Joye 510 Cartomizer (from FSUSA) Review and Comparison

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upStomp

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First off, a few notes about how we use these cartos. I opened 2 boxes of these cartos the day they arrived (October 28th). I set up my Wife and I with 5 cartos each, filled with Dekang juices (USA Mix & 555) and Max/Boro 50/50 - all 24mg. I wanted to get a good sampling of cartos going with both a runny and a thick juice so I could better judge the consistency and performance. The cartos definitely seem to run out faster with thinner juices, lasting on average about an hour less than the FSUSA-filled ones - but this seems to be common with all cartos (and atomizers, for that matter). The trade off is that there's a much more pronounced drop-off when the thinner juice runs out. Thicker juices tend to degrade more slowly, so it can be a bit more difficult to tell when it's time to refill. Most vaping is done on 650 eGo batts, but we experienced similar performance on my 5V passthru.

With all that said, these are by far the best and most consistent cartos I've tried. I've used a couple different soft-tip cartos, along with the R4 E2's (2.8-3.0 Ohm). There is simply no comparison. The soft-tip cartos provide good flavor, vapor, and TH, but only last maybe 2-3 days before flavor sours - and sours badly. The E2's are too airy, and limit TH and flavor to borderline usability. I can't compare longevity to the E2's because I won't use them much, and even then only on my 5V passthru. From what I understand about the design, longevity should be much better than the soft-tips.

In comparison, I've been using the Joye 510's for almost 2 weeks now. I have yet to lose a single carto. That's right - All 10 cartos are still in active circulation. Each carto has been filled and used at least 10 times. Flavor started dropping a bit after the first week, but much of that may be due to the fact that we've each been vaping the same exact juices for so long. It hasn't been a steady decline either. The flavor just dropped a step after week 1, but has been maintaining that level since.

There is also a notable drop in consistency after 1 week with respect to the amount of usable juice these will hold (and thus how many vapes they will provide). Not a drastic issue by any stretch. I've gone from injecting 7-8ml's during the 1st week down to 4-5ml's on some of the cartos. Doing a quick Taryn Spin on them helps to mitigate this issue, but can cause some leakage. This small problem (if you can even call it that after 1 full week of use) doesn't seem to have much to do with which liquid is being used either. It seems somewhat random and could be the result of manufacturing inconsistencies or differences in our vaping styles. Once one of these finally dies, I plan to disect it, paying close attention to the state of the filler.

I've also tried both methods of filling: Syringe and dripping from the threaded end. Both seem to work fine, with the slight performance edge going to the syringe for being able to fit a bit more juice. Still, it's nice to have the option of dripping when I'm out without access to a syringe.

Even with the few minor issues we've experienced, we have settled on our go-to carto - the Joye 510.

Joye 510
Usable Lifespan: 9/10
As good or better than any of the cartos I've tried. A reliable 10+ fills is where I want to be.
Flavor: 9/10
Out of the box, flavors are unaffected by this device. Very clean tasting.
Vapor: 9/10
Vapor is thick and plentiful with both PG and VG mixes.
TH: 9/10
Clean, sharp throat hit. No burning or harshness.
Ease-of-Use: 7/10
Nobody loves using a syringe (admittedly an assumption), but the process is relatively painless. Extra points for the versatility of dripping from the bottom.

Total Score: 8.6
I've yet to try dripping without a punched filler nozzle. This score may rise if that works out well.

Boge/Bauway Soft-Tip
Usable Lifespan: 4/10
This is where this style of carto falls flat on its face. I don't want to have to boil my equipment to keep it working past 5-6 fills.
Flavor: 8/10
Flavor is great for as long as the atomizer is usable. Immediate, drastic drop in quality once the atty cakes and/or burns the filler.
Vapor: 8/10
Vapor is pretty consistent throughout the life of the carto.
TH: 8/10
Same as flavor.
Ease-of-Use: 9/10
What could be easier than popping the soft tip and dripping directly onto the filler? The condom method. I've also heard of folks using these with bottom-feeders.

Total Score: 7.4
Very easy to use and doesn't adversely affect the characteristics of my liquids. That is, until it kicks me in the face for daring to use it past its moth-like lifespan. These would be great to keep around for emergencies - right next to the buckets of rice and ammo cans.

