I have to ......rant

[Dstaks]

So I recently got back into vaping and the message boards. I read a lot of post and come across two responses that really aggravate me .

1. Mechs are dangerous and are only for advanced people who know there gear.

- why do people make vaping out to be rocket science? All you do is charge a battery and stick it in a flashlight tube . Next you wrap your coil and fire away. What's hard? It's not a lipo and as long as you have a battery with decent amps your fine. Honestly I don't even check my coils, I wrap and go . If a kid can charge a lipo and wire up his r/c I'm pretty sure a pre adult or adult can handle this. Why do so many people put fear into a mech mod .

2. This mech hits hard.

- it seems like when someone gets a new mod, they always say this. I don't get it, pretty much all the contacts are the same , what makes you think it hits harder then the one before . Is it really that much better? I believe it's all about the battery and your coil. Oh, the voltage drop lol

I'm sorry I just had to express my opinion on this. When I got into vaping people got me to spend money and I honestly didn't notice a difference.

 

[WattWick]

Nothing hard about using mechs. They do require a small foundation of knowledge, tho. Not rocket science at all. But they may actually become rockets with no science required - if one happen upon an unfortunate series of events. Only way to repeatedly and reliably avoid this, is knowing something. Not much - just some things.

'Kids' - with lipos or not - can be of any age. Some actual kids can be more knowledgeable, careful and willing to learn than some adults. It's all in the character. Some - regardless of age - settle for knowing when to go 'Wooo!' and when to go 'Booo!'. Or who to look at for clues if in doubt. Others want to know how things work.

 

[rgerber]

Nothing hard about using mechs. They do require a small foundation of knowledge, tho. Not rocket science at all. But they may actually become rockets with no science required - if one happen upon an unfortunate series of events. Only way to repeatedly and reliably avoid this, is knowing something. Not much - just some things.

'Kids' - with lipos or not - can be of any age. Some actual kids can be more knowledgeable, careful and willing to learn than some adults. It's all in the character. Some - regardless of age - settle for knowing when to go 'Wooo!' and when to go 'Booo!'. Or who to look at for clues if in doubt. Others want to know how things work.

Amen...

 

[Dstaks]

Good points!

 

[USMCotaku]

To the hits hard thing...not all contacts are equal, nor is all mod materials equal, so all things being the same (atty/battery/build) some mods really will "hit harder"....not a big factor if you aren't doing crazy sub ohm builds though

Sent with one hand, the other is busy vaping

 

[93gc40]

If you read back through the forums.. You can sure see how there are more and more Helicopter Parented kids coming into vaping every day........

When I was a kid... There were UNLOCKED cabinets in the living rooms of nearly everyone we new, full of loaded guns. Today, a kid gets expelled from school for "shooting" someone with their fingers.

Wonder how long it will take for the finger print safety to migrate to Vape devices.

 

[Dstaks]

I could see the finger print unlock happening in the future. Soon some crazy parent is going to find out their child got hooked on this "crap" by this scenario ....

Little Tommy went over to play at Billy's and they found his dad's vape gear. Apparently it wasn't secure enough and now they took a huge hit. Well, Tonmmy's parents found out and you all know how hit goes in this age of today...

Live on Fox 11 lmfao

 

[somdcomputerguy]

..who know..

That's the important part. It's not 'rocket science' at all, and can be simple and quickly done, if one knows what they are doing. Knowing that one shouldn't attempt or do something is important too..

 

[SLvapor]

Not on the subject of mechs but:

A Co worker of mine went to the vape shop got an Evic vt and had been vaping on his nickle coils in power mode since he got it (until i told him off the possible dangers)... no vaping in general is not rocket science but I'd rather there be disclaimers encouraging research than more incidents like this.
On the other hand, "for big clouds, bro go sub ohm" hope they would have some knowledge on batteries..

KCVO

 

[Bad Ninja]

So I recently got back into vaping and the message boards. I read a lot of post and come across two responses that really aggravate me .

1. Mechs are dangerous and are only for advanced people who know there gear.

100% fact.
And should be repeated apparently.

Putting gas in your car is more dangerous if you don't know what you are doing.

And yea it's primitive electronics, and basic 8th grade science but the fact is there are some vapers right here on ECF that have no business shorting a battery without protection.

 

[haleysdadda]

So I recently got back into vaping and the message boards. I read a lot of post and come across two responses that really aggravate me .

