How, exactly, are children supposed to get hooked?

[Newbz]

So I was reading a number of articles related to vaping and one thing I noticed about articles critical to e cigarettes is the claim that children are targeted by e-cig retailers and will become hooked into a sordid life of vaping antifreeze and car tail pipes.

I gave this some thought.

In order to purchase an e-cig, you either have to show up to a retailer in person, show an ID, and pay a minimum of $10 USD to buy a disposable that will last about an hour, or $100 for a rechargeable. Your other option to is to purchase over the internet, where I'll grant you, no IDs are checked. However, your average purchase amount is going to be around $50 and you need a valid credit card, plus a valid physical address.

In either scenario, e-cigs are harder to get ahold of for adults than regular smokes, let alone a kid. Can you imagine the sort of scenario in which a 14 year old would have to go through to secretly purchase an e-cig, covertly receive it in the mail, discretely charge the device, fill the device unseen, and then go to the effort to sneakily use the thing on a regular basis?

Let's face it, cigarettes are easy for a kid who really wants to get his hands on one. Steal a pack, grab a lighter and you're in business.

But kids getting hooked on e-cigs? Seriously? Is this even really an argument? I'm a determined adult who really wants to use this product, and I still get fed up and lose interest. Fuggitaboudit if I were a kid. Too much work and too many chances to get busted. I understand some parents don't give a crap about watching their kids, but that doesn't negate the fact that e-cigs are kind of a PIA to figure out, even when you are an exceptionally motivated adult who has the patience, the drive, and have the financial means to do so.

I think we all agree that under age smoking (or any smoking for that matter) is a bad thing. But really, anti-smoking groups hanging their hat on the argument that Someone Must Protect The Children From The Evil E- Cigzzzz!!!!11!!!!!! is pretty stupid, IMHO.

If anti smoking groups really want to help out, they should be in favor of third party, peer reviewed research into the safety and effectiveness (or lack thereof!) of e-cigs. But fact finding isn't nearly as fun as rhetoric, I suppose.

 

[Ardeagold]

Their goal it to alter public perception and condemn the use of e-cigs before they get any more popular with adults. These attacks don't make sense to us, but the general public doesn't have a clue what they are and they'll believe what they read and hear in "news" reports.

If they're labeled as "bad" and people are afraid of them, the tobacco industry is safe, and the drug industry is safe...at least for a while. They don't want them to become popular.

 

[MsOceanCity]

Kids will figure out a way to get them if they want them. Case in point...at the request of my friend, I showed her 17 year old son my PV and let him try it. He has been smoking for the past 3 years and his mom is desperate. Well, fortunately, he took to them immediately and his mom is in 100% support...so much so that she happily funds all his e-cig needs. I believe the biggest worry and a sound one, at that) is the nicotine. It's one of the most highly addictive substances on the planet and we don't want a whole crop of kids getting addicted to it, who aren't already.

 

[Newbz]

Kids will figure out a way to get them if they want them. Case in point...at the request of my friend, I showed her 17 year old son my PV and let him try it. He has been smoking for the past 3 years and his mom is desperate. Well, fortunately, he took to them immediately and his mom is in 100% support...so much so that she happily funds all his e-cig needs. I believe the biggest worry and a sound one, at that) is the nicotine. It's one of the most highly addictive substances on the planet and we don't want a whole crop of kids getting addicted to it, who aren't already.

I understand what you're saying. However, he wouldn't have an e-cig without the financial (and otherwise) support of his parent.

Cigarettes are easy for kids to get ahold of. You steal 'em, you get someone older than you to buy 'em, you flirt with the cashier at the gas station so she'll sell them to you even though she knows you're not old enough, whatever.

The idea that e-cigs are a gateway drug to regular cigarettes is pretty absurd when you think about the time, expense, and absolute desire it takes to make the damn things work. And that's just for hardware. Flavors are a whole different issue.

But let's say a kid steals an e-cig. Okay, that's possible.
He/she probably didn't steal the charger, or if he/ she did, probably didn't steal the juice. Nevermind the fact that it's pretty easy to toast an atomizer or a cartomizer if you don't know what you're doing. Basically by stealing a fully assembled e-cig, they've got a few hours of puffing rebellion and nothing more because they probably can't re-charge or re-fill the thing.

I am going to reserve judgement about 14 year old being allowed to smoke until age 17 with parental knowledge. I do not know your friend's situation. Rather, I hope he breaks his addiction and goes on to a healthy life.

 

[Anaconda]

The key the MxOceanCity's statement is that his Mom is supporting this. That means that if his mom hadn't bought the start up kit, the e-liquid ect, he wouldn't have it. If he's 17, than I can only assume she is age of majority...

Basically the anti-smoking lobiests are doing anything they can to stamp out anything that resembles smoking. I strongly believe that if we are going to make any stides in ending this terrible addiction, we have to be open minded. This is meant for us Analog smokers and DOES help us QUIT!!! This is the only method that has worked for me, and although it isn't perfect, I'm still on nicotine, I at least am not exhaling enormous amounts of other toxins in the air for 2nd hand inhaling... I loved smoking, not because it tastes good, but because it allowed me to relax, stop thinking about all the BS in my life that was getting under my skin. The e-cig does the same thing for me now, but without all the harmful toxins. I feel better today than I have in years.