RoyalSmokers E2 (R4, 3 Ohm)
Usable Lifespan: 9/10 (Qualified)
It'll be a while before I can get an accurate measurement on this, but all indications are that they'll last quite a while.
Flavor: 4/10
Out of the box (and days after), taste is weak with a hint of underfed-atty flavor.
Vapor: 8/10
Good levels of vapor, but...
TH: 5/10
...if I was blind, I'd think I was vaping a Blu or Green Smoke. Throat hit is present, but only barely. Tested with multiple 24mg juices.
Ease-of-Use: 7/10
With a syringe, it's a tad easier than filling the Joye, if only because you get an indication that it's full before it's over-full. I hear you can also direct-drip with these.

Total Score: 6.6
Drastically and detrimentally affects most characteristics of the liquids I've tried. I don't care how long it lasts if it neuters my juices before I've had a chance to taste them.
 
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TexasT

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Real nice report and it was nice of you to go to all this trouble. The 510 carto's from FSUSA are first class, I sure have to agree with you on this.

I've never used the Boge. I know a lot of people seem to think highly of them.

My CE2's (I have a stack of Rev. 4's I haven't touched yet) I've stripped out the inner plastic seal ring and the plastic fill ring. Then cut a 7/8" x 1/4" strip of the fill material included with the Rev. 4's and using a paper clip pack it around the ceramic cup, fill the carto through the fill material with a syringe - and man, what a difference. No leaks, huge volumes of vapor and great taste. I read about doing this in ECF (http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-review-tips-info-help-video.html#post2023123)

Have you tried the Tornado (510) Mega-Cartos (http://www.totallywicked-eliquid.co...o-mega-cartomizers-empty-black-product.html)? They hold around 2.5ml of juice with fantastic vapor and taste. I've been using some of these for a couple weeks now and am very pleased with them.

The evolution and improvements in cartos just in the last seven months since I started vaping is pretty amazing and I think the best is still to come.
 

Denrock316

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Nice post I agree with your evaluations of both the Joye and E2's. I haven't tried any regular softcap type and really don't plan too. If you have any big eGo type batteries I suggest you try the Joye eGo XL cartos they are basicly the same design as the 510 but bigger, they last a bit longer between fills and have just a little more flavor and vapor output.
 

Free2BMe

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I agree, upStomp, I really like the Joye 510's too. I ended up putting one on my "juice box" pv and that's really worked out great soo far....when the carto seems a little weak, just squeeze a few drops of juice right into it and go again. What really impresses me with these, though, is I've never experienced flavor like this before...not even with an atty.
 

upStomp

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Thanks, Guys. I definitely think I got into vaping at the exact right time (provided the FDA doesn't screw things up). The advancements seem to be coming at a really good clip. I'll try the E2 mod you referenced when I get a chance. Still, I'm an out-of-the-box kinda guy. I don't mind modding stuff a bit for fun, but it grows old quick for me. The Laziness is strong with this one. I hope I didn't come across as bashing Boge - they really are good cartos. I just wasn't impressed with their lifespan.

I haven't tried the Megas (or eGo cartos, or eGo XL cartos, or whatever the kids are calling them nowadays) yet, but they're next on my list. My understanding is that they're pretty much the same technology as the Joyes but are larger capacity and will magically turn my eGo into a cigar. All good things :). I hope the added capacity can result in more longevity, otherwise I fear they won't be as cost-effective as the standard 510's.
 
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upStomp

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A quick update. I couldn't wait any longer to take one of these bad boys apart. I took what I thought was the worst performing of the bunch (note that it was still very much usable), and pulled it apart using brute force (a pair of needle nose pliers and some wire cutters).

The poly-fill was completely clean! There was absolutely no indication of burning or caked-on liquid. The atty was a little more difficult to analyze because of the method I'd used to pull it apart, but from what I could see, there was a moderate amount of gunk on it.

With the poly-fill being as clean as it was after 10+ uses, I'm wondering if dry-burning these to clean them could be an option. I'm running a well-used carto passed dry right now at work to mimic an atty dry burn. I'll keep running it until I absolutely can't stand the flavor or until the vapor disappears. Then I'll refill tonight and report the results.

