Mixing By Weight: Basics 101

[Capt.shay]

10ml testers is all I have made so far, I haven't made anything I like so far but 10ml down the drain is better than 30ml. When I do get the recipes figured out they will be 100ml at a time.

Well, if you have yet to be successful, perhaps you should try doing something different. 30ml of DIY juice should have cost you less than 60 cents. A small price to pay to know that you are probably making a more accurate representation of your recipe because if every thing you tried to develope so far has gone down the drain, THAT is a waste of money.

 

[mhertz]

I always test new flavors(or used too) standalone first just with a drop in some unflavored, so I know if I like the flavor or if it's vile. It's harder to make an unvapeble mix imho if knowing each of the flavors used are fine by themselves and not disgusting. Then, 30ml test batches later on rarely go wrong... Then again, I never go by other peoples recipes and make my own(used too, before unflavoured took over), but never that advanced either though.

 

[corn flakes]

Well, if you have yet to be successful, perhaps you should try doing something different. 30ml of DIY juice should have cost you less than 60 cents. A small price to pay to know that you are probably making a more accurate representation of your recipe because if every thing you tried to develope so far has gone down the drain, THAT is a waste of money.

Right now I am testing flavors. Only made a couple of batches. What I am trying to do is get a replacement for my start the day juice. I have started with it almost everyday for the last 2 years and is probably the only juice I could vape all day. It's also the most expensive juice I vape and it is from an obscure Canadian supplier that nobody has heard of.

 

[OlderNDirt]

Pipettes are OK, but trying to ring the top of a bottle with something that long just magnifies the shakiness of fingers.

I when I read this. Picturing myself the first time I tried using a pipette in spite of essential tremors. Took 15 minutes to clean things up, juice going everywhere! And no, can't bring myself to use pipettes AND a funnel!

 

[oplholik]

You know, and I swear this is true, some of my favorite diy mixes have come to me in my sleep, usually after having thought about needing a new flavor for awhile. I'll get up in the morning and it will hit me to try a little of this, and a little of that. Believe it or not.

 

[Burnie]

That's why I bought the Boston Rounds 60ml bottles (larger top opening). You can always make smaller batches. Mine get poured into LDPE bottles with narrow tips that fit my Kayfun after steeping in the glass bottles.

This funnel set makes it easy to pour into small bottle tops. Pull one leg of a paper clip away and insert it in the bottle before the funnel and you avoid airlock while pouring.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000FKERMW/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o09_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

But mixing in one container, and pouring into another, is what I am wanting to get away from (or part of it ).

Glad you took the leap to see what it is about. Yes, making a 10ml batch is a little difficult. That is why I never do it. To much of a margin of error. But, it would be much easier to make an error with the syringe than with the scale. A 30ml batch cost about 10 cents more and you have a lot more room for slight variations. I never make a batch smaller than 15ml and almost always opt for a 30ml batch.

Welcome to the way of the weigh Burnie. It's good to have you on board. I am certain that as you become more comfortable with the scale and dispensers, you will come to appreciate all the advantages of weight based mixing.

My 30ml bottles have the same top hole as the 10ml, SMALL. I did get a little over on a couple of flavors, but less than .05g (less than 1 drop from pipette), so I still feel it was close enough. It's not rocket science, I feel it is more like cooking, you can cook the same thing several times, and there will be little variations in each, but all good in the end, as long as your starting ingredients are good.

I'm going through starting back up into DYI, so I am making a lot of tester bottles trying to find that dozen or so that I really like and want to make on a regular basis. I am up to around 50 different flavorings, plus I make my own NET and Coffee flavoring. I liked the idea of mixing in the bottle so I don't have a lot of stuff to wash afterwards. I am thinking I am going to like the "Way of the Weigh".

 

[Capt.shay]

Right now I am testing flavors. Only made a couple of batches. What I am trying to do is get a replacement for my start the day juice. I have started with it almost everyday for the last 2 years and is probably the only juice I could vape all day. It's also the most expensive juice I vape and it is from an obscure Canadian supplier that nobody has heard of.

Well, throw out a flavor profile and let's have a go at it. We may not get yo all the way to cloning your fav. but you may also find that you can actually do it better because you can tailor it to your personal taste.

 

[Capt.shay]

My 30ml bottles have the same top hole as the 10ml, SMALL.

