Nicotine Tolerance, hows does it differ in vaping and smoking.

[Smittenkittenz]

I kind of agree, but suppose it's dependant upon how one looks at it....I suppose alot are vaping but plan to eventually quit, where as some , maybe older individuals, don't really plan to stop and are just happy to not be smoking....myself, I love vaping and have absolutely no plans of stopping, plus I can see myself vaping for the next 20 years, so I see no reason to reduce my nic and worry about it. But if your perhaps 30 years old, it's hard to imagine that you might be vaping another 45 more years, so you might implicate a plan. If liquid nic becomes outlawed , I will simply quit all together, as I feel it won't be all that much harder to stop, even at 24mg , 2mls per day. I say this because I don't think I will suffer that much, as I have stopped for a whole 3 days a couple times and it didn't bother me.

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I'm 35 and have been smoking off and on for 15 years. In the last 3 I've been at my heaviest, sometimes a pack a day if I was partying, less so if not. I quit cigs over a month ago and I absolutely love vaping, and it's become not only an extremely satisfying experience (I love the flavors, need the hand to mouth action on a consistent basis) but also its become a bit of a side hobby trying new devices and juices etc. It's still cheaper than cigs by far too. But I'm commenting as I was chatting with my gal pal who introduced me to juul this summer and that lead me to where I am now - a very grateful non smoker. She said something about feeling guilty about vaping so much, and I was initially incredulous, as I'm so freaking happy about the change. Everything I've ever read is ambiguous as far as actual long term detriment and the scientific research we currently have....plus the thought of not vaping anymore makes me incredibly depressed, to say the least. When my friend and I had that conversation, I thought about it later and realized I hadn't even considered an end date...ever. I don't do crazy high nic, between 3-6mg and mix them too, so I can't imagine a situation where this wouldn't be sustainable? And with tech being what it is, I'd assume the industry will only find more sophisticated ways to improve both the experience and the potential health issues...if there really are any to be seriously concerned with. Just thought I'd chime in

Oh and as for the dosing, I did 1.8mg juices and they didn't provide much satisfaction as far as throat hit and the feeling of wellbeing..so...not sure if I'd get to a point where I want less? Or maybe I'm just too much of a novice to know yet!

Vanessa

 

[vapdivrr]

I'm 35 and have been smoking off and on for 15 years. In the last 3 I've been at my heaviest, sometimes a pack a day if I was partying, less so if not. I quit cigs over a month ago and I absolutely love vaping, and it's become not only an extremely satisfying experience (I love the flavors, need the hand to mouth action on a consistent basis) but also its become a bit of a side hobby trying new devices and juices etc. It's still cheaper than cigs by far too. But I'm commenting as I was chatting with my gal pal who introduced me to juul this summer and that lead me to where I am now - a very grateful non smoker. She said something about feeling guilty about vaping so much, and I was initially incredulous, as I'm so freaking happy about the change. Everything I've ever read is ambiguous as far as actual long term detriment and the scientific research we currently have....plus the thought of not vaping anymore makes me incredibly depressed, to say the least. When my friend and I had that conversation, I thought about it later and realized I hadn't even considered an end date...ever. I don't do crazy high nic, between 3-6mg and mix them too, so I can't imagine a situation where this wouldn't be sustainable? And with tech being what it is, I'd assume the industry will only find more sophisticated ways to improve both the experience and the potential health issues...if there really are any to be seriously concerned with. Just thought I'd chime in

Oh and as for the dosing, I did 1.8mg juices and they didn't provide much satisfaction as far as throat hit and the feeling of wellbeing..so...not sure if I'd get to a point where I want less? Or maybe I'm just too much of a novice to know yet!

Vanessa

I certainly hope your right and vaping flourishes, but it certainly can go the other way if big tobacco has a say about it. I just can't see myself vaping a juul for the rest of my life and vaping their basic tobacco juices.

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[untar]

Everything I've ever read is ambiguous as far as actual long term detriment

That "there's no long term studies" narrative that you hear all the time is a red herring. Nothing that goes onto the market has any long term studies. Do you think medicine/drugs would have a 30-40 year study before they can be sold? No, they get a risk assessment and some short trials. Shorter than vaping exists.
For vaping there's risk assessments and the biggest "human experiment" as trial there ever was for anything, that should be plenty.

