Who said anything about 2nd hand smoke or vapor?
Read what I said again, there was zero mention of 2nd hand anything in my post.
Is this still a harm reduction?
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Read what I said again, there was zero mention of 2nd hand anything in my post.
As far as I am concerned there is no guess work here at all, vaping is not smoking, there is no smoke, the most damaging part of smoking is the smoke. And no, you are not wrong. I know it is hard to accept that we have something to replace smoking that is thought to be AT LEAST 95% safer than smoking but I have accepted that fact and am happy to do so.
The key words in the question is... "harm reduction". I'd go with an enthusiastic... YES!!
I would say any amount of vaping would be considered a reduction in potential health risks compared to smoking tobacco. Impossible to put a definitive number on how much of a reduction and I think it varies from one person to another. But the available science indicates vapor contains 90+% less harmful chemicals than cigarette smoke. That's a significant difference. Plus a risk factor I can happily live with.
I would say any amount of vaping would be considered a reduction in potential health risks compared to smoking tobacco. Impossible to put a definitive number on how much of a reduction and I think it varies from one person to another. But the available science indicates vapor contains 90+% less harmful chemicals than cigarette smoke. That's a significant difference. Plus a risk factor I can happily live with.
The reason you are having trouble putting a definitive number on the harm is that there is no known harm. Let's not lose sight of that little factoid. Zero varies little from individual to individual....
I concur... I just had to leave a little room in there since there are few absolutes in any risks.
That's what most people here do. The effect is to repeat endlessly the idea that there are risks. It becomes propaganda repeated endlessly resulting in it becoming "common knowledge" that there are known risks. Why are so few of us willing to simply say "there are no known risks"? That is the only factual answer you know....
You pay me enough and I could too. Glantz is about as objective as Hannity is about Trump.Glantz found many harms from e-cigarettes in his studies...
I don't know... Because there are always some risks? I don't believe that e-cigarettes are entirely without risks. That will be too magical. PG, VG, NIC and flavours have some risks on the long-term use. I am almost sure.
Regarding flavorings - I recently ran out of flavorings (actually, I have one flavoring and I'm bored of it) so I mixed up a batch of unflavored just to try it out.
Turns out I really like it.
It is not entirely flavorless, it has a sweetish taste and the nicotine itself has a flavor.
Since I like it so much and have been vaping it for over a month without getting bored of it, I think I can say that this is probably going to be my all day vape.
Now, I'm not saying that the idea of the potential dangers of flavorings (ie unknown chemicals) worries me whatsoever, but it seems reasonable that unflavored juice is theoretically safer, as it is even fewer chemicals than flavored juice.
Having said that, if I didn't happen to like unflavored juice, I wouldn't hesitate to vape flavored juice.
I guess vaping 3ml of unflavored 10mg liquid per day makes me a tootle puffer, but it keeps me of the stinkies just fine
Turns out I really like it.
It is not entirely flavorless, it has a sweetish taste and the nicotine itself has a flavor.
Since I like it so much and have been vaping it for over a month without getting bored of it, I think I can say that this is probably going to be my all day vape.
Now, I'm not saying that the idea of the potential dangers of flavorings (ie unknown chemicals) worries me whatsoever, but it seems reasonable that unflavored juice is theoretically safer, as it is even fewer chemicals than flavored juice.
Having said that, if I didn't happen to like unflavored juice, I wouldn't hesitate to vape flavored juice.
I guess vaping 3ml of unflavored 10mg liquid per day makes me a tootle puffer, but it keeps me of the stinkies just fine
Regarding flavorings - I recently ran out of flavorings (actually, I have one flavoring and I'm bored of it) so I mixed up a batch of unflavored just to try it out.
Turns out I really like it.
It is not entirely flavorless, it has a sweetish taste and the nicotine itself has a flavor.
Since I like it so much and have been vaping it for over a month without getting bored of it, I think I can say that this is probably going to be my all day vape.
Now, I'm not saying that the idea of the potential dangers of flavorings (ie unknown chemicals) worries me whatsoever, but it seems reasonable that unflavored juice is theoretically safer, as it is even fewer chemicals than flavored juice.
