Nicotine Comparisons

[Vapntime]

Nah, i used to go Hiliq, until the NTN unicorn nic incident, then i went to Liquid Barn...

But looking around again because variety should be the spice of life has made me rage against the freight all over again

I know its crazy isn't it. My last order was from wick and wire NZ. Cost me $40 AUS for, wait for it 100ml of NicSelect. We can't even order 100mg from Nicotine river who have all the nics now, they won't ship it, 48mg only with ridiculous shipping costs. Stick to Liquid Barn I think for now, however at the moment they are sold out of 500 and 1000ml!

 

[stylemessiah]

Meanwhile an update from VaperTek via email:

I am working on this problem with shipping. I don’t know what has happened with the site. I will let you know as soon as I have it fixed

So apparently the pricing being put down to a website error.....more news as it comes to hand

 

[stylemessiah]

I know its crazy isn't it. My last order was from wick and wire NZ. Cost me $40 AUS for, wait for it 100ml of NicSelect. We can't even order 100mg from Nicotine river who have all the nics now, they won't ship it, 48mg only with ridiculous shipping costs. Stick to Liquid Barn I think for now, however at the moment they are sold out of 500 and 1000ml!

I think you might have seen my post about Nic River recently (here: Reliable online source for PG/VG, also mentions my Nude Nic experience), they went an extra step to try and gouge...kept changing their story...onto the sh!tlist they went, so many vendors actively try and get on it....

LB is also out of as little as 250ml...im down to 20ml from my last order....so i have a little time left....

 

[mikepetro]

I ran a lot of co-ops in my time here. I agree that shipping Down Under is ridiculous. I can honestly say though, in my case anyway, the exorbitant fees are coming from the shipping companies as I didnt add a dime.

 

[Vapntime]

I hope LB are not having the same issues as NR with sourcing from NicSelect. Yea, NR never seemed to interested in helping out for O/S buyers. It was a definite no when i asked if they could ship through DHL. Google away my friend surely there is somewhere else. I will keep an eye out.

 

[Cool_Breeze]

I wonder if shipping companies have to deal with onerous import circumstances in Australia.

 

[stylemessiah]

I ran a lot of co-ops in my time here. I agree that shipping Down Under is ridiculous. I can honestly say though, in my case anyway, the exorbitant fees are coming from the shipping companies as I didnt add a dime.

Yeah, i fully acknowledge that most companies arent partaking in the gouging themselves (Nic River a definite exception as i have caught them at it recently) and are subject to the freight companies, but they can actively at least try and get better rates...we've seen it happen with a nic supplier ive already mentioned we've dealt with in the past, they, on behalf of their customers went after a better deal with freight carriers, and succeeded.

My next point is going to be, why arent nic suppliers figuring out that they need to chase better deals for their customers actively. If youre selling nic at a price you know is competitive, and yet you keep getting adandoned/dormant carts from people in a number of countries over and over again, it doesnt take a genius to figure out where the customer is baulking and fleeing your shop....

Not enough anymore to stick a product on a shelf (especially a virtual one) and hope it sells, the average customer now has an entire www to look for alternates, youre not a village shop with a captive audience who can afford to make such mistakes, and youre dealing with a niche market on top of that. Id be trying my hardest to get the best deal overall for my customers, but thats just me, because volume sells, not individual marked up orders....

 

[Vapntime]

I ran a lot of co-ops in my time here. I agree that shipping Down Under is ridiculous. I can honestly say though, in my case anyway, the exorbitant fees are coming from the shipping companies as I didnt add a dime.

I think the problem is getting the best price for the customer. I have imported from over 100 US e-juice makers over the years and nearly every shipping cost was different. The funny thing is after all that I decided I liked unflavored best...

Edit: Style beat me to it

 

[stylemessiah]

I wonder if shipping companies have to deal with onerous import circumstances in Australia.

I dont know that theyre onerous, ive certainly never had an issue getting *anything* into this country...and even nic, which is banned from sale here, but legal for importing for personal use (with restrictions) and disliked by the government has always come through without a hitch, never even been delayed at the point of entry...4 days from China to my door in Darlinghurst, Sydney....never opened for inspection, nada, rubbed stamped and delivered

 

[stylemessiah]

I think the problem is getting the best price for the customer. I have imported from over 100 US e-juice makers over the years and nearly every shipping cost was different. The funny thing is after all that I decided I liked unflavored best...

Exactly. I would happily put up with more variance in their product prices if the damn freight prices were even in the same ball park as each other....

And unflavoured yes, i hear you, 2+ years flavour free here

 

[Cynophobe]

Interesting to note that some US vendors can ship 1L of liquid at less than $30AUD. You just have to trawl endlessly around, go thru to check out and see what the numbers on freight are. Others are a gouge alright. I just checked. I paid $17.50USD for 1 L + 5 x 30 ml concentrates. If there's something too dear I'll use a freight forwarder from the US.

