LR 801 tips/tricks?

[Pyloric Thinker]

Hey there!
I just got some full-sized 801's from Iken because of all the talk about the minis and semis I figured I had to try them. I've been vaping for a month now and have been using a Riva which measure about 4.2V fully charged and around 3.6 at the end of the day. I've been using mainly 510 premium and V2 cartos from Isaac, but the last 2 weeks I've been exploring the wide world of dripping with standard and LR atties (bauway and SLB). I've been quite successful with the 510's thanks to Switched and the rest of you guys who chimed in! Thanks again.

I've read a lot on 801 dripping and I guess it's supposed to be less temperamental then 510 dripping, but I haven't beat the learning curve yet. This is my experience:

I've dripped maybe 3 hours on the first one. I get nice clouds of vapor, a decent TH, but very little flavor compared to the 510. I also haven't found my sweet spot. I get clouds, clouds, little vape/nasty taste. I seem to be dumping more juice on this than I do my 510 with little result. I noticed a great deal of condensation on the walls of the atty and am curious if that's where my drops are going? With my 510's I move my pv every pull I take i.e. upward angle then downward angle. Button up then botton down (rotate). This seems to help keep everything saturated and tasting nicely until my vapor production drops then I drip 2 more. I try doing the same with the 801 but I get about 4 nice hits then very sudden drop in the vape/flavor (like I said not much to begin with) Where is all this juice going? It doesn't appear to be flooding (no gurgling, no leaking) Is this just the break-in period? It's a much bigger atty so I imagine there's much more surface to saturate?

Thanks for all your insight into the world of vaping. I like the forum as a whole, but this sub forum is a true gem! Ya'll (thanks bella ) drop pearls of wisdom on a daily basis for a newbie like myself to glean what we can. I'm a much better vaper because of it!

Vape On!
Ryan

 

[vikings]

Ryan, through my own experiences with 801 atties, I've learned that they are juice hogs!!! When dripping with a 510, 2-3 drops would be enough to get about 5-6 good hits. With an 801, I find that you might need anywhere between 3-6 drops for the same amount of hits.

Some people have mentioned that with a 510, it pays to drip directly onto the bridge while with an 801, it's better to drip down the inner wall of the atty. I'm not sure if that really makes a difference though.

I'm using the mini LR801s and my first one took a whole day to break-in. Give it a little more time and you should see a noticeable improvement

I'm fortunate enough to own a Reo, and I can say without hesitation that the 801 loves a bottom-fed mod!

 

[Switched]

The 801 is a funny atty and something of a disappointment for new folks. I say this in all candour as a mere observation. The 510 will spoil you for anything else so to speak, but...

The 510 is probably the easiest atty to master. When it came along, the JoyE 510 atty toted a 2.2 Ohm resistance which made it believe it or not a low resistance atty for the time, and why folks jumped on the 510 band wagon. It also offered a more compact style of device in comparison with the pen styles out there.

I will not go into great detail between the 3, as this has already been written before. The 801 provides the greatest flavour of the three (510, 801, 901) but is deemed as a wet/cooler vape. In keeping it short, the 801 is a little juice hog by the mere surface area of the mesh (stainless steel) and also why it primes with 8 drops (the most of all attys) and drips at 3-4 drops depending on the liquid and individual.

We will leave the 306 out of the discussion for the moment, that sucker is in a category of its own. Why? It was a poor performer with carts but a gem with dripping and dipping. Most original users of the 306 used to dip with it.

Priming
Something I have started with all new attys I break in, is a recommendation that Isaac provided me with the 306. Fill with 7 drops, allow to soak a few seconds/minutes, hit the button twice for a second or two, add 2 more drops and vape away. It worked so I never questioned the routine. Having an engineering background, I had to figure it out Why the 2 x 2 sec hits. Haha! Warming through! By doing this you are heating up the SS wick a certain amount, reducing the viscosity of the liquid somewhat which allows it to reach all the nooks and crannies. Brilliant! It's a simple test that anyone can do in the comfort of their own homes. One that I do religiously now with all my new atties

Another discovery, this time from 5card I believe, flooding his 801 to the bridge. I doesn't work for me as I leak like a sieve and vapour production is simply not there. I may be doing something wrong, but I do know that firing the atty in a flooded state (to get vapour) stresses the coil. But, the procedure ensures complete saturation of the wick. Once a wick is wet, it will remain wet/moist. As long as a wick is moist, in theory it will not burn. I believe that we burn our wicks at the start vice from vaping our attys too dry. Let me explain.

