Just the DA/AP vendors and naysayers. We do need test subjects...
Is the whole scandal with da and ap overblown? Some numbers inside
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Just the DA/AP vendors and naysayers. We do need test subjects...
Haha couldn't just vape custards for one and also I've already smoked before wouldnt meet his criteria
You are correct, in that case you better switch to apples.
Dozens of links or they never said it.
You really do make this stuff up as you go along. I searched your posts for "custard". You used that word in 29 threads, most of them subjects of a general nature. In 4 threads asking about some sort of symptom, one did not answer you, one said no, and 2 had used custards, one for only a very short time. Two is not dozens. If you disagree with my accounting, please provide several dozen links to document your statement.
Searches only go back so far and are only so accurate... It is actually easier to Google search for posts on the forum than the search box...
The earliest search hit was November 2013. You joined in May.
Links please, documenting your claim, that the search here says is a fabrication. If you want to retain any credibility at all you will take the time to refute my assertion that the searches here are complete. The only thing missing here is some honesty on your part.
ETA: You should have no problem documenting your claim, just use Google
Actually, as best I understand things, Diacetyl is rarely if ever used in flavorings. For example, TFA's butter flavor contains Acetoin and AP, but no Diacetyl. And those two compounds are found in many of their flavorings but I've never seen Diacetyl.
You don't care about your shredded cred? OK by me. I'm content to mark it as shredded. I suspect the 3700 people that have viewed this thread care. But I understand. Professional propagandists are busy guys.
It's more likely the same 37 people checking the thread a hundred times each, as it goes back and forth without making any real progress. I doubt anyone reading or participating has changed their pre-existing opinions one bit.
I'm confused and concerned about what is in the e-liquid, yes. However, my own "experiment" - I love a vendors particular custard. I have been vaping near max VG as I can get for over a year (I wont say 100% VG as I know nic/flavoring have PG in them). A few months ago I noticed a heaviness in my chest. Did some reading on those who vaped max VG and saw that they had some of the same issues.
Then I read about the Diacetyl and AP in e-liquid - particularly in custards. I freaked. I love my custards! I have 100s of ml of this stuff...so as not to throw money away, I thought I would cut it with some PG/VG base. I noticed with the reduced VG content - the heaviness in my chest started to lessen. I bought some 50/50 and the results where a dramatic change for ME. Now, I don't know what any of this means but what I do know is how it effected ME.
I now vape around 50/50 or as close as I can get while diluting down the rest of the max VG juices I have. I have since bought 50/50 and know there is an improvement in how I feel vaping less VG content whether they have Diacetyl or not I can say but the change in lower VG has relieved the heaviness in my lungs.
Then I read about the Diacetyl and AP in e-liquid - particularly in custards. I freaked. I love my custards! I have 100s of ml of this stuff...so as not to throw money away, I thought I would cut it with some PG/VG base. I noticed with the reduced VG content - the heaviness in my chest started to lessen. I bought some 50/50 and the results where a dramatic change for ME. Now, I don't know what any of this means but what I do know is how it effected ME.
I now vape around 50/50 or as close as I can get while diluting down the rest of the max VG juices I have. I have since bought 50/50 and know there is an improvement in how I feel vaping less VG content whether they have Diacetyl or not I can say but the change in lower VG has relieved the heaviness in my lungs.
I feel sorry for people who let their "appetites" rule their lives..... pleasures first rather than overall well-being.
What I am seeing is the high obesity, diabetes, heart disease and other diseases of lifestyle being "epidemic" nowadays and it explains the outcome of the "hedonist approach" to life.
If you want to see people's lives being *ruled*, just look at what debilitating "diseases of lifestyle" in middle and old age do to them.
I live in an area where people say they don't want fear to rule their lives, but it's one of the unhealthiest towns I've ever lived in, I swim every day in summer months for 11 years and despite that we have a wonderful community olympic sized pool, with an adult swim (meaning you have pool to yourself without kids jumping all over the place) there are exactly 6-7 people who show up and this is going on 11 years.