 

[stylemessiah]

Interesting to note that some US vendors can ship 1L of liquid at less than $30AUD. You just have to trawl endlessly around, go thru to check out and see what the numbers on freight are. Others are a gouge alright. I just checked. I paid $17.50USD for 1 L + 5 x 30 ml concentrates. If there's something too dear I'll use a freight forwarder from the US.

The problem with a freight forwarder, take for example shopmate, is that you have double shipping, one lot to your fake forwarding address (mines in Oregon of all places) and then again from the forwarder home to Oz, so by the time you use the forwarder you can end paying more than direct freight. Not to mention you cant always be certain that the rate the forwarder is going to charge you will be whats on their charges list because they only apply it when they get your shipment onsite, and they are famous for bumping up a charge bracket - plenty of people have thought they'd get x charge because they matched the weight and dimensions up on the forwarders charge sheet and when they got notified of the amount the forwarder was going to charge it was a whole bracket up, and then being told by the forwarder it would basically more expensive to return the item to the retailer, theyve given in and agreed to the charges. A friend of mine went through the horror of forwarding like this recently..most expensive vape purchase of her life. You need a full time job almost to figure it out...be easier if the freight companies just charged a fair rate.....

 

[Cool_Breeze]

I dont know that theyre onerous, ive certainly never had an issue getting *anything* into this country...and even nic, which is banned from sale here, but legal for importing for personal use (with restrictions) and disliked by the government has always come through without a hitch, never even been delayed at the point of entry...4 days from China to my door in Darlinghurst, Sydney....never opened for inspection, nada, rubbed stamped and delivered

While delays and such may not be incurred, are there fees, tariffs and other that the shipping companies may have to cover? ...or perhaps extra handling per contents and government outlook on the AZ end?

It seems you are asking for extra effort on the sellers part to save 'you' money and for the potential profits on your business. Perhaps sellers don't find that cost-worthy for themselves. Maybe forming a customer alliance and dealing with larger volume orders would be useful those in your circumstances.

 

[stylemessiah]

While delays and such may not be incurred, are there fees, tariffs and other that the shipping companies may have to cover? ...or perhaps extra handling per contents and government outlook on the AZ end?

It seems you are asking for extra effort on the sellers part to save 'you' money and for the potential profits on your business. Perhaps sellers don't find that cost-worthy for themselves. Maybe forming a customer alliance and dealing with larger volume orders would be useful those in your circumstances.

There are no tarrifs etc or hoops for them to jump through at the border, they only have to fill out the declaration same as for any other country in the world, not adding to their workload....

Nope im asking for the same deal everyone else gets, only not extorted because of my location, and im not onselling it, i dont have a business, im just a customer...

 

[stols001]

I don't know what the answer is, but I will say, it sounds as if some companies have just negotiated better rates than others.

I personally feel (to be fair I am a Nicotine River fan) that working with them in a more collaborative way and/or figuring out if there's a way to get bulk shipments is ultimately going to bear more fruit than warning folks away from them, although it most certainly may be true that Nic River's shipping is exorbitant to Aus by your description, but I also understand they are shipping a fair distance, with items that may well be difficult to ship for a variety of reasons.

I do think that if you are in Aus, sometimes looking for EU shippers or even Asian (not necessarily Chinese, but sure to include Chinese) is probably going to be the best bet for receiving items more quickly and with less shipping costs.

If it's any comfort, I do think that eventually the US is going to run into some of these issues (supply issues) which is why I stocked up on nic early and often. I can do flavorless fine, although I prefer DIY flavoring generally. Etc

Good luck with your dilemma.

Anna

 

[stylemessiah]

I don't know what the answer is, but I will say, it sounds as if some companies have just negotiated better rates than others.

I personally feel (to be fair I am a Nicotine River fan) that working with them in a more collaborative way and/or figuring out if there's a way to get bulk shipments is ultimately going to bear more fruit than warning folks away from them, although it most certainly may be true that Nic River's shipping is exorbitant to Aus by your description, but I also understand they are shipping a fair distance, with items that may well be difficult to ship for a variety of reasons.

I do think that if you are in Aus, sometimes looking for EU shippers or even Asian (not necessarily Chinese, but sure to include Chinese) is probably going to be the best bet for receiving items more quickly and with less shipping costs.

If it's any comfort, I do think that eventually the US is going to run into some of these issues (supply issues) which is why I stocked up on nic early and often. I can do flavorless fine, although I prefer DIY flavoring generally. Etc

Good luck with your dilemma.

Anna

With a chinese supplier the customers on our forum here asked for a better freight deal and they followed up and got it, so definitely not against collaboration, doing it now with Vaporstek, had a few emails since the one i referred to earlier, hopefully it will bear some fruit.

As for Nicotine River, theyre a lost cause to me because i caught them out trying to pad the freight (insisted i needed to use their mates forwarding company for nic, due to new "laws"), simple as that, they then backpedalled when i called them out and published their emails. Trust is something earned, not given, especially when youve been burned before by the USA freight conundrum (my first order of nic form MFS was yellow and stank when it got here, i could just see the order filler at MFS in my mind, "oh theyre in Australia, wheres that old nic we cant sell here"). Nicotine River and trust, sorry, thats done, theyre on the never buy from list.