ETA:

Time of death was November 9 2010 11:43 EST.

"Max" lived 12 days and through at least as many refills. He is survived by 8 similarly colored and flavored cartomizers. Only yesterday he'd lost one of his siblings when his owner got all surgical and ripped him apart with the wrong tools for the job.
 
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Free2BMe

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A quick update. I couldn't wait any longer to take one of these bad boys apart. I took what I thought was the worst performing of the bunch (note that it was still very much usable), and pulled it apart using brute force (a pair of needle nose pliers and some wire cutters).

The poly-fill was completely clean! There was absolutely no indication of burning or caked-on liquid. The atty was a little more difficult to analyze because of the method I'd used to pull it apart, but from what I could see, there was a moderate amount of gunk on it.

With the poly-fill being as clean as it was after 10+ uses, I'm wondering if dry-burning these to clean them could be an option. I'm running a well-used carto passed dry right now at work to mimic an atty dry burn. I'll keep running it until I absolutely can't stand the flavor or until the vapor disappears. Then I'll refill tonight and report the results.

ETA:

Time of death was November 9 2010 11:43 EST.

"Max" lived 12 days and through at least as many refills. He is survived by 8 similarly colored and flavored cartomizers. Only yesterday he'd lost one of his siblings when his owner got all surgical and ripped him apart with the wrong tools for the job.

R.I.P. Max and know you served your purpose well and beyond.
 

artbyjoni

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I have to say, i have been vaping with my cartomizer now since Oct 28. I only received one so I am glad mine lasted this long as i wait for the rest. I would say i have filled mine on average twice a day, and some days 3 or 4 times (on my days off work). Tomorrow will be 2 weeks of pretty much using just this one cartomizer for the most part.

Tonight I went to fill it again after work and as i unscrewed it from the battery the cartomizer just fell apart on me. I can attest to the fact that the filler is pretty clean, surprisingly so. Im not sure what the wick should look like but didnt look too bad. I put it back together, and although i think it will now fall apart very easily now, it seems to be holding together so long as im gentle.. so i went and filled it again. It is still working... it has to work as its the only one i have.. I'm not sure i can go back to cartridges and pulling over the side of dark highways to top off on my long commute.. Pray it holds together :)

Im wondering if the dripping from the battery end is not what caused it to fall apart, as it came apart from that end. I was leery about that practice anyway although it is so very convenient. I dont like the idea of carrying around a syringe. Does anyuone think dripping from the battery end could cause the casing to separate from the atomizer?
 

Heartbskts

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Joni- since TexasT aint jumped on this thread yet- maybe some duct tape will fix er right up lol?!
I would like to know if that's what caused yours to fall apart too? I had some that I bought from Cignot and loved them. I re-filled all of mine through the threads, probably 8-10 times each
If you see any of Deback's posts, (she has a caramel apple avatar) check out her blogs under her user-name. She has a pretty good way of cleaning them, I believe. I didn't see her methods before and tried boiling mine....didn't end too well
 

TexasT

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Joni- since TexasT aint jumped on this thread yet- maybe some duct tape will fix er right up lol?!

Well, I've been keeping an eye on this Thread trying hard to learn something. I guess by now everyone knows they accidentally sent me all the cartos that was supposed to go to artbyjoni so I had a lot to experiment with.

Heartbskts, is right. If you can't fix it with duct tape or super-glue it ain't worth having. That stuff sure keeps my old truck stuck together.

Anyhow, Here's what YOU DON'T WANT TO DO. I tried cleaning them with Draino. That didn't work. Don't use oven cleaner either. It leaves a real bad taste. So I mixed up some Draino, oven-cleaner and baking soda while my wife was at work up at the Lube Rack and blew out the south wall of the kitchen.

Children. Do not attempt this at home.

I hadn't spoke a word to my wife in three months because I don't like to interrupt her. But now she's not speaking to me. So I've been able to tell her everything I know but I don't think she's listening. She's on the upholstered sofa out on the porch with three cans of Spam. Hope she leaves me a little bit of it.

Anyhow, my cousin Enid is coming over tomorrow to help me fix the kitchen. I saw some old tin laying around down by the sewage treatment plant. Actually, it was laying around in some guys back yard, but if we stop by to visit at night and he happens to be asleep, we can probably borrow it with no problem.

