PLEASE stop recommending RBAs and RDAs to beginners in the Newbie Forum

[yzer]

If most beginners come here looking to quit smoking by using e-cigarettes I agree completely with the OP.

We at ECF should recommend what gives a noob the best chance at winning quickly. That means something that provides a satisfiying amount of vapor and is very easy to use. That includes the power device as well as the atomizing device.

Let's face it. Most smokers are not exactly Einsteins. I sure wasn't. I smoked didn't I? Most habitual smokers are middle class or lower middle working class and want an inexpensive solution. They also deserve the safest possible solution for inexperienced users. They won't be reading instructions before use.

The best recommendation for noobs at this beginners forum:

-A small and relatively powerful eGo device or a simple 3.7V regulated single voltage battery mod with refillable cartos and bottled juice. Let them upgrade later if they want to. They have already decided that there is more to e-cigarettes than cig-alikes by visiting this forum.

 

[vaperature]

Amen brother. I don't know if I'll ever get to that point. I think you'd really have to be into rebuilding things to enjoy that. I'm not knocking those who love it but I just can't see me spending hours to rewick a PV. It took me about an hour last night just to rebuild a lousy evod head (good thing is I actually did it and it vapes great, lol).

 

[suspectK]

I'm surprised to hear this coming from a Californian.

 

[Caridwen]

Billy, a customer comes in who is 2-3 pack smoker what you going to sell him?

Probably 80%- 90% of us that have been vaping 3-4 years started with and quit smoking with a mini or an ego type battery and a box of cartos.

I smoked 25+ years and smoked 2 packs a day and that's how I quit.

 

[440BB]

When it comes the the New Members area the OP is speaking of, RBA suggestions should just be off limits. Let them, new vaper or experienced, get their five posts in and go to the appropriate area for more advanced, hobbyist vaping issues.

Let them learn to ride a bike and enjoy it a little before telling them they should be lacing their own wheels to get the best ride.

 

[rob33]

At the very least, a couple Vision spinners and a carto tank, or ProTank 2, or Evod, or iClear, or if they really want an Ego setup, one of the better quality starter kits, with a few words about backups and needing more than one battery. Worked perfectly well for me, and I was a 2-pack a day smoker. It's the 24mg juice that made a difference, I quit smoking just fine without an RDA.

I smoked for 40 yrs 2-3 pack a day until RDAs came around I was just one step away everyday going back to analogs. Mostly cause or the inefficent carts and atomizers. For a serious smoker you are setting him up for failure putting him in a ego with protank. Yea the B&M loves him cause until he figures out he has not got what he needs he has spent couple hundred bucks if not gone back to analogs. Rebuilding is not rocket science, my grandma can watch a rip tripper video and build a kayfun.

 

[beckdg]

As a relative beginner myself, I would like to add that if my first research into vaping had directed me in that direction I would still be smoking. Not only is that stuff confusing & intimidating, there are actually some of us that just aren't interested! If I had been given the impression that I needed to understand ohms law (?) in order to make the switch, I would have stopped right there.

perfect example of why we should err on the side of caution until the user displays some related understanding and/or a will towards the more technical aspects. you should be given advice based on your degree willingness to make a hobby out of your choice for quitting.

for you, i'd personally suggest cartos, an ibtanked and maybe an mvp 2. simple, satisfying, effective.

for me, i'd be frustrated and at my whits end if those where the suggestions given to me. i had a working knowledge of electronics and batteries far before i decided to try e-cigs.

That's my point - if someone has been posting for a while, shows they know the basics, have left the newbie forum and started digging into the others, and show/have a willingness to listen and read up on what they're doing, great - some of us have a better grasp of tools and making stuff, so it's not hard. Others, however, many of whom don't know even what an ohm is, it's a disaster waiting to happen - and being dissatisfied with the product, because they can't get it to work right.

