Official DNA 40 introduction

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HolmanGT

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Forgot to say the resistance is .22 (11 wrap).... after initial breakin, watts went down as vaping (under 15) so I'm just happy its a good vape.

Yes its my same Achilles dripper tank; just a dripper with 2 deep drip wells, and air under the single coil. One of my favorites for flavor.


ukeman,

I am sure glad you finally are getting a good vape :toast:. My Vapor Flask will be here Monday and reading several of your last posts "weak vapor" I was starting to have buyers remorse. I would normally put a smiley here but believe me I was not finding anything humorous about your problems... Just a lot of concern about buy a pig in a poke.
 

ukeman

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WTQ... I was never unhappy with my coil... just learning about it.
I did like the 2mm ID coil. Actually this second one may be closer to 3mm, and the vape is denser and more enjoyable, but the first was pretty good at higher temps.

This thicker one is doing gobs of vapor and at less heat and watts.

I've got a LOT to try out with the DNA. i.e. dual coils RDA's.
 

suspectK

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Ok..it seems like everything I deal with is self aware.. Video worked when I checked earlier, so hopefully I don't have to spend time and money(basically) getting anything fixed to do this..

I'm going a step further this time. Different wattages+ Airflow... I have an idea for cooling the coils and pulling excess vapor up, so IR image is more detailed on what is happening.

Just wanted to keep everyone posted. 3rd times always a charm..;)
 

rurwin

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350ZMO

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I am envisioning more frequent coil changes personally. I guess it just seems in my mind like the nature of the beast with nickel. I re-wicked my kayfun today after 3 1/2 days and the coil looked fine though, so who knows? Time will tell I suppose.

I am finding just the opposite but I run at 410.
 

350ZMO

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I can imagine the concern if you are not versed in rebuilding and all that comes with it... that said I am stoked they put this out now.

A question i have is what do we do with gunked or semi gunked coils that we used to dry burn?
I am vaping on the first coil I made and have now rewicked it after 2 or 3 days....2 or 3 batt changes (dual batt Flask) and a good 20 ml of juice.

Like a lot of sub ohms vapers I go through a lot of low nic juice a day, with a bunch of different devices. It feels like the dna40 keeps the gunking down to a minimum but there's a point where coil needs cleaning or changing.

I think we found out that dry burning metal coils regardless of the materiel is a bad idea so that pretty much means replace even on nichrome and kanthal. I guess we could try an ultrasound jewelry cleaner with everclear but I think its much easier and cheaper just to replace it. If you don't buy in to the dry burn being bad, you can always throw it on a mech.
 

350ZMO

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Can you compare it to inhalable drugs? I mean, when you use an Asthma inhaler you take one or two puffs. When vaping, you do way more. And what sort of e-cigarettes were tested? Cigalikes? Egos? Dual coil clearomizers? Rebuildables?

Just playing the devil's advocate here.

The ones tested are in the whitepaper SeniorBoy provided the link to.
 

350ZMO

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I just up the ID of my coil to 2.5mm lots of cotton and i drop down to 450 because it seems 500 was too much for a thicker coil...

Not only that but the wattage produced during firing is much more than with the smaller ID. Goes through the juice faster too (but the vapor is more dense).

the dynamics of this thing is intriguing.

The larger the surface area of heating element in contact with liquid, the more work can be done ie wattage ie vapor. Too long of a coil wrt diameter and the wick gets dry in the middle. If you can. try a 3mm diameter coil and a 4mm diameter coil that is the same length (turns can vary) as the 2.5mm.
 

SeniorBoy

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My DNA 40 will NOT, I repeat, will NOT switch OUT of temp mode when using kanthal. I built a kanthal coil for fun today and it is reading it like nickel? Anybody else having this issue? It displays temp and not volts with kanthal.

Never happened to me. Turn TC OFF and that should fix it. Apparently that's what turning TC off is designed to fix.

EDIT: I just tested this again for you with a Kanthal build on my KF using the xpv 40.

Step 1: Install Kanthal coiled topper and then watch the screen. Next, fire it a few times until you see V and before you draw. That's should do it.

Step 2: If step 1 does not work which has never happened to me then deploy the procedure I posted above.

Also, if you switch from a Kanthal coiled topper back to a Ni200 coiled topper, a couple of fires before you vape and the DNA40 will then display Temp. Seems reasonable to me.