Oh, and don't boil them cartos either. I boiled a few with some eggs this morning and man, they made those hard boiled eggs taste like Wyatt Earp. That ain't good.

Hope this information helps everyone.
 

upStomp

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I pulled the rest of the cartos (8) out of rotation last night. The taste was really starting to sour and my Wife was complaining about it as soon as I got home. I put 5 new ones in. I'm starting to run a bit low, and I'm not "allowed" to buy more until the end of November.

I may need to put some of those E2's to work. Yikes. I did find that they vape a little better with a drip tip, but still nowhere near as good as the Joyes. I also have 4 soft tips left, but I keep those with my cans of .223 ;-).
 

artbyjoni

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Well, I've been keeping an eye on this Thread trying hard to learn something. I guess by now everyone knows they accidentally sent me all the cartos that was supposed to go to artbyjoni so I had a lot to experiment with.

You are too funny :)

Well its holding together but i been gentle with it :) BUT, it is leaking alot more.. i could try the duct tape.. duct tape can fix anything
 

srcowell

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I have to say, i have been vaping with my cartomizer now since Oct 28. I only received one so I am glad mine lasted this long as i wait for the rest. I would say i have filled mine on average twice a day, and some days 3 or 4 times (on my days off work). Tomorrow will be 2 weeks of pretty much using just this one cartomizer for the most part.

Tonight I went to fill it again after work and as i unscrewed it from the battery the cartomizer just fell apart on me. I can attest to the fact that the filler is pretty clean, surprisingly so. Im not sure what the wick should look like but didnt look too bad. I put it back together, and although i think it will now fall apart very easily now, it seems to be holding together so long as im gentle.. so i went and filled it again. It is still working... it has to work as its the only one i have.. I'm not sure i can go back to cartridges and pulling over the side of dark highways to top off on my long commute.. Pray it holds together :)

Im wondering if the dripping from the battery end is not what caused it to fall apart, as it came apart from that end. I was leery about that practice anyway although it is so very convenient. I dont like the idea of carrying around a syringe. Does anyuone think dripping from the battery end could cause the casing to separate from the atomizer?

I'm positive the method of filling these cartos has no effect whatsoever on the metal separating from the plastic body. If you look closely at the carto, you can see that no glue or anything is used to hold the plastic and metal together. The metal tip is pressed into the plastic, and the plastic expands just enough to hold them together as if fused. What causes them to separate is tightening the carto too snugly to the battery. First, it puts stress on the joint when you over-tighten, then when you twist it off, you have to used extra stress because it's on so tight. This pressure of twisting one direction then the other is what causes them to separate. Add to this a random factor that they are not all identical in longevity -- some will die sooner than others for no apparent reason.

Another reason I am certain that dripping into the threaded end will not cause this separation is the simple physics of the carto's construction. Whether you fill from the mouth end with a syringe or from the threaded end by dripping, the result is the same -- the reservoir gets filled with juice, and the reservoir sits right on top of the atomizer, which is the metal tip. In other words, the juice will go to all the same places no matter which end is used to fill it. It's no different than any other vessel filled with liquid -- if you turn it upside down or right side up, the liquid all goes to the end that is down, and the entire inside of the vessel will get wet.

Hope this helps. :)
 

bsoplinger

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Has anyone used this with a deep dark colored liquid? I ask because I decided to try one with the RY5 I'm vaping. I didn't get the best results from the CE2 r4 I tried it in so went to one of these I received. By the 2nd fill I was loosing flavor. By the 5th fill it was a weak as the CE2 had become. I'm hesitant to try another dark colored fav of mine, the Wyatt Earp because I figure I'll have the same issue.
 

trichman

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Real nice report and it was nice of you to go to all this trouble. The 510 carto's from FSUSA are first class, I sure have to agree with you on this.

Have you tried the Tornado (510) Mega-Cartos (http://www.totallywicked-eliquid.co...o-mega-cartomizers-empty-black-product.html)? They hold around 2.5ml of juice with fantastic vapor and taste. I've been using some of these for a couple weeks now and am very pleased with them.