We are all happy and feeling good inside that we stalk our mailboxes We get new stuff and want to play with it now! Hell we have all done it. In our haste I believe we may actually harm our equipment, when it comes to attys burn our wicks. Once a wick is burnt, it is burnt and outside of de-wicking the atty, the burnt taste will be there for ever (my experience) and causes us to drip more and less efficiently in order to get the flavour and not the burnt taste.

So..... after the saturation period (5Card's method) blow your atty out, partially re-prime your atty with 4-5 drops and vape away, topping off when flavour or VP diminishes. For folks that don't want to waste juice, use PG instead or diluted VG. On the 801 you can get 4-5 good hits per drop. Leaking is better than not leaking in the beginning. It is indeed a PITA, but you will soon learn to drip appropriately vice burning the wicks.

In closing the 801s mini and semi are little fog machines. Fog = lot's of dense vapour. To accomplish that you need lots and lots of liquid. So they are juice hogs. Expect your juice consumption to go up equally. I hope this helps.

BTW I do not recommend 901s fro dripping until the individual has mastered dripping, perhaps too strong a word (mastered) but the 901 is an extremely hard atty to keep in balance and 1 drop is all it takes to go one way or the other. The 901s are prone to failure when operated in a flooded condition.

 

[benjayman2]

Thanks so much for that informative post switched. I really learned a lot about why the 801s are my fave and why I'm getting such good results (I tend to do the 2x2 rule and thought I was alone )

@vikings I also have a REO and must agree that the 801s are great combo with them

 

[VaporMadness]

I find the 801s take more liquid (and time) to prime due to their larger size, but once up and running, are similar in operation to the 510... 2 (or 3 drops) per drip session is all it takes for me.

It takes a little patience for me to get the best performance out of them. Involves having liquid in them when the atty is warm (so the viscosity is lowered by the temp), and allowing the juice to permeate deeply throughout. Then letting them cool down while very well saturated. That resting part takes patience. From that well saturated cool state... i get clouds of vapor along with a slightly tighter draw.

So in some sense, instead of drip then vape, vape then drip so its ready to vape next time. But it's a balancing act. In reality I do drip then vape, but I'm mostly vaping what i dripped the time before than what i just dripped. The new drips get heated and permeate, and the already deeply permeated previous drops get vaporized. Also, I don't vape it dry and prefer slightly thicker juice (so it stays in the mesh/wick more easily instead of leaking).

So the 2 x 2 second burst thing makes sense to me too... helps work it into that deeply saturated state.

In response to the OP, it could be that the 801 you have is slightly higher res. Have you looked at it with an ohm meter? Also, it sounds like you may be vaping what splashes on the coil without having allowed it to deeply saturate the wick/mesh.

 

[Pyloric Thinker]

You guys have done it again! Thanks Switched for another amazing write up! Thanks Vapor for your input. I may have ruined the first one, but with your help I won't ruin the next! I'm going to put your tips to work tonight during my vape session and hopefully I can mimic your experience! Take care my good man... or men? haha

Vape On!

Ryan

 

[Switched]

Anything to help a brother in need. We love spreading the cheer here

 

[NCVapingLady]

I can definitely attest to all of the above. I've been vaping w/an 801 atty from pretty much the beginning, and while it was a major learning curve for me, I definitely like dripping w/it. It usually takes me about 1/2 - 3/4 of a day to break in an IkenVape LR 801 atty and it is sooo worth it!

 

[Sewknitty]

VaporMadness, that's good advice. I do drip right after I vape but I do it so the PV is ready. I never thought about why I have such good luck with the 801s for dripping but maybe saturation while cooling has everything to do with my enjoyment.

My vaping standards must be low or I vape a lot because it only takes me a couple hours to break in one of Isaac's 801s, except for the full sized ones. Those can take a day and I don't know why. What I do is similar to what's been posted. I drip about 7 or 8 drops into the new atty and let it soak up for a few minutes or for as long as I have patience. I fire it up three or four times in four second bursts, then I drip about three to four drops, fire it up again like that and then I drip and set it aside til I'm ready to vape. I completely avoid that new atty nastiness this way. After my fourth of fifth vape I drip and set the PV aside so its ready when I am for the next vape.

It took me longer to learn how to handle 510s for dripping. I may order some from Isaac because I'd put them away and turned my attention completely to the 801s until I got a mod with a native 510 that doesn't like adapters. Seriously, vaping on a 510 is like vaping through a pencil. ...what's that about??

