second that you are breathing through the nose.

 

[JerseyGirl]

it is definitely closing the soft palette, I can't close it to a degree where I can't breath at all though (even through my nose), can you?

Yes, I can - but raising and lowering the palate is part of a vocalist's warm-up exercises, so I've had a lot of practice. It's like any muscle, it takes time to learn how to control it.

I also find that diaphragm control is useful for not coughing. I do occasionally get the urge to cough - not with vaping so much as with other things - but tensing my diaphragm and breathing steadily prevents it most of the time.

I'm not sure if any of this training contributes to my inhaling style, though.

Oh, and I've never been able to roll my tongue...

 

[annah]

And for reference by the way, I *do* have a lot of problems shutting off areas between eating and breathing. I regularly inhale corn if someone tries to talk to me while I'm eating, or makes me laugh. Corn is just the worst of my enemies, because it gets stuck easily in the passages, and hurts really bad.

 

[JerseyGirl]

RIght about the straw, BUT what you're missing is simple. Just suck on the straw, and dont swallow immediately. You're putting liquid into your mouth, but not down your throat- so you can still breathe through your nose, until you shut off the nose portion, and swallow.

You don't normally suck liquid from a straw straight down into your belly- the suction only pulls it into the mouth. Then you have to pause to use your throat to swallow. See what I mean? You use mouth suction to get smoke into the mouth, but then pause to inhale it (just like with the straw) You don't actually breathe the smoke directly from the cigarette as a direct inhaler would.

Now, I'm not meaning that you can breathe and swallow at the exact same second, but that you pause in between doing so. But, you can still be pulling liquid into your mouth at the same second that you are breathing through the nose.

Okay, that makes sense - I think - but if I'm inhaling air through my nose, all my "suction" is going to that. What's left to pull the liquid up the straw, then? Or the vapor from the ecig? All I've got is the suction of my cheeks, and when I just use that, I run into the problem where I look like a chipmunk, and when I take the ecig out of my mouth, the vapor seeps out and gets in my nose and eyes. Or I get a wimpy drag.

Plus, inhaling through my nose and mouth at the same time is kind of hard? It definitely takes way more concentration than I usually associate with smoking - this is supposed to be a relaxing activity, lol...

 

[Lalesa]

Also, I don't breathe directly through my 510 atomizer when I inhale. My mouth doesn't make a completely airtight seal around the ecig - there are gaps at the corners of my lips where air comes in. Playing around a bit, I CAN make the seal airtight, but then the draw is a little slower than I like (although not too bad, surprisingly). But definitely better with the gaps at the corners.

Finally a description of the direct inhale! I've been trying to figure out how to do this on an e-cig. I mouth inhale and get NO throat hit to speak of on my J118, 901, or 510 and couldn't figure out why. I think this is it. When I do what jersey girl described - I get it - coughing and all! LOL
It's noisy as you are hitting the e-cig and sucking air at the same time but the throat hit is there, you can take a longer drag and there is more vapor on the exhale.

Just looks and sounds like an alternate substance - and I have to hold the PV like that too or I can't do it.

 

[yoshimi]

I'm having to do a lot of vaping to think about how I do this, but the suction comes from moving the tongue down, cheeks go in and the jaw drops, creating more space in your mouth which forms the sucking action, just like when you suck on a straw lol.

what happens if you pretend the cig is a straw and try to draw liquid out of it, do your cheeks still puff out?