The closed minded people who are only concerned about minors smoking e-cigs are out of thier mind. When I was a kid, I could go to any corner store and buy single analog cigs for 25 cents each... now any kid can drop a quarter from thier lunch money... but not many can save up 100 bucks to get a starter kit and juice... E-cigs are not convenient, they need constant attention, cleaning, filling, and replacement as they die. Analogs can be bought anywhere, and are super easy to use...

We have to stand up and fight for our rights to have an option. I think that medical plans should cover at least the start up costs and if required a perscription from a Dr. If that happend, we could prevent minors from getting without Parental consent and still allow the true smokers to have an option out of smoking all the crap in Analogs.

 

[Jessara]

I have to agree with the OP on this one. It is rather ludicrous to imagine that a kid is going to go through all that "hassle" to get their hands on an e-cig when "Jimmy" down the street can snatch a pack from his mother's carton of cigarettes. Not to mention, kids don't smoke because they HAVE to, they smoke because they WANT to and it makes them look "cool" and grown-up in front of their friends (and pisses off their parents). An e-cig in a teenagers hands at school would probably get them laughed-at for being "too chicken to smoke the REAL THING". Kids!

I will admit that my 14-yr-old has seen her dad and I vaping and she loves the smell of some of our juices. She mentioned to me one day that she might take up vaping when she's 18. I told her if she starts at 18 there's not much I can do about it, but she can count on me giving her @#$@ if she's vaping anything but 0mg nic juice. I told her the last thing I want for her is the lifetime of drug addiction I've lived with for 27 years of my life.

So I guess I can kind of see how some folks might be in a panic about how e-cigs will interest kids - especially when they smell so dang good (the flavors we vape). My daughter has been on her dad and me for years to quit smoking because she hated the way we smelled (we smoked outside). But just like when we were smoking, it is on US - the parents - to pay attention to our kids, what they are doing, and TALK to them. It's not the governments responsibility for "saving my child from e-cigarettes" - that's my job, and I take it seriously.

 

[frequentj]

I think the point MsOC was making was that this 17 year old kid has been smoking cigarettes for 3 years, so he was one of those kids who "if they want them, they will get them." The mom obviously would rather have her son use an e-cig than analogs because they ARE better for you (and sounds like he was going to keep smoking analogs if she didn't come up with something else to satisfy him).

 

[Jessara]

Kids will figure out a way to get them if they want them. Case in point...at the request of my friend, I showed her 17 year old son my PV and let him try it. He has been smoking for the past 3 years and his mom is desperate. Well, fortunately, he took to them immediately and his mom is in 100% support...so much so that she happily funds all his e-cig needs. I believe the biggest worry and a sound one, at that) is the nicotine. It's one of the most highly addictive substances on the planet and we don't want a whole crop of kids getting addicted to it, who aren't already.

Personally, if that was my kid, sure I'd buy him the juice - and gradually buy lower and lower nicotine until he was down to 0mg. Let him vape his head off then. If I had to, I'd even lie and put it in bottles that said it was 18mg or whatever. But that's just me. LOL!

 

[Newbz]

Yeah, I get that, frequentj. I hope he does quit smoking. His life will be a lot healthier.

My point was that it's absurd to think e-cigs are a gateway drug to regular smokes.

And my ultimate point was that there's all kinds of "The Sky is Falling" rhetoric out there without any scientific, third party, peer reviewed studies of the effects of e-cigs on children, or adults, for that matter.

Maybe e-cigs are the most horrible things ever. Doesn't seem like it when I'm cough free for the first time in years, and I can go up and down a flight of stairs without feeling like I need an oxygen mask...but who knows?

Research is needed. Rhetoric just stinks, and that's what the whole 'gateway' for kids argument reeks of.

YMMV, of course.

 

[kabonk]

these extreme groups don't care about us or children they have there own agenda, but lately I've been seeing more and more commercials on tv for e-cigs granted they are rip off kits but still I was suprised the first time I saw one

 

[frequentj]

Does anyone remember those nicotine "bats" that were supposed to help you quit smoking? My uncle used to have one and it had a nicotine gel thing in it that gave you nicotine when you inhaled it. IMO, the only difference between these and e-cigs is the vapor. No one fussed about those things or said you couldn't use it in a non-smoking area because you might be blowing nicotine in the air. So, I think the people complaining about e-cigs are either a) ignorant, b) so closed-minded they are offended at the sight of anything other than air coming out of someone's lungs, or c) they have another agenda (like BT and BP).

 

[vapomike]

This is just too funny. These things are a PITA compared to analogs, and so damn hard to keep up that I couldn't see a kid doing it.

