New Indoor Bans - Please Help!

[WOW]

I disagree. If they make e-cigs criminal they simultaneously criminalize analogs.

After all the bs from BT, let them try to compete w/ e-cigs. I would never support their company again. I wouldn't trust them to make anything safe.

They're all going to shoot themselves in the foot trying to kill off segments of society by not pulling 4000 deadly chemicals soon enough to spare millions of people from too often, unaffordable health care - THEY knowingly caused by exploiting, especially children.

It all opens the door for society and the special interest groups(can't think of the name of it but similar MADD only w/ areas of gov directly backing it) that hate BT to take them out - permanently and pay for the health care and damages to their victims, including the cost of hearings etc, when there's a financial disaster the gov can't help other non-criminals through enough, including those who smoke or don't.

Believe in the good of humanity. This is still America and e-cigs are for over 18 adults only. w/o scientific proof, imho, it would be a greater public service for those trying to help BT to help kids at risk for illegal drug addiction and the violence that goes with that, instead of trying to push law abiding citizens trying to improve their health into that deadly part of society to stay off analogs or try to get off analogs. Sounds like scare tactics to me by a company (BT) that has profited from killing people.

Sickening!








Just a different spin on the topic.

That's what I'm thinking; looks like I'm heading towards being criminalized! lol

 

[OldDragon]

Don't know if this makes sense, but if cigs can make the air so bad if used within xx feet of a door, then why aren't autos banned from driving within the same distance of buildings? I mean, just think of this test - first you must spend one hour in a small room with a smoker and then another hour with your car running. Guess which one will really kill you.
Surly that wood stove or oil heating device in the room/basement should also be banned. And that smoking stove with hot grease that is being used to cook your hamburger must really be making the air foul. And those places that use the smell of cooking that draws you in from miles away must really be putting out dangers chems.

 

[Vocalek]

I disagree. If they make e-cigs criminal they simultaneously criminalize analogs.

After all the bs from BT, let them try to compete w/ e-cigs. I would never support their company again. I wouldn't trust them to make anything safe.

They're all going to shoot themselves in the foot trying to kill off segments of society by not pulling 4000 deadly chemicals soon enough to spare millions of people from too often, unaffordable health care - THEY knowingly caused by exploiting, especially children.

It all opens the door for society and the special interest groups(can't think of the name of it but similar MADD only w/ areas of gov directly backing it) that hate BT to take them out - permanently and pay for the health care and damages to their victims, including the cost of hearings etc, when there's a financial disaster the gov can't help other non-criminals through enough, including those who smoke or don't.

Believe in the good of humanity. This is still America and e-cigs are for over 18 adults only. w/o scientific proof, imho, it would be a greater public service for those trying to help BT to help kids at risk for illegal drug addiction and the violence that goes with that, instead of trying to push law abiding citizens trying to improve their health into that deadly part of society to stay off analogs or try to get off analogs. Sounds like scare tactics to me by a company (BT) that has profited from killing people.

Sickening!

Just a different spin on the topic.

I have been fighting against the enemy since March of 2009. So far, I have not had to refute one word coming from Big Tobacco. All of the lies have come from the organizations that have been harranging us to stop smoking since forever: FDA, WHO, ALA, ACS, AHA, CTFK, ASH, AMA, etc. etc. Coincidentally every single one of these organizations receives funding from Big Pharmaceutical companies that make/sell useless smoking-cessation treatments.

Evidence? In their own words: http://vaperscoalition.org/FPGD.pdf

Those 4,000 chemicals are not ADDED to cigarettes. They are created by the process of combustion through the chemical changes that occur when vegetation is burned.

If it ends up that BT is permitted to make and sell e-cigs, at least there will be a legal source for us to go to. The FDA has the responsibility to ensure that manufacturing standards are followed, that products are properly labeled, that packaging is safe, etc. They have this authority through the Tobacco Act.

 

[Mooler]

What kind of low life jerk would ban an ecig?

All I have to say to them is

 

[bliynd]

If it ends up that BT is permitted to make and sell e-cigs, at least there will be a legal source for us to go to. The FDA has the responsibility to ensure that manufacturing standards are followed, that products are properly labeled, that packaging is safe, etc. They have this authority through the Tobacco Act.