Im glad that youve had no issues with them, truly, but i think it speaks to how some people think they can get away with something if the customer is a country or more away. Nude was just as bad or worse, told more lies than Pinochio...downside for idiots like that is for the very reason they try and exploit us, because we're far away, we also are pretty tight knit because the costs are generally high, so abuse one of us and its going to get out pretty quickly, so im reminded of the old saying "shoot yourself in the foot"...

If you in the USA ever had to pay what we do here, you'd take to the streets

Sourcing from the EU has gotten harder because of the bloody TPD they now only seem to sell weak TPD compliant "nic shots", and 100mg/ml is scarce

 

[Myk]

How about this for a comparison

Say you live in Australia, let the freight gouging begin...

I bought my last order from Liquid Barn (last order for a change and to try) but thought, from recommendations, i might try some from Vaperstek

But got a huge shock when it came to freight, really shouldnt have been shocked, just about every USA company gouges Aussies...

For 240ml/100mg these are Vaperstek charges at checkout:

Subtotal: $16.99
Postage + packaging: $61.57

Total: $78.56

$61 for shipping? We're used to getting gouged by overseas corporations because we happen to live in Australia, but..

Consider Liquid Barn, same liquid (actually more - 250ml):

Subtotal $ 23.49
Shipping $ 32.69 (DHL)

Total: $ 56.18

While their nic is slightly dearer, the freight is half what Vaperstek quote, even Fedex via them is cheaper than Vasperstek quote.

At the moment most Aussies order via Hiliq:

Same liquid (actually more - 250ml)

Subtotal: $19.68
Shipping: $15.99 (cheapest, ironically Fedex)
Even their most expensive freight (out of 3 options) is only $18.00 (DHL)
Total: $35.67

Delivered in 4 days, like clockwork..

Vaperstek quote is more than double...

Gouge much?

I did write Vaperstek an email....showing the above and perhaps explaining why they probably dont get a lot of orders from Australia...and asked if there was any way to get a better deal for us Aussies...

But your prices on stuff tend to be 3x higher anyway so you have a lot of room for shipping

Maybe with things getting better in NZ you'll have somewhere close. Or dare I say it, thing actually get better in AU?

I got a package from a YouTube friend from AU, shipping from AU to US wasn't cheap either. I think she spent something like $31 on shipping.

 

[stylemessiah]

But your prices on stuff tend to be 3x higher anyway so you have a lot of room for shipping

Maybe with things getting better in NZ you'll have somewhere close. Or dare I say it, thing actually get better in AU?

I got a package from a YouTube friend from AU, shipping from AU to US wasn't cheap either. I think she spent something like $31 on shipping.

Yup NZ has seen the light and embraced vaping and making it legal, and we can get nic from them, but its usually not up to quality we get from further afield, people only order it from NZ if they need it in a hurry, and you'd want to be in more of a hurry than 4 days, because like i may have said we can get it from Hiliq in 4 days and Hiliq is better quality....

We here in Oz are stuck with a government who decided based on ideology to only listen to a closed loop of people who they knew would agree with them (TGA for one - therapeutic goods administration - like your FDA - happy to sell champix which may make you suicidal, or patches they know dont work and contain questionable chems or aisles of "complimentary" medicines like vitamins and shonky weight loss products, but something that will actually work...liquid nic...no) and summed up by the health minister as blatantly as "not on my watch" - see here - we're stuck with a liberal government stuck in the 1940's - old white men, universal world issue. They almost never use the term vaping as using e-cigarette allows them to keep demonising both us and smokers, and keep mentioning "big tobacco" as often as they can, in spite of literally no one i know ever buying a vaping product from a big tobacco vendor....

Devolved into commentary, sorry

 

[Myk]

Yup NZ has seen the light and embraced vaping and making it legal, and we can get nic from them, but its usually not up to quality we get from further afield, people only order it from NZ if they need it in a hurry, and you'd want to be in more of a hurry than 4 days, because like i may have said we can get it from Hiliq in 4 days and Hiliq is better quality....

We here in Oz are stuck with a government who decided based on ideology to only listen to a closed loop of people who they knew would agree with them (TGA for one - therapeutic goods administration - like your FDA - happy to sell champix which may make you suicidal, or patches they know dont work and contain questionable chems or aisles of "complimentary" medicines like vitamins and shonky weight loss products, but something that will actually work...liquid nic...no) and summed up by the health minister as blatantly as "not on my watch" - see here - we're stuck with a liberal government stuck in the 1940's - old white men, universal world issue. They almost never use the term vaping as using e-cigarette allows them to keep demonising both us and smokers, and keep mentioning "big tobacco" as often as they can, in spite of literally no one i know ever buying a vaping product from a big tobacco vendor....

Devolved into commentary, sorry

I've had some dealings with Simple Simon.

 

[stylemessiah]

I've had some dealings with Simple Simon.

Havent we all