Something is certainly wrong. I just signed many hours after you posted and it is showing only 348 signatures!
FDA lets get a petition submitted to the whitehouse
- Thread starter pineappledan
- Start date
- th_trl_thread_readers 0
- Status
Something is certainly wrong. I just signed many hours after you posted and it is showing only 348 signatures!
tea, I've actually encountered pretty fierce resistance to petitions by fellow vapers. they say it won't do anything. first name, last name, and email address is all you need to sign a petition, but I've seen multiple paragraphs dedicated to not signing.
I never saw that. Do you have a link even though it's beside the point :- ) What I heard on Vicki's radio program and in this article is:
"Johnson's staff said The Wall Street Journal opinion piece on vaping that caught the senator's attention was by Michael B. Siegel of the Boston University School of Public Health and head of the nonprofit Center for Public Accountability in tobacco Control."
Republican Johnson ... said he was put on the vaping issue by a column on The Wall Street Journal's website.
Ron Johnson pursues radio talker's vaping cause
Senator Demands Answers From the FDA on Vape Regulations - Vaping360
this one says "might have been prompted by"
Majority Media | Homeland Security & Governmental Affairs Committee | Homeland Security & Governmental Affairs Committee
and here it shows the letter written to the fda that quotes Mr. Berkey directly.
In quick research, I couldn't find anything directly stating what triggered his action.
Perhaps that was just an opinion I saw on facebook inspired by this paragraph in his original letter, though I can't find the post where I first saw it.(I hate trying to find something specific on facebook)
According to Christian Berkey, the Chief Executive Officer of Johnson Creek Vapor Company located in Hartland, Wisconsin, the FDA e-cigarette regulations would “extinguish a multi-billion dollar industry and put tens of thousands of people out of business.” Mr. Berkey also stated that the new FDA rule would have more than just a burdensome impact on the e-cigarette industry, the effect of the rule would be “catastrophic.” In its regulatory analysis, the FDA itself acknowledged that the cost of the rule “would be high enough to expect additional product exit, consolidation, and reduction in variety compared with the baseline.”
In either event, it wasn't letters to representatives that initiated it. I do believe writing to express support is beneficial. I believe even more people writing letters/calling/etc. would be even more beneficial.
I'm spit balling here because I don't remember the actual numbers and I don't feel like looking them up at the moment.
10 million smokers in the US, 2 million vapers, 250,000 international members of ECF, 150,000 CASAA members, 10,000 CASAA testimonials. Obviously we're not reaching as many people as we should be. We live in an age where a cat video can get over 1 Million views on youtube, an ice bucket challenge can raise enough money to make scientific breakthroughs in ALS research, and we can't get more than a few thousand people to participate at the same time for something with the potential to save millions of lives.
10 million smokers in the US, 2 million vapers, 250,000 international members of ECF, 150,000 CASAA members, 10,000 CASAA testimonials. Obviously we're not reaching as many people as we should be. We live in an age where a cat video can get over 1 Million views on youtube, an ice bucket challenge can raise enough money to make scientific breakthroughs in ALS research, and we can't get more than a few thousand people to participate at the same time for something with the potential to save millions of lives.
We may both be right...lol... I saw a letter to the FDA from Johnson Creek citing the same WSJ article that Senator Johnson's staff saw
And that may have been from a letter from Johnson Creek :- ) The Senator encourages people to write their reps - "not the form letters' in the SFATA interview and suggests that face to face is even better.http://sfata.org/?p=Sen-Ron-Johnson-Speaks-With-SFATA
Contacting your reps, via letter, phone call, or in person is probably the most effective single action one can do. We need more people doing that. We need more people involved, period. Posting on ECF, or in the CASAA fb group, or other vape forums/groups only reaches a certain group of people, need to reach more than that.We may both be right...lol... I saw a letter to the FDA from Johnson Creek citing the same WSJ article that Senator Johnson's staff saw
http://sfata.org/?p=Sen-Ron-Johnson-Speaks-With-SFATA
You appear to be saying that Johnson Creek and Christian are not constituents, even though they are from Wisconsin. It is hard to tell with you as you are typically pretty vague in your responses. The reason the senator got involved was because both Christian and many other constituents contacted him about the issue. That is the same reason other politicians are becoming aware of the issues. It is becoming abundantly clear what actual works.
