How often rotate battery sets (18650)?

[PBody19]

Hey y'all. Ok, So I have an rx300 and a gx350. I have 4 married sets of 4 batteries: 2 sets of LG HD2C, a set of Sony VTC5as, and a set of LG HB4s. So, I use my HD2Cs when I'mat work and my VTC5as at home to preserve them and enjoy them the most. I want to enjoy my VTCs, so I don;t use them at work, then go hard with them at home. But my HD4s, I don't enjoy them that much. I do know that will be be the best for certain applications, but I am not at that level yet with my building.

So, I would like to stretch out the life of my HD4s as long as possible so that they can be fresh as hell when I get to the point where I need them.

How can I do this. Shou;d I just charge them to 80% and store them away, and re-charge every so often? Or should I use them every once in a while, then keep them fully charged in between very short periods of use, and hurry up and get to the level where they are useful before they lose their potential?

Opinion, thoughts? Thanks!!!

 

[Darth Omerta]

If you are planning to "shelf" your batteries for an extended period of time I would recommend storing them at 3.7V in a plastic container and checking their voltage every 6 months or so if they are being stored for that long.

For more info on extending the life of your battery:
How can we extend the life of our batteries? | E-Cigarette Forum

 

[PBody19]

Thanks for the response. I don't even want to store my HB4 set that long. Maybe 2 or 3 months max until I figure out what I'm doing. What is the best way to preserve the batteries for only a couple of months, even one month? Can I just use it in a gentle way without making to much of a difference over this short time period? Just leave it partially charged between uses until I'm ready to use it again? If so, how often should/could I use it? Use 10% capacity everyday? 20% once a week? 15% percent 3 times a week? Does a couple of months not matter, and I will have to deal with a minor decrease in performance that comes with this amount of time that won't be affected much no matter what I do?

TL;DR I don't want to use the HB4s until about 2 or 3 months from now, definitely less than 6. Will using it gently over the course of a couple months affect the performance significantly at that time compared to a fresh set? What about using them once a month? Advice for care at that frequency of use?

 

[PBody19]

Caring for batteries properly when you want to use them all the time is easy to understand. I just don't know if something should be done differently to care for a set that you don't want to use that often, like only in rare and specific occasions.

 

[Darth Omerta]

My advice is the same for just about anything over a week of not being used. If you dont intend to use the cell for longer than a week then store it at 3.7V and charge it before you want to use it. As always after charging you should wait at least a half an hour before using it in any device. This should be done with all batteries regardless of frequency of use.

If you want to store your HB6 for 2 or 3 months then gently bring its voltage down to around 3.7V by using it as you would regularly, place it in a plastic case and store it. If you want to use it sooner then charge it up and use it. If you dont use it as soon as you expect then you should check on them at least every 6 months. 2 or 3 months is not a very long time to shelf the battery and you should be alright storing them for that long and suffer little or no effects on performance.

That said, I am curious as to what wattage you are using in your quad cell mods? I have an iJoy Maxo 315 (another quad cell) and love it but I use HG2s in mine and they work perfect for my liking.

 

[SteveS45]

I have 2 sets of 2 and 3 cells which I switch to the charged set when the ones in use get depleted. The single cell MOD gets charged when run down no need for a second battery at present.

 

[PBody19]

I have a .15 ohm parrallel dual coil in my tank that I bring to work, which I vape at typically 80w, sometimes push to 100 if I want to quickly take a few strong, short pulls. I have an RDA at home with a twisted coil build that I can vape at 120 to 150w and push to 200w if I feel like it, although that is very hot and intense lol. It doesn't taste burnt ever even at 200w, but it is very hot and I usually vape it around 120. My HD2Cs are fine, I only bring one set to work and the lowest they get down to is like 3.85 volts lol. Crazy battey life with 4 batts! The HD2Cs are fine for the twisted coil build too, but I use my VTC5as for that when I can (I rotate my batteries a lot, but use the VTC5as as much as possible and for longer sessions because they are better when charged up and have more maH, so they stay charge up longer) because Im at home and they perform the best and last the longer while I chain vape. I do want to get a TFv12 tank or learn how to build (or just give in and buy lol) some fancier coils that I can vape close to 300watts with. But I know I wont be doing that too often, which is why I am looking for the best way to preserve my HB4s. They do not perform (and obviously dont last lol) nearly as good as my HD2Cs or VTC5As, so I just want o save them so that I have some safe batteries when I get the right equipment to enjoy the novelty of vaping at over 200w.