 

[NCVapingLady]

VaporMadness, that's good advice. I do drip right after I vape but I do it so the PV is ready. I never thought about why I have such good luck with the 801s for dripping but maybe saturation while cooling has everything to do with my enjoyment.

My vaping standards must be low or I vape a lot because it only takes me a couple hours to break in one of Isaac's 801s, except for the full sized ones. Those can take a day and I don't know why. What I do is similar to what's been posted. I drip about 7 or 8 drops into the new atty and let it soak up for a few minutes or for as long as I have patience. I fire it up three or four times in four second bursts, then I drip about three to four drops, fire it up again like that and then I drip and set it aside til I'm ready to vape. I completely avoid that new atty nastiness this way. After my fourth of fifth vape I drip and set the PV aside so its ready when I am for the next vape.

It took me longer to learn how to handle 510s for dripping. I may order some from Isaac because I'd put them away and turned my attention completely to the 801s until I got a mod with a native 510 that doesn't like adapters. Seriously, vaping on a 510 is like vaping through a pencil. ...what's that about??

My 1/2 day break-ins have been for the full sized 801's. I'm out of both semi and minis, actually I think I may have one semi left but saving it for a special occasion!

Funny thing about atty preferences though. My hubby is an ex-801 user. He now exclusively uses 510s and he loves them. They are okay, but I think I'll stick to my 801 love!

 

[VaporMadness]

I haven't been dripping for all that long, only since October, before that it was all carts with foam filler. But the flavor and predictable performance you can get from dripping and lack of muss-and-fuss have finally won me over. I'm still working on "the art of dripping" and really appreciate all the tips-and-tricks I pick up in this forum... from Switch's exhaustive knowledge base in particular... but from everybody really... so helpful!

 

[cappadoc]

I rarely use anything but an 801 now. The flavor is far and beyond the flavor I get from a 510. They are less messy than 901, usually.

Switched sums up their use pretty well. They are certainly a fickle mistress. When they are "on", they are fabulous. When they are "off", they are frustrating as hell. They can be leak prone with thin juice and eat juice quickly. I only get 1-2 hits per drop max. I load 3 drops usually and get 6, maybe 7, puffs.

If I could get my 801 to work better on my Ali'i, I would be in in vaping heaven. As it is, I am relegated to dripping on a bottom feed mod. But the 801 is worth the effort.

 

[Pyloric Thinker]

Happy to report a pleasant vaping experience on the 801 last night! I'm starting to get the thick clouds and better flavor out of the 801. I don't even think I've ruined the first one. It was just still in the "break in" phase. The dripping post vape session was a great tip. I've also found taking a quick, unactivated pull about a second before activation seems to wet everything up really nicely! I forget where I read that one, but it helps. Thanks again!

Ryan

 

[Sewknitty]

Good tip, Ryan. Glad your vapes have improved!

 

[VaporMadness]

Happy to report a pleasant vaping experience on the 801 last night! I'm starting to get the thick clouds and better flavor out of the 801. I don't even think I've ruined the first one. It was just still in the "break in" phase. The dripping post vape session was a great tip. I've also found taking a quick, unactivated pull about a second before activation seems to wet everything up really nicely! I forget where I read that one, but it helps. Thanks again!

Ryan

Yup, and so it goes, these little things that make it work for individual vaping styles. I think each atty has it's own unique personality. When I bust out a new one, it takes a little while to get to know it. It'll be similar to other of its kind, but a little different too... slightly different resistance, air flow, and wicking characteristics... i had this one 510 atty that refused to accept liquid from a cart, would vape great with dripping, but just could not be used with a cart.

I finally ordered some of the mini 801s, they're on there way here now, 1x LR (i think i got the last one) and 2x HVs. I've been using the fullsize LR801s for sometime now, just never got the mini until this time around. They're coming along with 2 LifePO batts... so 6v clouds of vapor are soon to follow

 

[Switched]

Ahhhh, I sensed a Goldielock accent in that post. Glad to see ya back VM. I believe you will be pleased with your purchases. I'm rocking the mini HV on my GLV2 at the moment. As Goldie would say, not too hot, not too cold, just right at 2-3 sec pulls.

 

[aprioristic]

I've gotten better dripping in the full-sized 801 from these tips and ones before...good stuff. I still have a couple issues though. One is more with one atty in particular. It seems to get clogged up and I need to take it off and blow through hard to get it performing better. I don't know if that is because I end up flooding it or something else is building up in there. I'm not using a sugary juice, so it doesn't make sense.