Actually, the would not have any authority through the Tobacco Act, are we forgetting e-cigs contain no tobacco... thats why the FDA is involved(nicotine) and not the ATF(tobacco)

actually if you think about it... it could be bad, because if they make e-cigs a FDA regulated product they will probably create a nicotine tax. That will add more taxes to analogs and creat a whole new tax market with e-cigs..... I wouldn't put it past NY.

 

[5cardstud]

They did that in WA. a couple yrs. ago. It's the non smokers way to get people to quit. That and they keep raising the tax every other day. It's too bad the do-gooders don't keep their nose out of everybody elses business. But thats a pipe dream.

 

[bliynd]

I haven't completely quit analogs yet, and I bought a pack of Marlboros here in NY yesterday and they were 10.75 a pack.... NY is using tobacco addictions to their advantage.

 

[kristin]

Actually, the would not have any authority through the Tobacco Act, are we forgetting e-cigs contain no tobacco... thats why the FDA is involved(nicotine) and not the ATF(tobacco)

actually if you think about it... it could be bad, because if they make e-cigs a FDA regulated product they will probably create a nicotine tax. That will add more taxes to analogs and creat a whole new tax market with e-cigs..... I wouldn't put it past NY.

The FDA was empowered to regulate tobacco products with the signing of the Family Smoking Prevention and Tobacco Control Act of 2009. Products containing nicotine are either a tobacco product or a pharmaceutical product in the U.S. and the FDA now has regulatory power over both.

 

[bliynd]

The FDA was empowered to regulate tobacco products with the signing of the Family Smoking Prevention and Tobacco Control Act of 2009. Products containing nicotine are either a tobacco product or a pharmaceutical product in the U.S. and the FDA now has regulatory power over both.

hehe I should probably do my homework before I speak, but it sounded good

 

[WOW]

What do you mean by "Y**"?

 

[t9c]

I see many of these posts & opinions to be very relative & possible. If this situation ever comes to Texas, you can bet your ... I will be the 1st in line to protest and I haven't protested anything since the Vietnam War!

BUT!
I think BT WILL in fact in the very near future be marketing some kind of e-cig and nic juice with flavors of some sort, starting with icky tobacco 1st. I would not be surprised if it happened within 1 year from now, or at least by the end of 2011. They will market home brews out of business by offering "tested" products and by restricting the distribution of nicotine. You have to remember that BT is world-wide. They are still a very powerful global industry & have lobbyists in many governments.

I'm sure they have even been here (ECF) and will continue to be. I would start buying all the nic juice you can afford, ASAP!

 

[WOW]

I have been fighting against the enemy since March of 2009. So far, I have not had to refute one word coming from Big Tobacco. All of the lies have come from the organizations that have been harranging us to stop smoking since forever: FDA, WHO, ALA, ACS, AHA, CTFK, ASH, AMA, etc. etc. Coincidentally every single one of these organizations receives funding from Big Pharmaceutical companies that make/sell useless smoking-cessation treatments.

Imho, Vocalek, if you(meaning the generic 'you' as in anyone) want to make a clear point the gov will consider and keep vaping, stay healthy/improve your health, you can't unilaterally diss ALL quit smoking products...not in this context.

Those who vape have had no success with other quit-smoking products, however, the reality is many work for many people. Like anything else, no one product works for everyone. If there was no demand (based on this fact) e-cigs would have no supply.

Science has proven smoking analogs is deadly as is second-hand smoke. That gives others the right to protest ANALOGS. It's irrational to protest e-cigs.


Evidence? In their own words: http://vaperscoalition.org/FPGD.pdf

Those 4,000 chemicals are not ADDED to cigarettes. They are created by the process of combustion through the chemical changes that occur when vegetation is burned.

I had no idea embalming fluid, rat poison, xyclone-X(used in WW11 gas chambers) and anti-freeze to name 1000x less chemicals than the 4000 in a suicide stick, are made by burning tobacco. It's amazing morticians and car mechanics have any life span, not to mention the people who work in tobacco fields!