1. Mechs are dangerous and are only for advanced people who know there gear.

- why do people make vaping out to be rocket science? All you do is charge a battery and stick it in a flashlight tube . Next you wrap your coil and fire away. What's hard? It's not a lipo and as long as you have a battery with decent amps your fine. Honestly I don't even check my coils, I wrap and go . If a kid can charge a lipo and wire up his r/c I'm pretty sure a pre adult or adult can handle this. Why do so many people put fear into a mech mod .

2. This mech hits hard.

- it seems like when someone gets a new mod, they always say this. I don't get it, pretty much all the contacts are the same , what makes you think it hits harder then the one before . Is it really that much better? I believe it's all about the battery and your coil. Oh, the voltage drop lol

I'm sorry I just had to express my opinion on this. When I got into vaping people got me to spend money and I honestly didn't notice a difference.

Vaping in general is not rocket science. The problem at this point is that not everybody is consistent about what is safe or not. we as a responsible vaping community need to set safety standards. Tribal knowledge can only take us so far. Some manufacturers aren't including any instructions at all. If we are going to complain about gov't regulation maybe we need to look at some self regulation. People are only going to know the bad from the media if we don't find a way to prove the good.

 

[papergoblin]

Okay I'll bite, while I agree I am tired of hearing mechs are dangerous, I'm also tired of people trying to prove their point for them.

1. Mechs are for people that know their stuff/gear. This is why people are getting hurt, they don't understand about battery types, limits, and for the love of God, hybrids.
2. Not checking ohms, seriously? Great advice, really I mean it. If you are too lazy to use a meter, you have no business touching a mech mod.
3. Some mechs do perform better than others. It's not just about contacts, it's actually more about body material.
EXAMPLE: Copper and brass mods will have less lag to warm up and longer possible battery life than a steel mod. The reason is conductivity, if a mod ramps up faster then it will seem to hit harder due to more vapor production. The battery will last longer due to less run time as one is not waiting for the coil to warm up and produce.

The batteries we use are safer than other types but that does not mean they are safe. Safer chem. batteries are not supposed to vent with flame and/or build up higher pressure gases. The keyword is SUPPOSED, safer chem. batteries can vent violently just not as often as other batteries. This thinking of " they're just batteries" is what gets people hurt and I don't mean just the user. Put an unsafe user in a crowed room and more than just the user could be injured. This type of thinking you have is exactly why people want all things vape outlawed or at the very least regulated to death.

I respect that all you said is your opinion and it is your money but I don't think you have a full grasp of the situation in it's entirety. I caution people on their builds and use caution with my own builds, not just for me but for the people around me. If you take a tube mech. intentionally not follow safe building practices, you have intentionally build a pipe bomb. The worst part is you don't know when it could go off not how bad the damage it could cause. What if you build fails in a crowded room, a bus, or while you're driving down the road. Do you not think of all the collateral damage you could cause? Basically you are playing Russian roulette and anyone around you is as well, whether they want to or not.

Get a meter if you don't have one, learn to use it if you don't know how, and don't end up as another news story. Batteries have specs for a reason, if they weren't dangerous then they wouldn't need to worry with listing them. It wouldn't matter how many amps it can or can't do.

There is a reason electrical engineers get paid good money to design batteries and battery packs for everything from a lowly toothbrush to rockets.

 

[footbag]

So I recently got back into vaping and the message boards. I read a lot of post and come across two responses that really aggravate me .

1. Mechs are dangerous and are only for advanced people who know there gear.

- why do people make vaping out to be rocket science? All you do is charge a battery and stick it in a flashlight tube . Next you wrap your coil and fire away. What's hard? It's not a lipo and as long as you have a battery with decent amps your fine. Honestly I don't even check my coils, I wrap and go . If a kid can charge a lipo and wire up his r/c I'm pretty sure a pre adult or adult can handle this. Why do so many people put fear into a mech mod .

2. This mech hits hard.

- it seems like when someone gets a new mod, they always say this. I don't get it, pretty much all the contacts are the same , what makes you think it hits harder then the one before . Is it really that much better? I believe it's all about the battery and your coil. Oh, the voltage drop lol

I'm sorry I just had to express my opinion on this. When I got into vaping people got me to spend money and I honestly didn't notice a difference.

I would argue that Mechs can be very dangerous. Though the learning curve isn't as difficult as rocket science, you will need to learn some stuff. Ohm's law, battery safety and coil building. If you don't want to learn all of that jazz, then mechs aren't for you.

Every time I see a news report about an exploding device, it turns out to be a mech. I wish they would show us the battery and coil details, but they don't.

Even though you don't check your coils, I'm sure you have an idea as to where they should Ohm out, right?

