Natural Tobaccos

[Jerms]

Oh, I didn't mean to "correct" you. I was just reporting my personal experience with BGB, which I think does run counter to the general consensus here.

The posts that talk about BGB not changing with age are usually referring to how it doesn't require steeping, as it's the same on day one as it is on day 30. Yours is the only post I remember that talk about how it is after the expiration date on the bottle, my guess is not many have had BGB around much past the 6 month mark.

For me I wouldn't really qualify a NET that loses flavor after 6 months a reverse steeper. Since what we talk about here is mainly natural ingredients instead of synthetic, they just normally don't have the shelf life of artificially flavored juice. NETs like Fire Cured from GeJ that start degrading after several weeks, not several months, is what I'd consider a reverse steeper.

 

[Mr.Mann]

The posts that talk about BGB not changing with age are usually referring to how it doesn't require steeping, as it's the same on day one as it is on day 30. Yours is the only post I remember that talk about how it is after the expiration date on the bottle, my guess is not many have had BGB around much past the 6 month mark.

For me I wouldn't really qualify a NET that loses flavor after 6 months a reverse steeper. Since what we talk about here is mainly natural ingredients instead of synthetic, they just normally don't have the shelf life of artificially flavored juice. NETs like Fire Cured from GeJ that start degrading after several weeks, not several months, is what I'd consider a reverse steeper.

And to add to the reverse steeping bit, as much as I still love the people behind VCV (I really mean so), those liquids didn't just lose oomph, they actually turned bad on me (like truly expired). That was after 3 months or so. I haven't had their liquids in awhile, so they may not still be like that (that was almost a year ago).

 

[Jerms]

And to add to the reverse steeping bit, as much as I still love Aria and Julie at VCV, those liquids don't just lose oomph, they actually turned bad on me (like truly expired). That was after 3 months or so.

It's funny, on the VCV thread I've seen a lot posting how the tobaccos like White Beard are almost unvapable until a long steep. Too grassy and other descriptions that a lot of us here actually like. Goes to show, what's a long steeper to some is a reverse steeper to others. Like with FC from GeJ, most of us find the extra oomph it has as what makes it great, and because it looses that it's a reverse steeper for us. Others who don't like the kick it has find it improves with age and becomes more of a mild tobacco that works better for them.

In general reverse steepers describes not so much a juice that goes bad or foul, but one that loses certain flavor notes or becomes muted, so really any juice that makes fairly drastic changes will be a long steeper for some and reverse steeper for others. Smooth Crim would be a reverse steeper for someone who likes dessert TINO type juices and doesn't care much for tobacco. For the rest of us, that dessert loss is our gain.

We need to match up people of opposite tastes, someone can buy a big bottle of SC who only likes the dessert side, and ship it to you after it reverse steeps on them. You can buy some FC and ship it off when it looses the oomph.

 

[Mr.Mann]

It's funny, on the VCV thread I've seen a lot posting how the tobaccos like White Beard are almost unvapable until (??????) a long steep. Too grassy and other descriptions that a lot of us here actually like. Goes to show, what's a long steeper to some is a reverse steeper to others. Like with FC from GeJ, most of us find the extra oomph it has as what makes it great, and because it looses that it's a reverse steeper for us. Others who don't like the kick it has find it improves with age and becomes more of a mild tobacco that works better for them.

In general reverse steepers describes not so much a juice that goes bad or foul, but one that loses certain flavor notes or becomes muted, so really any juice that makes fairly drastic changes will be a long steeper for some and reverse steeper for others. Smooth Crim would be a reverse steeper for someone who likes dessert TINO type juices and doesn't care much for tobacco. For the rest of us, that dessert loss is our gain.

We need to match up people of opposite tastes, someone can buy a big bottle of SC who only likes the dessert side, and ship it to you after it reverse steeps on them. You can buy some FC and ship it off when it looses the oomph.

Brilliant!!!!!!!!!

 

[erawk]

My package sat in Chicago ISC customs for 13 days before it was released, hopefully your wait won't be as long. Got the Kayfun loaded with diy tobacco/clove and thoroughly enjoying it.

funny it showed up in the mail today... Installed it along with the pmma spare parts kit. The clear inner well is so cool. I like seeing the juice level even more than I thought. Plus an added bonus is you can see the coil condition by just pulling off the drip tip. The added light from all angles makes things highly visible.

 

[billherbst]

The posts that talk about BGB not changing with age are usually referring to how it doesn't require steeping, as it's the same on day one as it is on day 30. Yours is the only post I remember that talk about how it is after the expiration date on the bottle, my guess is not many have had BGB around much past the 6 month mark.

For me I wouldn't really qualify a NET that loses flavor after 6 months a reverse steeper. Since what we talk about here is mainly natural ingredients instead of synthetic, they just normally don't have the shelf life of artificially flavored juice. NETs like Fire Cured from GeJ that start degrading after several weeks, not several months, is what I'd consider a reverse steeper.