My point is, this is all documented, in part, through 1800-NO-BUTTS, a gov sponsored quit smoking program - on paper. BT knows and has known as long as the Surgeon General's warning has been on a box of analogs, what they put in their products.

Take out e-cigs and bye-bye Big Tobacco. Which has done the most damage to people?

The problem is a lack of education about e-cigs amongst the majority of people who look at an e-cig not knowing they aren't at risk. THAT is what is being played on.


If it ends up that BT is permitted to make and sell e-cigs, at least there will be a legal source for us to go to. The FDA has the responsibility to ensure that manufacturing standards are followed, that products are properly labeled, that packaging is safe, etc. They have this authority through the Tobacco Act.

Are you worried about risks of e-cigs cause it sounds more like you are against them than for what is now a peaceful trade agreement w/ China.

Just to fill in the space requirement so this will post;

How often are you exposed to second hand smoke?
You should not be the one standing aside, hiding from second hand smoke, holding your breath ... or choking on the cigarette smoke! O ur mission is to eliminate cigarette smoking all together. We believe in clean air, fairness, and healthy living.
Here are a few facts about second hand smoking:
* Second-hand smoke is a combination of poisonous gases, liquids and breathable particles that are harmful to your health.
* A non-smoker breathing second-hand smoke can be exposed to 4,000 different chemicals, 50 of which are associated with or known to cause cancer.
* Second-hand smoke has twice as much nicotine and tar as the smoke that smokers inhale. It also has five times the carbon monoxide which decreases the amount of oxygen in your blood.
* Exposure to second-hand smoke for as little as 8 to 20 minutes can cause physical reactions linked to heart and stroke disease.


E-CIGARETTES DO NOT PRODUCE DANGEROUS SMOKE! IT'S VAPOR!



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Anyone who thinks every smoker will have an equal opportunity to quit or use e-cigs as a recreational product with as much nicotine or less than analogs and have it picked up by their health insurance is blatently mad.


For a $, this ludicrous display of confusion between what an e-cig is and what an analog is, if I were listening to this as a public official, I'd ban it just to get y'all to wake up and produce some education literature and prevent society from freaking out!


Fortunately, several celebrities are vaping and the word is getting out.



If it goes further(the arguing), the outcome is no one will vape, smoke, eat saturated fat, drink soda, bungie jump, be allowed to purchase a Toyota, etc., etc. and the gov will get all the proceeds and pay off the national debt while there are fewer jobs and less productivity by workers who have no leisure in their lives - they'll also throw over every alcohol company while their at it.



Or, they'll bring all the e-cig jobs back to the USA.



But, what you are talking about is not quality control - you're way too angry to make one clear point, again, imho. You're involvement seems to make you able to clarify one point at a time - if 'you' want to fight a ban, the gov isn't going to listen to anger, only facts, including the hardship financially a ban would have on citizens as well as educational deficits of those who never heard of e-cigs.



Gov Schwartzeneggar got it right.



He didn't waste one tax dollar and no one suffered for his decision. It's senseless harassment(but great advertising) to try to ban e-cigs or threaten their legality or cost. That kind of advertising will lower the costs.



It was Gov Schwartzeneggar's best political decision in the greenest state in the nation.


Arnold Schwarzenegger Vetoes E Cigarette Ban Bill In Californiaschwarzenegger-vetoes-cigarette-ban-bill-in-california.html

 

[WOW]

I see many of these posts & opinions to be very relative & possible. If this situation ever comes to Texas, you can bet your ... I will be the 1st in line to protest and I haven't protested anything since the Vietnam War!

BUT!
I think BT WILL in fact in the very near future be marketing some kind of e-cig and nic juice with flavors of some sort, starting with icky tobacco 1st. I would not be surprised if it happened within 1 year from now, or at least by the end of 2011. They will market home brews out of business by offering "tested" products and by restricting the distribution of nicotine. You have to remember that BT is world-wide. They are still a very powerful global industry & have lobbyists in many governments.