 

[Sm0keydaBear]

Why do all the work when you can have a "smart" device do it for you? Check ohms, voltages, and regulate itself in order to not cause the batteries to vent and cause damage to the mod and/or the user. Mechanical mods nowadays are not exactly the best technology, basically in our day they are a stone-age device.

In my opinion, as long as you understand how a mechanical mod is supposed to work, then you should also understand the inherent dangers of using one with pieces that aren't made to work together. Ohms' law is only a portion of the equation. You could understand Ohms' law all day, but that doesn't mean that it's going to stop a user from putting a battery in backwards or using a non-protruding 510 pin on a hybrid mechanical mod.

Safety is in the users/educators or sellers hands here. If something goes wrong, people need a person to talk to about what goes wrong and if something needs a permanent fix. And in my opinion also, the permanent fix needs to be the people who sell this stuff and how they educate any given consumer how whatever is supposed to work.

Almost forgot, "this mech hits hard" is applicable in certain scenarios, but not all. The fact of that matter is, I believe that people should only purchase what they would consider affordable. Anything beyond that and someone is bound to purchase an item that is not specified for their practical usage.

 

[papergoblin]

Why do all the work when you can have a "smart" device do it for you? Check ohms, voltages, and regulate itself in order to not cause the batteries to vent and cause damage to the mod and/or the user. Mechanical mods nowadays are not exactly the best technology, basically in our day they are a stone-age device.

In my opinion, as long as you understand how a mechanical mod is supposed to work, then you should also understand the inherent dangers of using one with pieces that aren't made to work together. Ohms' law is only a portion of the equation. You could understand Ohms' law all day, but that doesn't mean that it's going to stop a user from putting a battery in backwards or using a non-protruding 510 pin on a hybrid mechanical mod.

Safety is in the users/educators or sellers hands here. If something goes wrong, people need a person to talk to about what goes wrong and if something needs a permanent fix. And in my opinion also, the permanent fix needs to be the people who sell this stuff and how they educate any given consumer how whatever is supposed to work.

Almost forgot, "this mech hits hard" is applicable in certain scenarios, but not all. The fact of that matter is, I believe that people should only purchase what they would consider affordable. Anything beyond that and someone is bound to purchase an item that is not specified for their practical usage.

I love what I get from a mech and i prefer one over a vw device. They aren't for everyone for sure and human error is a big part. Batteries inserted backwards can kill a mod too though, I had a vaporshark rdna30 and if you put a battery in backwards, the board was fried. Doing so in a mech will jack up the battery 10 bucks and harder to do than a vw device, do it in a rdna you're out 180 then. I think each type serves different purposes and people. The honest truth though is mechs were never the best tech and never were meant to be. Mechs were born out of need and still support that need, freedom. Mechs are the outlaw biker version of vape. Sure you can get a more reliable way from point a to be, but it's a lot more fun when you work for it. Give me a '59 harley burping and belching, you can keep your goldwing, lol.

 

[WattWick]

Is it really too much to ask for people to be able to reliably and repeatedly insert a battery the right way? It only takes about half a second of continuous attention; or a quick glance in the general direction of ones hands.

Regulated mods (or anything vaping) should not be used as a means of not having to pay attention to - or know anything about - what one is doing. THAT is what's accidents are made of.

 

[haleysdadda]

Is it really too much to ask for people to be able to reliably and repeatedly insert a battery the right way? It only takes about half a second of continuous attention; or a quick glance in the general direction of ones hands.

Regulated mods (or anything vaping) should not be used as a means of not having to pay attention to - or know anything about - what one is doing. THAT is what's accidents are made of.

Yes it is. It seems like according to the way our society is going you aren't required to even have common sense. At work for example we have to engineer safety into equipment that has literally been around for decades because it's easier than requiring people to be responsible to pay attention to what they're doing. We have to get away from blaming items (i.e. guns, mods,batteries...) and start requiring people to be responsible for they're actions. Having said that aren't we as responsible vapers required to do anything within our capability to ensure people are being safe. Shouldn't our devices have the latest safety options installed as a default. If some of us require the "Old School" gear they should be expected to take responsibility for they're actions. Just as you have to when you choose to drive a '69 Chevelle instead of a 2015 Camaro. Both cars are way fast & way kool but you'll be way safer in the Camaro. WE need to have products that are as safe as technology can provide and still provide the best vaping experience possible. Also shouldn't we require detailed instructions to come with ALL gear. I just bought a RDTA made by TKO vapers & it came with virtually nothing as did my Mutation X V4. Is this a responsible thing to do. Vaping is trying to become mainstream and our products need to reflect we care about safety and the vaping experience.