I know the HG2s are fine for the wattage I use. They are powerful batteries and I use one in my IPV D3. But on the flipside of that, the HD2Cs are already perfect for lasting more than a day without charging (if I wanted to) at only 2100 maH, so its nice to have the extra voltage under load since there is already more than enough capacity until I get home. I mean, with 4 batteries, I could probably even get through work on my HB4s lol, although I would guess the HG2s would be stronger on average throughout my work day. Thats why the HB4s are being preserved for safety when necessary lol, but I am looking for the best way to treat them.

Do you think using them once a month would make them last longer than using them all the time? What about than storing them? Is it all about the number of discharge cycles you can get out of them, or does actual time of existence come into play? lol

 

[PBody19]

Steve, have you compared a set of batteries you use to completion to a set that you charge frequently? Wondering if discharging to completion affects performance and after what length of time of using them.

 

[wheelie]

I really do nothing special. Got 2 sets of 3's, 4 sets of 2's and eight or 10 singles, 4 single 26650's. Use them as needed but normally I use a couple 26650 and two or three singles. Still have VTC3's from 2 years ago. If I want a fresh set for something I just buy new ones. Four years of vaping I have had only 3 batteries go bad and would not take a full charge. My sets of 3's I usually always use the same set as I always have a few mods on the go so I just wait till the 3 set is charged. All batteries are fully charged always in case I go on a road trip and need extra. Mostly vape in the low to mid 40's in watts. Wife has 4 singles as well that get interchanged with my singles as she just sets them by the charger and grabs charged ones. That helps with rotation on my singles. CHEERS!

 

[Darth Omerta]

Im wondering if you are confusing performance with duration between charges. In a regulated mod there should be no difference between an HB6 and a VTC5a if vaping at the same wattage(obviously within the safe parameters of the cell) In a 4cell mod you can just about run any of the sets you've mentioned all the way up to 300W safely but which set you use will determine how long they will last between charges. All of those cells perform well for their intended use, but for your current purposes the HB6 isnt really necessary as its a 30A cell and all you currently need is really a 20-25A cell. You will need a 25A cell for sure if you intend to vape at 300W and if you do go that high with only a 25A cell then you should be careful not to bring the cell all the way down to the mods cutoff voltage(usually 3.2V).

What will affect the performance of any cell at any wattage is your vaping style. Some might get hotter more quickly than other if you are constantly puffing on them for 5 second draws then doing it again 5 seconds later. Luckily you have 2 different 4 cell mods. You could always look at the option of interchanging between both mods. Take a puff off one, then your next puff comes off the other mod. Give your batteries a chance to take a "breather" between puffs.

If you would like to truly compare performance of the cells you are using then you should really study Moochs bench tests of each cell you are using. This should give you a better understanding of how the cells perform.

I would also recommend not bringing your cells all the way down to the cutoff voltage of the mod no matter what wattage you're vaping at. Personally I only discharge my cells to 3.6V and then its recharge time. This also helps to improve the overall life of the battery, not between charges but how long the battery will last before it is no longer useable.

For storage of a battery I stand by my original advice. For your purposes, I recommend looking in to getting some more VTC5a's to take advantage of the higher mAh rating and get longer life between charges. If you can keep yourself to vaping at under 240W then I highly recommend getting a couple of 4-way married sets of Samsung 30Qs. You will get longer life between charges out of them than even the VTC5a but you cant push them up above 240W in a 4 cell mod(even if the mod will let you you shouldnt).

 

[SteveS45]

Steve, have you compared a set of batteries you use to completion to a set that you charge frequently? Wondering if discharging to completion affects performance and after what length of time of using them.

I never said I completely discharge my cells.............

All my batteries get treated properly and there are times I do run them down to when the MOD stops firing and sometimes I will charge the sets that are only 1/2 way down. The MOD's shut off around 3.2V for those who will ask.

 

[SteveS45]

I have not experienced any issues with any of my cells they are all performing like the day they arrived as far as I can tell and if a set was to start acting up I would recycle them and not take a chance of having an oops.

 

[PBody19]

Ok, I think I kinda made up my mind. I'm gonna use HB4s gently everyday, down to 3.8v the lowest, and then only charge again when I'm ready to fire them up again. Thanks people.

 

[SteveS45]

If you are only going to charge when you ready to fire them up again you must bear in mind charging time or you will not have charged cells when you need them.