:)
 
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DejayRezme

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    My DNA 40 will NOT, I repeat, will NOT switch OUT of temp mode when using kanthal. I built a kanthal coil for fun today and it is reading it like nickel? Anybody else having this issue? It displays temp and not volts with kanthal.

    What is the resistance of your kanthal build? Did the chip not "recognize" your new build maybe? Did you try removing the atty, press fire to get the "check atomizer" and then putting it back on? Normally that prompts a "is this new coil".

    As I've said before I'm curious too how the DNA40 detects nickel wire in the first case.
     

    350ZMO

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    He said as long as all wraps are touching it's no problem as each wrap shorts itself out or something like that. Maybe I am the worst to even talk to him as you know I am an idiot with technical stuff. One thing is for sure, he uses contact coils as well and loves it and that is all that matters to me as spaced coils are something I was never good with lol.

    Edit: Also, if you watch phils video on the squape he uses as well contact coils and it worked flawless and beyond.

    I know from the loose center post I had and watching the display that the 40 is constantly reading the resistance. So to me, if one coil shorts to the one beside it even for an instant then no problem, the 40 reads the lower overall coil resistance and adjusts as necessary but will not allow the temperature to exceed the setting in TP mode. Note one coil shorting to one beside it does not result in a hot spot at that loop in the coil, it effectively nullifies that loop from heating/producing vapor and lowers the overall resistance of the coil. Then as the coil heats up in the next instant, that short may disappear and the 40 constantly reading resistance will sort that out too. Then over time as the coil gets use on it, it may stop shorting all together. In fact now that I think about it, the only time I worried about hot spots was on a genny with a SS wick...maybe time to try that with Ni200, hmm...
     

    350ZMO

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    There's a bit before that that says that the times that the temperature limit is hit are those times there is minimal airflow. When the user hesitates in mid-draw and at the beginning and end of the draw.

    So during normal use you are not getting to the temperature limit unless the airflow or wicking is sub-optimal, no matter what the temperature limit is (above 390F). Setting maximum watts will mean the vape is largely uncontrolled.

    I would love to see the patent that John refers to. Unfortunately it hasn't made it to USPTO.gov or Google Patents yet.

    It seems to me that the picture is still not complete. After all, if we never reach any temperature over 390F, then the temperature setting cannot affect the taste. I can only think that we rely on the sub-optimal wicks, the hesitations and end-effects to push the atomiser into a controlled dry-burn in order to modulate the taste. The DNA40 controls this process so we can tune the effect to taste without the danger of going too far and getting those 1200F coils which Evolv observed and which may release nasty products.

    So, contrary to what we have been saying all along, watts and temperature are indeed two different variables, because they operate at different times. Watts controls the vape while the wick is efficient and airflow is adequate, and temperature controls it when those fail. Contrary to our expectations, that is not a rare failure case, but a constant and required part of every draw.

    For me I have been using the term temperature control (TC) which is not correct. It is temperature protected (TP). I need to remove TC from my vocabulary.
     

    Oliver

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    Thank you "Cult Leader" aka Smokey aka Oliver

    :) / kinda joking with you

    An outstanding read and I strongly and respectfully suggest everyone on planet earth read and absorb.

    BTW, here is the direct link to the Goniewicz research paper which Brandon referred to in one of his Beta team posts:

    http://www.weprovideit.com/vaping/Goniewicz-tobaccocontrol-2013.pdf

    And here is Dr. Michael Siegel's article on this study at: http://tobaccoanalysis.blogspot.com/2013/03/new-study-of-electronic-cigarette-vapor.html

    HTH

    :)

    Haha, I take it you're referring to this: Opponents of e-cigarettes bombarded with abusive 'four-letter emails starting with C and F' in bitter row with online cult groups | Daily Mail Online
     

    DejayRezme

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    I know from the loose center post I had and watching the display that the 40 is constantly reading the resistance. So to me, if one coil shorts to the one beside it even for an instant then no problem, the 40 reads the lower overall coil resistance and adjusts as necessary but will not allow the temperature to exceed the setting in TP mode.

    They might adjust for that but it wouldn't be trivial. The chip needs to know the "base resistance at room temperature" to do temperature protection. It reads the resistance continuously but if there are any strange "jumps" in resistance the chip could get confused. If you have a "short" between coils it would be a pretty small contact area, so this short would heat up faster with current and increase resistance, which should lead to more current flowing the long way in the coil again. So I'm only theorizing here and I might very will be wrong, but that could lead to a different type of temperature to resistance curve and might throw the temperature control off. Again I'm just curious about this, do what works :)
     
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