There's also no long term studies for bananas - does their specific chemical makeup promote cancer or alzheimer's? Nobody knows because no long term studies are done. We're in grave danger, take them all off the market now. Think of the children!

 

[Vapntime]

Compare nicotine to caffeine.

Its amazing how many people still think nicotine is the worst thing in eliquid! Do some research! You vape this stuff!

Caffeine is actually related to nicotine as an ine drug (stimulant family group) and is an excellent example as comparison.

Most drugs are abused for the same euphoric effect they produce at first not because they are addictive. A much smaller amount will keep the dependence satisfied.

Lets see how many can misinterpret this:
Understanding Tolerance, Dependence, and Addiction - DrugAbuse.com

 

[Jebbn]

I was a smoker for 42yrs. In the final 3yrs I smoked 10-12 cigs a day down from about 20 a day for most of my life. I leveled out at about 20 a day and that remained constant for about 38yrs and then I dropped down to half that amount. It wasnt really hard but did require monitoring, two on the way to work, then one every 2hrs and then 2 between 9 and 10pm.
With vaping I started out at 18mg @ about 6-8ml a day and now 12months later vape between 2mg and 8mg @ about 3-4ml a day.
What I do do is vape nic free regularly and that resets my tolerance, after two days without nic 3mg is quite a decent hit, after about 2 days in of vaping 3mg it just kinda becomes the new normal and a 6mg hit seems quite strong.
What used to surprise me when going nic free and for up to 5 days was how easy it was. Maybe feel a little flat, a little less satisfied with the vape but other than that it isnt much of a problem.
I am unable to vape 5hrs of the day and honestly dont feel anything about it. When I smoked cigarettes going 5hrs without tobacco was pretty traumatic for me and everyone around me, 5 days would be a daunting prospect!
At best all I can say is I dont "feel" like nicotine is as addictive as I was told. For me, without tobacco nicotine seems to be pretty weak as far as addictiveness.
I like nicotine in much the same way I like caffeine, I liked smoking tobacco as much as I liked breathing, I loved tobacco.

Im sorry about the word salad.

 

[United States]

I can smoke all day and feel normal.

Puffing on a vape same as a cigarette causes me to get drowsy. I suppose that's the tolerance thing?

Sometimes while on a long commute on a non busy highway I'll vape instead of smoking and my eyes look like John Travolta in that scene in Pulp Fiction where he's driving to go pick up the girl.

During my first week or two of vaping I stayed jacked up. Now it relaxes me to the point of drowsy. Smoking does not.
(3ml at 13.5 watts)

 

[Vapntime]

Sometimes while on a long commute on a non busy highway I'll vape instead of smoking and my eyes look like John Travolta in that scene in Pulp Fiction where he's driving to go pick up the girl.

I love that scene lol

 

[United States]

I love that scene lol

As surf music plays in the background....

 

[Rossum]

I can smoke all day and feel normal.

Puffing on a vape same as a cigarette causes me to get drowsy. I suppose that's the tolerance thing?

Sometimes while on a long commute on a non busy highway I'll vape instead of smoking and my eyes look like John Travolta in that scene in Pulp Fiction where he's driving to go pick up the girl.

During my first week or two of vaping I stayed jacked up. Now it relaxes me to the point of drowsy. Smoking does not.
(3ml at 13.5 watts)

Funny because I'm the opposite. I've been far less likely to get drowsy during a long (7-9 hour) drive, or to feel like taking a nap in the afternoon on a weekend since I switched from smoking to vaping almost 5 years ago. Now take away my vape for an hour or two and I'll get drowsy. I'm taking a two hour flight shortly, meaning I won't be able to vape for 3+ hours and I'll be half asleep by the time the plane takes off. Some nic gum will fix that though.

 

[zoiDman]

even still, it doesnt make sense. Every addictive drug I know will make you want and need more and more of it as time goes on using it. which in cigarettes case that exact thing happens. In vaping it doesn't. If nicotine is a drug and especially if it's an addictive one it doesnt make sense to me. I know theres more addictive chemicals in cigarettes than vaping but the fact that theres still one of them in vaping should still result in wanting more and more over time instead of the opposite, even if to not as great of an extent.