 

[Topwater Elvis]

Batteries stored unused near nominal voltage (3.5v - 3.8v) degrade slower.
Storing in a cool low humidity area also helps.

Just me, for batteries I intend to store for a period of time I draw them down to 3.35v - 3.45v, after a recovery period they usually are 3.5 - 3.7v.
Check them every so often and charge to 3.6v when / if they fall to 3v - 3.2v.

 

[PBody19]

If you are only going to charge when you ready to fire them up again you must bear in mind charging time or you will not have charged cells when you need them.

Well I have 4 pairs of cells. So I can just always have a set f HD2Cs charged for the morning, charge a set of HD2Cs for when I go to work while using the morning ones, charge my VTC5As for using at night at home with my RDAs, charge up my HD4s if I plan to use them that night, or just put the morning set of HD2Cs back on the charger. 4 batteries last so freakin long in my rx300, even chain vaping at 100w. I vape a lot at work on my RTA at about 80w, and I swear the HB4s would get me through my commute, work, back home, and probably even through dinner if I were to let them get as low as 3.2V before charging.

And sorry I wasn't clear with my wording. I meant discharging them down to where the mod wouldn't fire when I said completely discharging them., which can be as low as 3V in some mods as I understand.

 

[SteveS45]

Well I am in a different situation than you with so many MOD's now I need more cells to have all my MOD's ready to go and I have a hard time waiting for batteries to charge before I need the charger bays to be empty.

 

[PBody19]

Im wondering if you are confusing performance with duration between charges. In a regulated mod there should be no difference between an HB6 and a VTC5a if vaping at the same wattage(obviously within the safe parameters of the cell) In a 4cell mod you can just about run any of the sets you've mentioned all the way up to 300W safely but which set you use will determine how long they will last between charges. All of those cells perform well for their intended use, but for your current purposes the HB6 isnt really necessary as its a 30A cell and all you currently need is really a 20-25A cell. You will need a 25A cell for sure if you intend to vape at 300W and if you do go that high with only a 25A cell then you should be careful not to bring the cell all the way down to the mods cutoff voltage(usually 3.2V).

I'm not confusing this brotha. I did say I know even the HG2's would be more than fine for the majority of my current purposes. This is the whole reason why I am trying to preserve my HB4s (I have HB4s, not HB6s, not that it makes much difference). I said specifically that I am trying to preserve them for times when I vape very close to or at 300w, which will not be that often. i've seen reports of the rx300 firing at higher wattage than what is displayed, like closer to 350, when displayed at 300. If this were true, 30A cells are totally required, and 25A cells would be necessary at even lower displayed power levels. I would like this set to be preserved so that I can use them for this application for man years. This is why I want to know what frequency of use will allow me to do this, and how to care for them in between uses.

Again, on the flipside, this is why I said I prefer the HD2cs over something like the HG2s. They last all day anyway, and remain safer for longer, delivering a higher voltage to the mod more consistently within the voltage range that I am bring them down to. I have observed that this also affects perofrmance. MY VTC5As perform better for longer than my HD2Cs, though they are both 25A batteries.

If you would like to truly compare performance of the cells you are using then you should really study Moochs bench tests of each cell you are using. This should give you a better understanding of how the cells perform.

I would also recommend not bringing your cells all the way down to the cutoff voltage of the mod no matter what wattage you're vaping at. Personally I only discharge my cells to 3.6V and then its recharge time. This also helps to improve the overall life of the battery, not between charges but how long the battery will last before it is no longer useable.

I literally spend hours every night doing this since I started vaping. The data is very interesting to me and I love comparing batteries. It is how to preserve them best for my purpose that I want input on. I am pretty confident in my ability to understand performance based on Mooch's graphs.

The lowest I ever brought my batteries down to is probably 3.7. Never seen them lower after my style of vaping all day at work, and I swap frequently at home.

I really just need advice on preserving my HB4s, not that I don't appreciate you trying to take care of me. Just letting you know I understand the safety/performance aspect, so don't worry.

 

[PBody19]

Well I am in a different situation than you with so many MOD's now I need more cells to have all my MOD's ready to go and I have a hard time waiting for batteries to charge before I need the charger bays to be empty.

Battery life on 4 cell mod is amazing. I mean, there are 4 cells in the damn thing lol

 

[SteveS45]

Right now you are worried about preserving your batteries but by the time you figure out the best way you will have another MOD and be ordering more cells for it!