It's not the size of the bottle hole but rather the batch size. With a bigger batch, small errors are much less noticeable. I like repeat-ability. I do appreciate variations on a recipe but I want to intentionally call that and not by random chance.

Keep us posted!

 

[Burnie]

Well, throw out a flavor profile and let's have a go at it. We may not get yo all the way to cloning your fav.

Not Corn flakes, but have you ever tried Wakonda by Nicoticket? I am not even coming close in trying to figure it out. Just working on finding something for my ADV that I can mix before my stock runs out, so I have 6 to 8 months to work on it.

It's not the size of the bottle hole but rather the batch size. With a bigger batch, small errors are much less noticeable. I like repeat-ability. I do appreciate variations on a recipe but I want to intentionally call that and not by random chance.
Keep us posted!

Oh I agree on the batch size once I get a good recipe, which I have a couple, then I mix in 60ml sample size Currently I have 11 10ml test recipes ageing (just mixed another with the scale, easier second time around). Every week I mix up 1 to 3 new bottles, then on the weekend I do some testing to see where they are at and if I might like them. Not sure I like Dragon Fruit, that is a different flavor (got 2 ageing), but I'll give it at least a month, then if I don't like it I'll see if my son likes it. I have been looking a lot at ELR to get ideas on flavor combinations and percentages, but I generally go lower than most % that I see, I feel some over flavor there juice, I shoot for around 15% total.

 

[bwh79]

I've read the comments about missing the first drop. Did we decide that dripping multiple drops woke it up to the point where it would measure the weight accurately if the quantity is more than a drop or two and hits the scale in a continuous stream?

I don't have your same scale, but it sounds like it might be auto-zeroing like mine does:

Yes, it's when small amounts (i.e. individual drops) are added slowly. It's called auto-zeroing or something and supposedly it's a "feature, not a bug" as far as I can tell. This is how it works on my SF-400D at least, not sure about on others: In order to prevent erroneous data from i.e. dust settling on the tray between taring and weighing, very small fluctuations from zero will be ignored. Once a weight is registered, small fluctuations are then counted.

In practice, this means that:

If I tare, and then add a single drop, it will not be registered. I can wait a bit, then add another drop, which will also not be registered. Wait a bit...add a drop, nothing. And again, and again. No matter how much I add, as long as it's one drop at a time and I wait a second or two in between for the reading to "settle," it will continue to read zero. Once a weight is registered (if I add a few drops in quick succession before it settles, or anything heavier than about .02-.03g), then it registers just that last amount that was added, but all the previous single drops are just gone. Poof. As if they never happened. But then, after it gets a reading, further individual drops will be counted; auto-zeroing only happens right near the zero point (after you tare).

Interestingly, if I add an object (a nickel or whatever, I usually just use the cap from the bottle I'm working with) so that it reads a weight -- say, 5g, and then I can add a drop and it will read it -- 5.02 on the display, for example -- but then if I remove the nickel, the .02 that had previously registered, will just "disappear." Once the nickel is gone you would expect it to read 0.02, but instead, now that it's back near the zero point, the auto-zeroing feature kicks in and sees that .02 as "erroneous" so just makes it vanish. I can even put the nickel back on and it will read 5.00 again, as if that drop I added -- and the scale registered, initially -- never even happened.

You can test this yourself. Make sure it's "awake," put your bottle on and hit the "tare" button so the display reads 0.00g. Put one drop in, and let it settle. (You can test this with water, so you don't waste ingredients. Or you can do it "live" in your next mixing session if you use something like PG or VG that won't mess up your mix too much if there's an extra half a ml or so in there at the end.) Does it still read 0.00? Put another drop in, and again, wait for the scale to settle. Still 0.00? If, after four or five or ten drops (letting the reading settle for a couple seconds after each one), it is still reading 0.00, then we know something's up. There should be like like a quarter to a half a mil of liquid in there, the scale should be reading at least .10 by now but it's still at zero. Try dripping two or three drops in all at once, or give it a good "squirt." Do you get a reading this time? Now, add one more drop. It is counted this time, and has not "vanished" like all the drops you did before? Your scale is auto-zeroing. Just make sure that, any time the scale is reading zero, don't let it settle back to zero after an individual drop. Make sure you get that second drop in (maybe three, depending on your dropper size) before it settles. If you really need to check the weight of that first drop, before deciding whether to add the second one, you can do it fine if the scale is not at zero before you add the single drop. Just put something else on the scale (or just don't tare it after you put the bottle on) so there's a weight registered, then add the single drop and check manually how much it adds to the reading.