As for the small numbers, yes it is true. I do not see how a petition will change anything. The petitions I see, including yours, are pretty much limited to the cloistered vaping world. They are doing nothing to raise awareness of the issues.
Besides that, there is the issue of the poorly written petitions. If badly written petitions are your idea of raising awareness we are all in deep do do.
I'm saying that anyone, doing anything, to raise awareness beyond those who are already involved is a good thing. Online awareness campaigns are based on the idea that one person who agrees with the campaign will share it with their friends and family who may or may not be directly affected. Some people will read whatever their friends or family post. Some people may see a shared post from an organization they don't recognize and just ignore it. Some people will see something that they recognize, for instance Change, and will be more inclined to read what their friend or family has shared. Change specifically appeals to more liberal/progressive leaning people. I believe we need to explore every avenue of garnering support.
I second that. EVERY AVENUE.Even if you don't think it will help. I don't think that joining an advocacy group helps. Can someone explain to me how a free membership to CASAA shows the world how I support what they say? But I join them anyway. These laws didn't magically appear, they were put in place because enough people complained about them to cause change. Plain and simple. (will not engage tinfoil hat theories). How do you reverse that decision? Show them that more people actively support something than actively oppose it. How do you show that? Our advocacy groups can get up and say "we have ----- members", I guess that helps, kinda. Or our advocacy groups can say "we have ----- petitions signed by ------- people that oppose ------".
And this coming from someone who didn't even know there already where two petitions sent to the white house, with both being brushed off with the comment of, the FDA is taking care of it, and now you are advising we waste time and energy to do it again.
You are obviously new to advocacy so I guess a bit of a soft hand is probably in order, but those of us that have been at it awhile have long ago given up on petitions for the simple reason of they don't work, and are not worth the time and energy. You are simply not going to get a lot of support for another petition.
Your enthusiasm is commendable, but times change and it is long past due to move on.
No one here has addressed the issue of badly written petitions. Nearly all that have come up have serious ( in my opinion fatal) flaws. If education and raising awareness is the goal then even that is very questionable.
In all fairness, I signed an ecig petition in 2011, and also spoke at the new bedford board of health meeting discussing attaching the indoor smoking ban to electronic cigarettes. CASAA contacted me to represent them at the hearing, knowing it was a useless effort, but to hear what they would say about electronic cigarettes.
Petitions are not worth the time and energy? First name, last name, and email address, just in case you haven't tried yet, is all that's needed to sign. You have committed at least 10 posts, and probably 1000 words in opposition to petitions. Have you ever thought your resistance to petitions is a waste of time?
I see you still have not addressed any of the core issues I brought up. Why am I not surprised? You might want to give that a go instead of telling people who disagree with you to please please just go away.
Bottom line is that there are likely no vaping or THR advocacy groups that would still support petitions. I believe CASAA did throw some luke warm support behind one, but that was a special case and not likely to be repeated. This is a lost cause before it even begins.
Why are you all to willing to waste peoples time and energy on something that has proven to not be effective?
Since you missed the last time I said it, I will say it again. Our advocacy groups can't just go out there and say our members disagree with something. They need data to support that cause. That data comes in many forms. Medical research, surveys, and yes, even petitions. Without data to back their claims, nobody would listen to or respect our advocacy groups. The more data they have, the more they can support their claims.
How many people are members of the Republican party? How many of those members support Donald Trump and his ideals? This is a fine example where membership numbers alone do not portray the member's ideals. So how does the general public know that CASAA actually represents an actual group of people, or if it's just a ploy? Do they share their membership data? No. They use data gathered through surveys and petitions and testimonials to show the public we are real. I will continue later though as I am just about to head home from work.
One more thing. Please don't stop. Please don't go away. By responding continuously you are promoting this thread so that it stays on top and others can read it, see my links in my signature, and maybe waste that 45 seconds to sign.
I will pass on signing the petitions, but thanks for the offer. The two you are pushing are so poorly written they likely do more harm then good so I will stay away from that.
Data is certainly not gathered through petitions. They whole idea is pretty bizarre. The type of data you are talking about is exclusively gathered through surveys. There have been a number of vaping related petitions through the years, and none of them have ever been used by any of the advocacy groups, and it is very likely none ever will. The idea simply has no bases in the real world.
But you are right in that it is time to leave this thread. As usual hard lines are drawn and that is always the end of any usefulness.
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked
- Locked