 

[entropy1049]

So I recently got back into vaping and the message boards. I read a lot of post and come across two responses that really aggravate me .

1. Mechs are dangerous and are only for advanced people who know there gear.

- why do people make vaping out to be rocket science? All you do is charge a battery and stick it in a flashlight tube . Next you wrap your coil and fire away. What's hard? It's not a lipo and as long as you have a battery with decent amps your fine. Honestly I don't even check my coils, I wrap and go . If a kid can charge a lipo and wire up his r/c I'm pretty sure a pre adult or adult can handle this. Why do so many people put fear into a mech mod .

A huge part of the problem is that the scene has changed a bit in your absence. When you were last active, the vaping world consisted largely of adults well over ~20 who started vaping to help kick analogs. To day, the vaping world is becoming more and more heavily populated by younger folk (let's hope they've attained the legal age of majority) who if they ever did smoke cigarettes, did so for only a very brief period of time and are mostly interested in blowing huge clouds, and they don't care how they do it. As a result of this desire, in a quest for current,resistances have dropped to the point that less than one tenth of one ohm separate functional low resistance and a dead short. When you run that kind of resistance at even our low voltages, bad things can (and do) happen.

I myself prefer unprotected mech mods and RBA's. Started on Cobra gennies and wouldn't have dreamed of building lower than 0.5 ohms even a year ago. Routinely build ~0.2 ohms these days, but I'm also meticulous in verifying continuity, resistance, and firing voltage. I also ensure my tubes are vented properly and utilize good battery charging and rotation practices. I've made the practice as safe as I think a reasonable person can.

When you're utilizing that much power (>175 watts) in a metal tube in direct contact with your face, I think it's just common sense to hedge your bets in favor of self preservation.

 

[WattWick]

@haleysdadda,
Sorry for picking apart your post. Not trying to take things out of context, but there are some points I want to address separately. I'm all for safety and understanding what one is doing. I think these two factors go hand in hand. While I make counterpoints, I do not fully disagree with your post. I'm all for doing things safely and making "mainstream" gear as safe as can be. I'm as annoyed as anyone at those pushing the envelope past the point of breaking. Perhaps even more as it's my gear of choice that gets thrown to the wolves.

Shouldn't our devices have the latest safety options installed as a default.

Mainstream devices, yes. On the other hand, if someone decide to make some artsy coffee maker (i.e Aeropress/Chemex) you could expect the end-user to know "the dangers" of handling near-boiling water. Part of the problem is people not knowing anything about which batteries to use and how to use them. We can protect devices. We can advocate using the right kind of batteries within their operational limits. But we can't protect people from the other part of the problem - the too-cool-for-school pushing the limits of naiveté.

Also shouldn't we require detailed instructions to come with ALL gear.

I'm all for that. Then again; I have no illusion it will stop the nonchalantly cool from running unsinkable ships into icebergs.

Vaping is trying to become mainstream and our products need to reflect we care about safety and the vaping experience.

I think mainstream products should be as safe as possible. CE-certified electronics and the like is excellently fine by me. However, I do not think this should be at the expense of my products of choice. No more than I think we should limit hardware stores to sell only rubber mallets and plastic knives.

 

[haleysdadda]

@haleysdadda,
Sorry for picking apart your post. Not trying to take things out of context, but there are some points I want to address separately. I'm all for safety and understanding what one is doing. I think these two factors go hand in hand. While I make counterpoints, I do not fully disagree with your post. I'm all for doing things safely and making "mainstream" gear as safe as can be. I'm as annoyed as anyone at those pushing the envelope past the point of breaking. Perhaps even more as it's my gear of choice that gets thrown to the wolves.
I think mainstream products should be as safe as possible. CE-certified electronics and the like is excellently fine by me. However, I do not think this should be at the expense of my products of choice. No more than I think we should limit hardware stores to sell only rubber mallets and plastic knives.

@WattWick no worries. I don't feel picked at or on. I support your choice as well as everyone else's in their vaping gear. I'm just worried that people being stupid are going to ruin it for the rest of us. Can't you have the same experience with some safety features installed? I really don't know or understand. I started with Ego twists moved up to a Sigeli 30w and now I'm using an IPV4s (MMMMMMMMMMMMM nickel) so I don't know about voltage drop or don't know that I've experienced it. Isn't there any way to satisfy mech mod users experience and ENSURE their safety. I believe that you are a responsible vaper who checks his Ohms and does what's safe. But is dropping a volt or two worth losing your vaping experience forever? Have you tried temp control? I get twice the performance out of my Mutation X V4 with nickel. Just saying.