 

[corn flakes]

Well, throw out a flavor profile and let's have a go at it. We may not get yo all the way to cloning your fav. but you may also find that you can actually do it better because you can tailor it to your personal taste.

Here's the description of the juice.

Nice Vapors Vanilla Ice e-Liquid is a smooth, sweet and creamy vape. Rich notes of vanilla and sweet cream combine to make a perfectly balanced Vanilla Ice Cream e-liquid that would make Vanilla Ice himself sing 'Ice Ice baby' all the way to the vape shop.

 

[Capt.shay]

Here's the description of the juice.

Nice Vapors Vanilla Ice e-Liquid is a smooth, sweet and creamy vape. Rich notes of vanilla and sweet cream combine to make a perfectly balanced Vanilla Ice Cream e-liquid that would make Vanilla Ice himself sing 'Ice Ice baby' all the way to the vape shop.

Ok, have you tried TFA Vanilla Bean Ice Cream yet?

 

[corn flakes]

Ok, have you tried TFA Vanilla Bean Ice Cream yet?

That was one of the first ones I tried.

 

[Capt.shay]

That was one of the first ones I tried.

Was it any where near? How was it different? Sweeter not sweet enough. VBIC has a bit of a sharp note in the background, almost a very light cinnamon or super light pepper. Is that present in the store bought.

The store bought was undoubtedly a mix of several flavors. The store description is weak at best (much like Vanilla Ice). Your going to have to give us some more direction in what you are trying to achieve here.

 

[Burnie]

Ok, have you tried TFA Vanilla Bean Ice Cream yet?

pepper

Just my thoughts, TFA has a strong pepper taste to me (even after a month), but Cap (like best) and FW do not. JMHO

 

[Capt.shay]

Just my thoughts, TFA has a strong pepper taste to me (even after a month), but Cap (like best) and FW do not. JMHO

Well, I kind of like that little tickle but if it is to strong for the recipe then Miss. Marshmallow will smooth things out.

 

[Burnie]

Well, I kind of like that little tickle but if it is to strong for the recipe then Miss. Marshmallow will smooth things out.

Well someday I'll try the TFA again and add marshmallow to see if it helps, but not holding my breath. To me is not a "Tickle" but like vaping Black Pepper, even after over a month of ageing. But I will try it just to see.

 

[ghola1was]

Off Topic side note - OP's Berry Berry Good is, well, very Berry Berry Good. Finally got around to trying it.

Big thanx to the Capt.

 

[DaveP]

I don't have your same scale, but it sounds like it might be auto-zeroing like mine does:

I hit the tare button after putting the bottle on the scale and after each individual pour of a single ingredient.

I've learned to add in larger amounts to make it wake up and register. I'm still not sure if it senses the first drop(s), but I start with nic and use a dropper to suck up half a dropper tube and squirt it all in a stream into the bottle. I get a reading that seems correct. It takes about 4 droppers half filled to reach the 1.5mg level for my nic percentage.

I have also tested with single drops and gotten a re-zero with one drop. Several drops seems to register correctly or at least closely. Next DIY session I'll try dropping 20 drops in a continuous stream and see if I get one gram with water.

 

[DaveP]

On the EJuiceMeUp web site the author recommends weighing all your ingredients to make sure that what you are using is accurate instead of using the numbers for typical ingredients. Does anyone actually weigh 1 ml of 100mg/ml nic and use the weight for a standard?

My Nic is 100mg/ml 75pg/25vg. I looked up the gram weights for 100mg nic in PG and VG on BotBoy's site, then put in the PG nic weight 3 times and the VG nic weight 1 time, added them up and divided by 4 to get the average gram weight. I get 1.085 grams for my nic.

As far as I'm concerned that's close enough for my purposes. I have been using 1.1mg for nic, but entered the "correct" number that I calculated. For grins, I may just find a 1ml syringe that still has markings on it and give it a try in my next DIY session. I just wonder if I can really trust that small amount on the LB-501 scale. I guess I'll have to try the nickel trick and subtract.

The ultimate test is that your juice tastes good and eliminates the thoughts of going back to smoking cigarettes!