Yet when I walk around the stores here I see nothing but overweight and sick people and our local rates for diabetes, obesity, heart disease, high cholesterol, etc. are quite high. I talk to people and they think it's "silly" to worry about stuff. Processed foods, foods with high sugar contents and HFCs........I can only say they "look the part."
IMHO, having some discipline over what you put into your body isn't "allowing fear to rule your life." It's more about having some self respect and being able to control one's appetites.
In many ways I see the same thing playing out with custards with DA and AP....it may be similar to people who say they can't or wont eat more salads and fruit and instead they go for the greasy burgers, fried foods, Lil Debbies, soda pop, donuts, and "frozen dinner in a bag" type products, etc. To them, the latter just "taste better". (Or so they tell me.
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Sorry, not trying to offend you but this makes little sense to me. The people that are crying for across the board transparency and venders to test are claiming to be doing so because they are way more health conscious. So why would they just say, "Well it's too expensive for me to find out so it means I will have to return to the cigs."? This statement is rather silly, off the cuff, logic IMO.
I feel sorry for people who let their "appetites" rule their lives..... pleasures first rather than overall well-being.
What I am seeing is the high obesity, diabetes, heart disease and other diseases of lifestyle being "epidemic" nowadays and it explains the outcome of the "hedonist approach" to life.
If you want to see people's lives being *ruled*, just look at what debilitating "diseases of lifestyle" in middle and old age do to them.
I live in an area where people say they don't want fear to rule their lives, but it's one of the unhealthiest towns I've ever lived in, I swim every day in summer months for 11 years and despite that we have a wonderful community olympic sized pool, with an adult swim (meaning you have pool to yourself without kids jumping all over the place) there are exactly 6-7 people who show up and this is going on 11 years.
Yet when I walk around the stores here I see nothing but overweight and sick people and our local rates for diabetes, obesity, heart disease, high cholesterol, etc. are quite high. I talk to people and they think it's "silly" to worry about stuff. Processed foods, foods with high sugar contents and HFCs........I can only say they "look the part."
IMHO, having some discipline over what you put into your body isn't "allowing fear to rule your life." It's more about having some self respect and being able to control one's appetites.
In many ways I see the same thing playing out with custards with DA and AP....it may be similar to people who say they can't or wont eat more salads and fruit and instead they go for the greasy burgers, fried foods, Lil Debbies, soda pop, donuts, and "frozen dinner in a bag" type products, etc. To them, the latter just "taste better". (Or so they tell me.
I feel sorry for those individuals as well. I happen to be neither. I believe that we can live our lives with moderation being key. I have seen abusers of food, drink, and drugs live to a ripe old age as well as the healthy lifestyle person drop dead at a very early age. I believe that we all have to follow the road that best fits our views and be responsible for our own actions and choices, including answering the questions you feel are important for yourself. Saying that I feel badly for those that live their lives in fear of the unknown does not equate to thinking we should all live on the edge. There is a whole world in between that is a lovely place to be where moderation is rule. This issue, peoples choices, this world......is not black and white!
Yes, I have seen these types of posts from the up and coming vaper generation but they too will grow up and probably become more aware of their bodies and learn to speak candidly with their doctors. I have also seen a lot of those same posts getting viable answers for the temporary health scares, not all get a resolution that is simple but it would be irresponsible to dissuade a person from seeking medical treatment from an actual doctor so I don't think we will always see the end results as the poster will not always return and report what their doctor said. I am referring to the "original" vapers here. The ones that have been at it far longer then I myself, not the vapers that are 20 somethings or like me that have been at it for a year or so. There are quite a few people that have been vaping for quite some time and are mature enough to go to the doctors for their annuals. Even with those that are not being truthful about their nicotine intake to avoid increased insurance rates I believe the number is probably quite high as to how many vapers go in for annuals. It might not be a collective study, but we are also not seeing red flags being raised with subjects showing decreased lung function.
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