When people start to use the word "Addiction", a good thing to do is Stop them before they go to far.

And then Ask them are they referring to a Physical Addiction? A Mental Addiction? Or some Combination of Both?

It is Also a Good Idea to reach some agreement as to Exactly what the word "Addiction" means to both people.

Because the meaning I may be applying to the word "Addiction" may be Different that what the other person defines "Addiction" as. And if Two people are using the Same Word but each has a different level of Interpretation for it, then you might not be having a meaning conversation.

Even though Both Sides may think they are.

 

[DaveP]

Additives in cigarette tobacco boost the addictive properties.

Pharmacological and Chemical Effects of Cigarette Additives

Reconstituted tobacco, referred to as “sheet,” is a major ingredient in modern cigarettes; sheet is manufactured from recycled stems, stalks, scraps, collected dust, and floor sweepings.7 Those materials are ground up, nicotine is extracted from them, and chemicals, fillers, glue, and other agents are added to the slurry. The sheet is then pressed out and puffed, with the previously extracted nicotine sprayed onto it, and ground into tiny curls before being incorporated into cigarettes at the desired level.7 Tobacco companies have studied nicotine extracts as a method to augment nicotine levels in cigarettes.8–14

In addition, tobacco companies have devoted a significant amount of research and development to the use and inclusion of additives in cigarettes, and the industry has acknowledged using 599 different cigarette additives.15,16 According to various tobacco company documents, many of these additives are used to improve taste and decrease harshness.17 We propose that, in contrast, tobacco companies have expended resources to exploit the pharmacological and chemical effects of cigarette additives.

The tobacco industry used few additives in US cigarettes before 1970.18 However, current US-style cigarettes generally contain about a 10% level of additives according to weight, mostly in the form of sugars, humectants, ammonia compounds, cocoa, and licorice.19,20 Most other additives are used in small amounts, less than 0.01% of total weight. There is evidence that the percentage of additives by weight may have increased in the 1990s, especially the use of sweeteners (which many researchers believe were added to entice younger people to smoke).18 Those increases roughly coincided with the controversial Joe Camel cigarette advertising campaign initiated by RJ Reynolds in 1985.

 

[Letitia]

I know the experts say there is a difference between addiction and dependency and to a point I agree. For myself I consider myself a nic addict due to the fact I'm dependent on it in my day to day life. I still will not leave the house without a mod in hand, even just to take Em out. Was the same way with smokes. I figure I'm as addicted to the habit as I am to the nic itself.

 

[United States]

For this dual user addiction comes in two forms. Mental/psycological and physical.

The physical part can be whipped in a few days with what would likely be occasional urges for a cigarette for various reasons that are likely tied to the mental/psycological addiction.

Say for instance in my case, the habit of lighting up before brushing my teeth. It's a mental thing 'learned' over time and unconsciously developed into a habit.

Now say I'm nearing time to brush my teeth and a tree falls on my house after I've whipped the physical addiction. I say whipped as in a decision was made not to supply my body with nicotine anymore because I know one cigarette will re-hatch the monster. The physical addiction will always remain. But the psycological addiction disguised as a habit to light up could be re-ignited in an event where my guard was down and an old habit was instantly duplicated. All of that presumes I have a source of nicotine easily available.

My eventual goal is to be free of cigarettes first and nicotine later as me personally... I'm hooked on both. Part physically and part psycologically.

For me, vaping is not really an alternative to smoking because of the nicotine. I am a realist and know that without nicotine in my juice that cigarettes will always win. But my goal with vaping is to replace habits born from 40 years of smoking. Habits like putting on my left shoe first. Or lighting a cigarette after being in an office for a few hours. Little by little I am replacing my favorite cigarettes. After meals, with coffee... stuff like that. I know myself well enough to know that if vaping 50ml juice and smoking cigarettes with zero nicotine I'll still smoke. That is the psycological part. So while I replace times I typically smoke with vapes I keep the nic low.