Jerms,

For what it's worth, none of the five Ahlusion juices I have lists an expiration date on the label, and I don't see one printed directly on the brown bottle. Has Ahlusion stated that their juices have a six-month shelf life?

I've used the term "reverse-steeper" in numerous posts, but I intentionally didn't use it in my posts today. My intention was mostly to share how sad I was to witness the diminishment of such a superb juice while the bottle remains half-full. I'm not even complaining, since I agree with you that natural flavorings tend to degrade much, much faster than synthetic, lab-based flavorings. (I still have some Dekang synthetic tobaccos from 2010 that remain three years later about 90% of what they were when new---I don't vape those either, LOL). I don't know if it's inevitable, but the demise of natural ingredients over time does seem pronounced.

My BGB was amazing for about 3-4 months. Then I noticed it starting to lose oomph. The only time I vaped it by itself was before adding some BGB to other tobacco juices to give them a boost or invigorate them, so I often had the "My, how you've grown!" experience (or in this case, "My, how you've shrunk!"). About six months in, I stopped Frankenjuicing with BGB because it had tamed to mere house cat status from the imposing (and dangerous) tiger it had been originally. "RIP, BGB, we hardly knew ye..."

None of this is to be taken as a criticism of BGB or Ahlusion. Blue Grass Burley remains for me the Gold Standard of NETs, the one that set the bar's current upper limit. The fact that I wasn't in love with the juice and didn't vape BGB much by itself is incidental and not relevant to my judgment. Whether I like it or not, I know a superlative NET when I vape one.

 

[Big Juicy]

Every once in a while you have a revelatory vape. Bobas...your first good NET...your first legit NET RY4 (for some)...BGB...Smooth Criminal...LOUISVILLE...Managua...Big Spirit...

Well...I had one today. I went off some suggestions and blended some NETCOM Single Varietals for an English pipe blend. I went 20% Latakia, 30% Burley, 20% Virginia, and 30% Perique. GLORY. It is a true and unmistakable English pipe blend and for me it is better than London by a small margin. Just less muddled some how. It is one of the few vapes I have ever had that I refer to as an "authentic smoke" which is rarefied air I save for the likes of Louisville and BGB. Truly outstanding stuff. I cannot recommend playing with NETCOM single varietals enough!!!

 

[Jerms]

Jerms,

For what it's worth, none of the five Ahlusion juices I have lists an expiration date on the label, and I don't see one printed directly on the brown bottle. Has Ahlusion stated that their juices have a six-month shelf life?

I've used the term "reverse-steeper" in numerous posts, but I intentionally didn't use it in my posts today. My intention was mostly to share how sad I was to witness the diminishment of such a superb juice while the bottle remains half-full. I'm not even complaining, since I agree with you that natural flavorings tend to degrade much, much faster than synthetic, lab-based flavorings. (I still have some Dekang synthetic tobaccos from 2010 that remain three years later about 90% of what they were when new---I don't vape those either, LOL). I don't know if it's inevitable, but the demise of natural ingredients over time does seem pronounced.

My BGB was amazing for about 3-4 months. Then I noticed it starting to lose oomph. The only time I vaped it by itself was before adding some BGB to other tobacco juices to give them a boost or invigorate them, so I often had the "My, how you've grown!" experience (or in this case, "My, how you've shrunk!"). About six months in, I stopped Frankenjuicing with BGB because it had tamed to mere house cat status from the imposing (and dangerous) tiger it had been originally. "RIP, BGB, we hardly knew ye..."

None of this is to be taken as a criticism of BGB or Ahlusion. Blue Grass Burley remains for me the Gold Standard of NETs, the one that set the bar's current upper limit. The fact that I wasn't in love with the juice and didn't vape BGB much by itself is incidental and not relevant to my judgment. Whether I like it or not, I know a superlative NET when I vape one.

I had to check my bottle of Maple Burley.. yup, you're right, no best-by date. They do have it on everything else though that's not in the aromatic line, and they go by 6 months from mix date. That date though is being extremely conservative for most of their juices though, most seem to last a lot longer and sometimes the best-by date is closer to a start-vaping date for some lol.

But yeah, 6 months is the lifetime Ahl says their juices are best by. In your case for BGB, that happens to be case. I'm sure I'd feel the same way as you if it looses it's kick after several months, so I sure won't be ordering the 60ml of them (not that I'd order 60ml of anything anyways). If there's one thing that I hate, is a strong tobacco juice that has lost it's kick. Not mad at the vendor, but an anger aimed purely at the bottle of juice that does went south. I glared at FC when it happened... how dare you? Not that it tasted bad, but sure hard to enjoy when it just evokes fond memories of feelings it can no longer provide.

 

[Jerms]

Actually I take that back. I don't feel anger at tobacco that looses it's groove. Not anger, disappointment. Like a father telling his son he's disappointed in him.. it's worse than anger.