Having said that, if I didn't happen to like unflavored juice, I wouldn't hesitate to vape flavored juice.
I guess vaping 3ml of unflavored 10mg liquid per day makes me a tootle puffer, but it keeps me of the stinkies just fine
I am vaping unflavoured juice (VG, DW & 4 - 5 mg/ml NIC) and it's just fine.
I suspect most long term vapers at some point settle into a daily use of 10ml or less. Might be a couple of months or a couple of years but I doubt many will use 30ml daily for decades.
That will also depend on the concentration. I started with a 24 mg juice and vaped 2 to 3 ml a day. I recently got some 12 mg juice and find myself vaping ~5 ml a day. So almost the same amount of nic, just different volumes to get there.
I am curious as to how/why the 3 or 4 ingredients in our e-liquid has been changed from ingredients to chemicals. Did it get started by someone with an agenda? An agenda to make folks think there has to be something dangerous in it because of the chemicals. That would be like calling the ingredient list for making cookies a chemical list. 
Just a little food for thought. We have enough of a fight on our hands with all the do gooders out there that think they know what is best for us. How 'bout we not use and repeat their talking points. A lot of the new folks coming here for advice have been bombarded with all the lies and half-truths out there. They need to hear the truth from us. JMHO
Just a little food for thought. We have enough of a fight on our hands with all the do gooders out there that think they know what is best for us. How 'bout we not use and repeat their talking points. A lot of the new folks coming here for advice have been bombarded with all the lies and half-truths out there. They need to hear the truth from us. JMHO
The PG isn't actually a mystery. It's been used for ages in Asthma inhalers and nebulizers to no ill effect that we've found yet. If there was one, we'd most likely know by now. It's the VG and flavorings that are the mystery here. But if one were concerned, they certainly could vape 100% PG unflavored liquid.
I don't know though. People keep saying ecigs haven't been a thing long enough to know if they have long term negative health effects. But....I don't think a lot of people who are saying these things realize that it's been almost 10 years. Our medical and research technology is way more advanced than it was during the cigarette fiasco. And as hard as some people are trying to prove that ecigs are dangerous? Of course there's still a chance that it may have some negative effect down the line, but I tend to think we'd know by now.
Anyway, I'll take my chances because I know cigarettes will kill me.
I don't know though. People keep saying ecigs haven't been a thing long enough to know if they have long term negative health effects. But....I don't think a lot of people who are saying these things realize that it's been almost 10 years. Our medical and research technology is way more advanced than it was during the cigarette fiasco. And as hard as some people are trying to prove that ecigs are dangerous? Of course there's still a chance that it may have some negative effect down the line, but I tend to think we'd know by now.
Anyway, I'll take my chances because I know cigarettes will kill me.
I think the only thing your lungs need or require is air. Anything that causes you to cough your lungs are telling you its not good.
I just (out of the hospital yesterday) had the upper lobe of my right lung removed due to cancer from 60 years of smoking cigarettes. I've been vaping since the spot was found 3 months ago. Lung surgery is very invasive. Its not a picnic. Its dangerous and hurts like hell.
The good news is the surgeon removed over 130 nearby lymph nodes all of which were negative. Praise God.
Vaping causes me to cough sometimes. I'm going to try to give it up too.
I just (out of the hospital yesterday) had the upper lobe of my right lung removed due to cancer from 60 years of smoking cigarettes. I've been vaping since the spot was found 3 months ago. Lung surgery is very invasive. Its not a picnic. Its dangerous and hurts like hell.
The good news is the surgeon removed over 130 nearby lymph nodes all of which were negative. Praise God.
Vaping causes me to cough sometimes. I'm going to try to give it up too.
Please provide citations for what you are almost sure of. Not lab rat tests. Citations of actual harm.
Eating a fresh salad entails tremendous risks. Do you obsess over the risks of eating salad like you do over vaping? I suspect not.
Vaping is, based on known evidence, the safest thing we consume. 3000 food borne deaths each year prove that.
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