On all my atties then, I do end up flooding them sometimes and I do use pretty thin juices (15-20% VG). I doubt I want to go past 40% VG, but do you think I will get better performance upping it toward there?

Last thing is that I am hoping to buy the mini and/or semi 801s to try out when I can. I don't like the black whistle tips that come with the full sized, but what drip tips can I buy that fit the smaller versions?

 

[VaporMadness]

About juice thinkness... personally, I think there's a good range of juice thickness that individual dripping styles can be made to work with. I think Switched prefers to thin them up since he's cultivated techniques that work well with thinner liquids, but others insist on slightly thicker juices deriding hi PG liquids as "too runny". The ratios you mentioned all sound workable to me. But all-in-all, I'd expect thicker liquids would tend to clog up more than thinner liquids, so i'm not sure upping the VG would help?

Ha... I wonder if any DIY'ers alter the ratio depending on the season, thicker in the summer and thinner in the winter

Isaac mentioned a place where you can get particular drip tips that fit the current super-short minis... but i can't find that post right now... maybe somebody else can dig it up... it was in the last couple of weeks. He also mentioned the 'minis' will be getting ever so slightly less mini (2 mm longer) so that pretty much all 801 drip-tips will work with them. Not sure when that will happen.

Hmmmm... I guess that makes me 0 for 2 on actually answering those two questions

edit: ah ha!!! found the post about the 801 drip tips...
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/ikenvape/144543-hv-semi-801-attomizer-3.html#post2393375

 

[Switched]

VM is absolutely correct on his observation(s), a caveat...

The major ingredients that can hold nicotine in suspension PG and VG, and as discussed elsewhere one is 25% more viscous than the other. Originally folks were vaping PG flavoured nic thsoe who were allergic to PG, VG flavoured nic. Someone noticed that vapour production of VG was far superior to PG. It is and it has its draw backs. It is good to see that both PG and VG are available as suspension liquids for those who are allergic to either or.

In my experience, regardless of wickability 100% VG is a poor vapour producer in itself, so increasing the VG concentration will not necessarily increase "performance". OTOH properly dilute VG will, as it does wick better. This is a point many will argue (on the DIY sub) because you are boiling water. Last time I checked vapour = steam = water in gas form. Point to note: the learnt DIYers dilute their VG 15-25%.

NHalers high octane liquids are the.... as far as I am concerned from experience, they are simply too thick.

Every now and again you will get an atty that for some reason doesn't perform as well, or perhaps wasn't broken in properly or whatever, it is just the way it is.

Ah yes Goldie winter and summer oil. Ya need to carry your PVs in your inside pockets as well as your liquids in this type of weather. This is even with diluted VG. Man I wish I wasn't allergic to PG. I enjoy VG but miss certain traits only a PG liquid could offer.

 

[aprioristic]

VM that thread says right after where you linked:

Delrin 801 drip tips from COV fit both the shorties and the tall guys.

and Isaac is supposed to be working on custom ones too. I guess I will just hold out until the other stuff I want is back in stock and see. I was hoping to hear the "twisted and colored" ones from that other place would fit.

On VG and the 801, even though I am flooding less, maybe I am still dripping too much. After like 10 times dripping, sometimes I might get flooded out, or performance will drop. I can get a gurgling but the atty will be a dry hit, or if I blow out into a tissue (and see a lot of juice) and then re-prime I get better performance. This just means I am dripping too much right? I do space out and take like 1 hit then set it down, come back and re-drip sometimes.

I've only been vaping 2 months, so I don't know how summer vaping is. Are you guys just saying that liquids get too runny? I'd probably try to keep my gear out of direct sun for long anyhow..

In terms of the mixing, I feel bad for you that you can't tolerate PG Switched. I think if I was allergic I would be tempted to quit vaping. The one time I vaped like 80-90% VG, I got phlegm and a coating on my tongue, couldn't stand it. I was actually wondering how low I could go on VG before getting too invisible of a vape, but I haven't played around with it yet. If that is going to hurt 801 performance, or I would maybe get better performance going toward 60/40 PG/VG, I just wanted to know.

It's curious to me that you say "vapour = steam = water in gas form", because there is definitely something different about vaping VG. I read your thread about predominantly-VG mixes hurting performance, and I know how VG gunks up my mouth. Is the problem that VG doesn't convert as fully to water when vaporized as PG?