 

[billherbst]

Every once in a while you have a revelatory vape. Bobas...your first good NET...your first legit NET RY4 (for some)...BGB...Smooth Criminal...LOUISVILLE...Managua...Big Spirit...

Well...I had one today. I went off some suggestions and blended some NETCOM Single Varietals for an English pipe blend. I went 20% Latakia, 30% Burley, 20% Virginia, and 30% Perique. GLORY. It is a true and unmistakable English pipe blend and for me it is better than London by a small margin. Just less muddled some how. It is one of the few vapes I have ever had that I refer to as an "authentic smoke" which is rarefied air I save for the likes of Louisville and BGB. Truly outstanding stuff. I cannot recommend playing with NETCOM single varietals enough!!!

BJ,

I haven't done any complex tobacco blending, neither pre-extraction nor post. All my tobacco extractions have been from blends to start with, either from cigarettes or pipe tobaccos. I have only one single-leaf retail extract (Dark Burley from MVJ), and I haven't done anything with that except mix up a small bottle of juice, which was predictably one-dimensional and boring. Sure, I Frankenjuice my brains out, but that's not the same as what you just did.

Congratulations on your success!

 

[billherbst]

Actually I take that back. I don't feel anger at tobacco that looses it's groove. Not anger, disappointment. Like a father telling his son he's disappointed in him.. it's worse than anger.

I think of my bottle of BGB as the Mozart of NETs. Amazing, brilliant music, but dead before middle adulthood, leaving behind only fond memories of genius. LOL.

 

[BecknCO]

I keep sampling my BGB hoping it gives a little more boldness that what it has before. I accidentally ordered it as 70vg/30pg (I haven't even opened that one yet), and the 30vg/70pg one is what I am talking about ( I have a 30ml of each). It is a truly spot on tobacco taste, but I just wish there was a little more boldness to it. It seems from everyone experiences, this will only decline with age. That's a crying shame, but maybe my tastes will get better and intensify the flavor, or maybe I just need to try it in an RDA - I've only been using it in joye306 around 10 watts.

 

[billherbst]

I keep sampling my BGB hoping it gives a little more boldness that what it has before. I accidentally ordered it as 70vg/30pg (I haven't even opened that one yet), and the 30vg/70pg one is what I am talking about ( I have a 30ml of each). It is a truly spot on tobacco taste, but I just wish there was a little more boldness to it. It seems from everyone experiences, this will only decline with age. That's a crying shame, but maybe my tastes will get better and intensify the flavor, or maybe I just need to try it in an RDA - I've only been using it in joye306 around 10 watts.

Beck,

When I first got my bottle of BGB and the sample of Devil Dog that Mr.Mann sent me in late 2012, they were like two 800 lb. gorillas. Both were so bold that they just about knocked me on my can. If they'd been any bolder, I'd have ended up in the Emergency Room.

Puzzling to me that yours lacks boldness, but I experience that over and over reading posts on ECF. Other vapers' experiences are often so different from mine that I can only scratch my head in wonder.

 

[erawk]

This may go against conventional wisdom, so take it with a grain of salt...but for me, the higher pg juices lack mouthfeel and body. Without body its hard to pick up on bold robust notes. I get everything in 70/30 now cause I dislike most of my NET.com order that was all at 30/70 and I think a lot of it was my fault for getting that ratio.

So on days like today when it was -20 it can be slightly challenging to get things to flow. I end up pulsing on and off to warm the wick up before I get to vaping. It can be a pain but I've found I really don't like 30/70 in terms of flavor. Just my experience so take it FWIW.

 

[erawk]

or maybe I just need to try it in an RDA - I've only been using it in joye306 around 10 watts.

Quite honestly, I would've given up on the aros all together if I was still using disposable atties.

 

[BecknCO]

I guess it's time to hold off until I get those RBA's you helped me pick, and if worse comes to worse - I can try my 70vg/30pg bottle. It may not have been a mistake afterall!

 

[Mr.Mann]

Quite honestly, I would've given up on the aros all together if I was still using disposable atties.

And I would've given up on vaping altogether if it weren't for disposable attys. Man, we are all so very different!

 

[clnire]

I love little 510 bridgeless attys for tasting flavors. I don't use them for serious vaping but great for checking flavors without comitting a tank or real dripper

Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk

 

[bustabo]

Has anyone just recently received a bottle of analog from GeJ today or in the last few days??

I think I got a bad batch or bad bottle....

Has no flavor scent, no flavor, zero vapor, and smells and taste like alcohol....

I'm sure they will take care of it but I'm just wondering if I'm the only one

 

[y cherry y]

I think of my bottle of BGB as the Mozart of NETs. Amazing, brilliant music, but dead before middle adulthood, leaving behind only fond memories of genius. LOL.

I have a 10-month-old bottle that's just a tad less bright and bold as the new version. I think the trick might be to seal them tight when not dripping -- with the regular cap, not the dropper cap. The seals on those droppers isn't worth much.