When the cigarette habit is gone I'll do like my former smoking coworkers and up the nic to a point where one puff every 10 minutes or so will feed the monster. Then I can begin to cut back with a goal of zero in mind.

In the meantime, yes I can tell a difference between nicotine delivered by a cigarette over one by my vape device. Same with drinking wine over scotch. Same affect in general but a slightly different 'mental affect'. When driving the vape squashes the urge to smoke. I suppose as time passes the urge will be satisfied by a vape without smoking at all. Until then I'll continue to remove habits and either drop them (like lighting up before brushing my teeth) or swap them (like vaping with coffee instead of a cigarette).

 

[Letitia]

When my dad was dying I was shocked at how badly I wanted to smoke, even upping my nic didn't help. Took weeks for the want eased up.

 

[stormjib]

I smoked for 40+ years and have vaped for a little over 4. I like nicotine in my ejuice; went the same route as others, from 24 mg to 3, but found that I was constantly vaping, between 15 and 30 mls a day, so I upped my nic to around 6 at first and that helped me vape much less....then I discovered salt nics. Now I happily subohm 30 mg, despite reading over and over that it's not 'proper'. I usually vape about 2 mls of the 30 mg and maybe 5 of the 3 mg...works for me. I don't like the taste of freebase nic, above about 6.
Not all addictive substances lead you to crave more and more, many are 'self-limiting', that is to say, you find the level of intake that satisfies your desire. Many many people have a glass or two of wine very often and don't increase their intake...your premise is flawed.

 

[Jebbn]

I smoked for 40+ years and have vaped for a little over 4. I like nicotine in my ejuice; went the same route as others, from 24 mg to 3, but found that I was constantly vaping, between 15 and 30 mls a day, so I upped my nic to around 6 at first and that helped me vape much less....then I discovered salt nics. Now I happily subohm 30 mg, despite reading over and over that it's not 'proper'. I usually vape about 2 mls of the 30 mg and maybe 5 of the 3 mg...works for me. I don't like the taste of freebase nic, above about 6.
Not all addictive substances lead you to crave more and more, many are 'self-limiting', that is to say, you find the level of intake that satisfies your desire. Many many people have a glass or two of wine very often and don't increase their intake...your premise is flawed.

who's premise?

 

[DaveP]

I started at 24mg and was able to lay down most of my smokes the first week. In less than a year I was smoke free, but probably could have quit the smokes in the first month. I just didn't believe that at the time.

I don't worry about the nicotine. When I started downward in nic level I went from 24mg to 3mg in three months by buying lower nic juices from vendors as I reordered. At no time did I feel the urge to go back up in nic. I tried zero nic, but it was boring, so I went back to 3mg and stayed there. I missed the bite from the nic at 0mg. 3mg was enough to satisfy that.

When I smoked Marlboro Reds it was a hassle to switch to lights. I went down to ultralights, but my pack a day habit turned into a 3 PAD habit quickly. Even smoking lights I smoked 2 PAD. I was probably better off smoking a pack of Marlboro Reds instead.

It's a good thing that vaping came along and settled the issue!

 

[stormjib]

who's premise?

The OP's

 

[vapdivrr]

Oh yes it's the first thing people mention when I tell them about vaping, "isn't there still nicotine in those?" Forget all those carcinogens but nic is what they think of...even vapors, like you said, they smoke cigs for 40 years and now immediately think of reducing. Personally imo, I would venture to say that inhaling the larger amounts of the other chemicals in eliquid, are probably more dangerous then the actual nic. Then you have the difference of, what's really better, vaping high amounts of juice with low amounts of nic, or visa versa? i dont really know, but imo vaping 10, 20 or more mls of juice a day seems worse then vaping 5 or less with higher nic amounts. but nic is the addictive substance, so I can understand why people think this.

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[Jebbn]

The OP's

I dont know, there stuff in it thats in line with my own experience and stuff that I is contrary to my own experience.
As I read through this thread not many of us line up 100% in our own personal experience or relationship with tobacco or nicotine so Im happy to go with the OP is writing from his own life experience and let him go with it.
For me, tobacco/cigarettes were addictive, nicotine in vaping isnt addictive but I like nicotine in the evening