I am going to reserve judgement about 14 year old being allowed to smoke until age 17 with parental knowledge. I do not know your friend's situation. Rather, I hope he breaks his addiction and goes on to a healthy life.

Some kids there is no help for, the best thing you can do is try to protect them and give them advice. My dad did this very well and kept me on track even though he could've easily let me careen off track. My mom well not so much, lets just say she doesn't know a lot of stuff. Like me for example I was hellbent on 5 things and nothing short of death was going to stop me.

1. Drop out of school
2. Smoke
3. Drink
4. Have sex
5. Experiment with drugs

Now none of the 5 things above do I recommend. Do I regret them, nah hell no I had fun. Yeah I could be in a much better situation than I'm in sure. Well I wouldn't say better but farther ahead in the game. I'm currently studying to be a surgical tech and then I'm going for nursing after that. Though without my father I wouldn't be doing this. For each of the things and some others he told me the best thing is not to do them, but he said if I am going to do it, gave me the best advice he could and told me how to do it without ruining my life. To that I am VERY thankful I was one hard headed kid. I asked him after I got into college why he gave me advice and didn't just ban me from doing those things. He laughed and said like you would've #@(<!^& listened if I told you no and would've probably ended up dead or in prison, if I didn't. So yeah I could be a few years ahead, but thanks to my dad I'm not 22 years behind because I'm in prison like my friend. Yeah I couldv'e been in that car that night, but thanks to the advice my dad gave me I wasn't.

 

[honuhart]

I think the e-cig would be an alternative to smoking more so than a starting point. Even if kids were attracted to it there is just so much involved here to use one that i just don't see it as something most would be willing to commit to. I also have a friend that bought her 17 year old son an e-cig, he lasted about 2 days with it. Its too much work for them, its easier to smoke real cigarettes. And at 17 he has a different mindset than the rest of us, he has not tried and failed for years to quit and he does not feel guilty for smoking for 2 or 3 years like some of us have for 20 or 30 years.

 

[honuhart]

haha vapomike, if i thought about it for a minute i could probably add a few more to that list !!

 

[Newbz]

Does anyone remember those nicotine "bats" that were supposed to help you quit smoking? My uncle used to have one and it had a nicotine gel thing in it that gave you nicotine when you inhaled it. IMO, the only difference between these and e-cigs is the vapor.

Ah yeah, the Nicotrol personal inhaler made by Nicorette. This was an FDA approved personal inhaler which was a two piece. It had the main body of the unit and it had a cartridge you attached to the top which contained a dose of unflavored nicotine. It came with a cigarette pack shaped case for the unit and extra catridges. It was all white and had a Swisher Sweet type mouth piece. Insurance wouldn't cover it, so they ran about $300 per month, and that was about 5-6 years ago.

The thing actually worked. Problem was, when the prescription was gone for it, I was still wanting my nic fix and back to the smokes I went.

So see, the FDA *does* like nicotine inhaler devices. They just want to be the ones to make the $$$ off of them.

 

[bruiser]

It is my opinion that the anti-smoking nazis use the "it's for the children" mantra as a smoke screen. They don't like smoking, and they don't want anyone to smoke, or do anything that resembles smoking. They are control freaks, and are probably the same people involved in the extreme enviromental movement and groups like peta.

 

[bassthumper]

When it comes to fear mongering its quite simple.

First, you're supposed to portray a feeling of despair, hopelessness, and danger. you have to make the person feel like they are doomed. Make them feel powerless. Then when they're about to hit bottom, offer them your hand. Tell them that through YOU, everything will be fine. This will automatically put you in control, and in power. When this power is slipping, you have to do other things, like say "what about the children" and whatnot.
What about the children? This is always the last ditch effort to keep control. Don't let it fool you.

If a kid acquires a credit card in the FIRST PLACE, the parents are at fault.
Also, why would they "pretend smoke?" Kids wanna smoke! Theyre more likely to buy FDA approved analog cigarettes than buy a $50 ecig starter kit and have it delivered to their parents house...

Also, I don't buy the whole "flavors are to target the youth" BS, that's just plain ......ed. As if adults don't like any flavor in anything. Give me the bland please......
its just plain BS and its all about money and control. Greed greed greed....

 

[Cajun83]

It is merely an attempt to get an emotional response from fence sitters. Those same comments get rehashed every time someone wants to ban something, regardless of the particular item or event. Gotta think about the KIDS!

 

[Phreaker]

It's because "we have to save the children" is their only hope, even though it too is a lie. They simply want to control what everyone does. It's easier for kids to buy cigarettes than it is a PV and e-liquid.

 

[adamcreal]

I truly dont see any problem if a kid smokes regular ciggs i think it would help America to have them starting vaping. If i ever found my daughter with a ciggarette I would buy her a pink PV and say have at it. The government is just trying to make us pay because they raised regular cigg taxes and they think we are mad because we decide to better ourselves. I dont even see how its a problem for kids if they actually have the talent as a kid to get a creditcard, buy a PV and hide the package and cigg from a parent then they probably smoke ciggarettes anyway and this will help them.