The evolution and improvements in cartos just in the last seven months since I started vaping is pretty amazing and I think the best is still to come.

T, are you using the Tornado 510 Megas with an 808 adaptor? I looked at them and they say they only work with Tornado atomizers. I am probably looking at the wrong ones. I would like to find a good cartridge for my 808 batteries/PT's and don't mind using the adaptors but I am confused about which cartos to get.
 

upStomp

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Has anyone used this with a deep dark colored liquid? I ask because I decided to try one with the RY5 I'm vaping. I didn't get the best results from the CE2 r4 I tried it in so went to one of these I received. By the 2nd fill I was loosing flavor. By the 5th fill it was a weak as the CE2 had become. I'm hesitant to try another dark colored fav of mine, the Wyatt Earp because I figure I'll have the same issue.

I've vaped a lot of Max/Boro out of mine. It's not quite as dark as Wyatt Earp, but it's pretty dark. I think the thicker juices may get "stuck" toward the top of the filler if you vape too quickly. I don't think color itself has much to do with it. Try giving the carto a Taryn Spin to get that liquid down closer to the atomizer as the flavor weakens. It's worked for me.

ETA: I've found that the E2's I have are only really good for direct dripping. In fact, they excel in this capacity and are a far cheaper option than using atties. Using the E2's as intended are just way too weak, even when first opened. I'm starting to wonder if I got some misrepresented R3's.
 
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vaporgalinfla

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I've vaped a lot of Max/Boro out of mine. It's not quite as dark as Wyatt Earp, but it's pretty dark. I think the thicker juices may get "stuck" toward the top of the filler if you vape too quickly. I don't think color itself has much to do with it. Try giving the carto a Taryn Spin to get that liquid down closer to the atomizer as the flavor weakens. It's worked for me.

ETA: I've found that the E2's I have are only really good for direct dripping. In fact, they excel in this capacity and are a far cheaper option than using atties. Using the E2's as intended are just way too weak, even when first opened. I'm starting to wonder if I got some misrepresented R3's.

I've bought E2s from two suppliers now (version 2, 3, and 4). I think the flavors are way too weak using the E2s. I wish I'd never bought them. Oh well.... live and learn.
 

TexasT

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Trichman there are TWO different kinds of carts.

(I posted this info on the other 510 carto Thread, but here it is again because I like to see myself in print ...) LOL

One is a Cartridge that works with an atomizer.
The other is the Cartomizer that has the atomizer built into it.

David was selling the Cartomizers and yes, you need an adpter to use the 510 Cartomizers with the KR808D-1. You can get it here. Electronic Cigarettes and eLiquid / Totally Wicked eLiquid / electronic cigarette eliquid nicotine fluid products and when you order it I would specify "901-510 adapter(901/808D-1 bat to 510 at)." These cartos David is selling are excellent and I really like them a lot.

This company has the Mega Cartomizer - TORNADO MEGA CARTOMIZERS (EMPTY) - Black and again, you will need an adapter to use it with the 808 battery and yes, a syringe is required to fill them.

You remove the mouthpiece and an inner seal cap (with a paper clip) and then puncture a seal in the center of the carto with the syringe needle.

The mega-carto is larger than the 808 battery and doesn't look right, but with the adapter it does work on the 808. I'm using them on my Buzz (as well as occasionally an 808 batty) and like them a lot. The ones David sells actually look better on the 808 but they are smaller and hold less.

Trichman, if you need further help with this, pm me and I'll be glad to give your more specific info.

CE2 Cartomizers. upStomp and vaporgalinfla, I posted a little mod for CE2's a while back, let me give you an update on that.

Cut a strip of the filler material that comes with the CE2 Rev. 4's that is about 1/4" by 7/8".

Remove the CE2 plastic seal ring AND the fill ring. It can be hard to get out, but you'll get it.

Carefully work the strip of material around the cup. Don't overlap the ends.

Replace the white mouthpiece.

I was doing this on older versions of the CE2, but not on the Rev. 4's. Well, I've tried the Rev. 4's now and am going to do the same thing on them. You can fill with your syringe right through the filler material.

To me, this changed the CE2 into a completely different animal. Full, thick vapor with almost no dry spots, great taste and now I like the things!

Hope this info helps!
 
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