I'm sure they have even been here (ECF) and will continue to be. I would start buying all the nic juice you can afford, ASAP!

I wouldn't invest 1 penny in anything made by BT. They'll never stop making analogs and word-of-mouth will put them out of business if they only make e-cigs. So, so much damage by BT. I'd never trust them. I don't think many would.

Imho, they just can't handle the competition and are running scared trying to scare everyone else. That's another reason I wouldn't trust them. They want to sell stuff by scaring people. Reliable e-cig companies don't need to play like that. BT would still cut corners even if it meant harming people's health, imo.

Vaping is still a small dot on a big board of leisure products. BT can't handle losing customers unless they kill them.

Would anyone here still vape is these companies were run by BT? We all came here with reasons to quit.

 

[GtrSoloist]

It's akin to those who make their living selling Virus Protection Software; I doubt they wish and hope for the day those pesky virus creators stop their shenanigans! lol

Certainly Big Pharma has much at stake and a cozy relationship with the FDA; however, I wouldn’t discount Big Tobacco's lobbying influence. After all, they stand to lose a ton of money unless they can (successfully) produce and market an E Cigarette of their own!

Don't leave out the Government itself. Both State and Federal Governments are collecting Billions of dollars each year in tobacco taxation. The FDA is after-all a branch of the Government.

 

[GtrSoloist]

I haven't completely quit analogs yet, and I bought a pack of Marlboros here in NY yesterday and they were 10.75 a pack.... NY is using tobacco addictions to their advantage.

Every state is. I sold tobacco tax stamps for a small state. The amount of money changing hands is staggering.

A previous poster mentioned that it wouldn't be logical to criminalize users of PV's.

Prisons are a huge industry in this country. A lot of people make a living off of locking up and taking care of non-violent drug offenders... who not so coincidentally are taking cash out of BP's pockets buy not buying / using Prozac or the slew of other BP approved legal "happy," drugs.

 

[WOW]

Every state is. I sold tobacco tax stamps for a small state. The amount of money changing hands is staggering.

A previous poster mentioned that it wouldn't be logical to criminalize users of PV's.

Prisons are a huge industry in this country. A lot of people make a living off of locking up and taking care of non-violent drug offenders... who not so coincidentally are taking cash out of BP's pockets buy not buying / using Prozac or the slew of other BP approved legal "happy," drugs.

The previous poster, was ignorant to conclude there was a sincere request for support in certain States and quickly figured out this thread is merely to bash others by those who are against PV's.

You'd be surprised at who's not behind your agenda.

 

[mmcall12]

I live in IN also, an will do what I can to stop this along with a few of my friends

 

[sweet-c]

Bumpin it up!!!

 

[sherid]

I wouldn't invest 1 penny in anything made by BT. They'll never stop making analogs and word-of-mouth will put them out of business if they only make e-cigs. So, so much damage by BT. I'd never trust them. I don't think many would.

Imho, they just can't handle the competition and are running scared trying to scare everyone else. That's another reason I wouldn't trust them. They want to sell stuff by scaring people. Reliable e-cig companies don't need to play like that. BT would still cut corners even if it meant harming people's health, imo.

Vaping is still a small dot on a big board of leisure products. BT can't handle losing customers unless they kill them.

Would anyone here still vape is these companies were run by BT? We all came here with reasons to quit.

It was YOU who made the decision to smoke and to continue smoking. BT has been villified for decades, but despite that, you continued to smoke. BT did not cause the damage to smokers. Smokers caused the damage to themselves. BT continues to provide a product that 1.4 billion people in the world continue to want. If you were BT, would you suddenly stop selling cigarettes? Hundreds of millions of people have quit smoking. No one forced them to continue. BT is the most regulated business in the history of mankind. Would I buy an e cig from them? You bet your life I would. They have some of the most sophisticated scientific research centers in the world. They would do it right. Frankly, you sound more like an anti-smoker than a former smoker converted to e cigs. Are you?

 

[RollTheBones]

That and the fact that the way the law was written it forbids "...anything that can be inhaled or exhaled." It cannot withstand judicial review.

?

Jeez, now they want to punish people with asthma?!