Okay, it's analogy time. Suppose someone posts "Hey, I'd like to learn how to ride a motorcycle!". Not knowing anything about them, would you:

A. Recommend a motorcycling school, and a smaller cc bike to learn with

or

B. a 1300cc Harley custom with all the options, delivered to their door with no safety or handling instructions?


On top of that - if you are going to recommend an RBA or RDA to someone with no experience with ecig technology at all, have the decency and curtesy and common sense to link them to the blog posts and articles explaining what they are, how they work, how to use them, and how much they cost.

if the bolded were prerequisites for me to get the advice i seeked, i would no longer be a member of this forum after no more than 5 posts.

my first post here... http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/new-members-forum/475668-2-4-packs-per-day.html#post10867279

my first e-cig related purchase...

first time equipment owner. just ordered...

vivi nova 510 threaded
kanger pro tank
extra coil heads
igo-l
vamo v3
(4) sony 18650 @ 2100mah ea.
nitecore charger
silica wick
nichrome wire
10 pack 10 mil refiller bottles


mount baker;
caramel candy
cinamon roll
strawberry shortcake
moo juice
freckled lemonade
spurberry
... all in varying pg/vg blends from 18mg/ml to 36... some with "extra shots" where suggested by reviewers

finally taking the plunge correctly (i hope). i'm excited! can't wait for massive vapes.

 

[BillyWJ]

perfect example of why we should err on the side of caution until the user displays some related understanding and/or a will towards the more technical aspects. you should be given advice based on your degree willingness to make a hobby out of your choice for quitting.

for you, i'd personally suggest cartos, an ibtanked and maybe an mvp 2. simple, satisfying, effective.

for me, i'd be frustrated and at my whits end if those where the suggestions given to me. i had a working knowledge of electronics and batteries far before i decided to try e-cigs.



if the bolded were prerequisites for me to get the advice i seeked, i would no longer be a member of this forum after no more than 5 posts.

my first post here... http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/new-members-forum/475668-2-4-packs-per-day.html#post10867279

my first e-cig related purchase...

So, your comfort level, experience, knowledge and such are exactly the same for everyone? Is that your point?

 

[FearTX]

I think it comes to the beginner as to if they should start rebuilding at the very beginning. I work with power and ohm's law all day everyday. I was ready from day 1. My son used and still uses cigalikes and has for 2 years, he is still not ready. I did try and start out on what he was using.
As for more reports of ego batts blowing up than sub ohmers. You are probably correct on that, a new or "less informed" user may have had this happen and run screaming ERMAGERD IT BLEW UP. Whereas most sub ohm builders are show boaters and are more likely to say the bandages on their face are from skateboarding and "oh yeah, hey bro look at my brand-new mod, I gave the other away to a bro" to keep from embarrassing themselves.

Just saying.

But yeah depending on the newbie vaper as to weather to suggest rebuilables first, but how are you going to know that on a forum? The ego kits work, there are numerous work arounds to get performance out of the ones that do not. By that point they will either be comfortable with what they are using or ready to step up.

 

[BillyWJ]

I smoked for 40 yrs 2-3 pack a day until RDAs came around I was just one step away everyday going back to analogs. Mostly cause or the inefficent carts and atomizers. For a serious smoker you are setting him up for failure putting him in a ego with protank. Yea the B&M loves him cause until he figures out he has not got what he needs he has spent couple hundred bucks if not gone back to analogs. Rebuilding is not rocket science, my grandma can watch a rip tripper video and build a kayfun.

Your needs are not the same as everyone's, and it's still no excuse to be urging beginners to use advanced gear. You can be flippant all you want, but if you look at the world of vaping, most people start with ego-style, and quit smoking juts fine.

And RDA and RBA are a CHOICE, and one that should be made by each person. They are not needed by the majority of people who are vaping and those who are starting out, to quit smoking and enjoy the experience.

If what you are claiming is true, then how did people suit smoking before RDAa and RBAs were available? I don't see anything that shows that the quitting rate skyrocketed when they became available.

I'm beginning to think your problem is more you don't like being told or asked what to do, and not the issue itself.

 

[suspectK]

my first post here... http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/new-members-forum/475668-2-4-packs-per-day.html#post10867279

HAHA..first response.

 

[Stosh]

Billy, a customer comes in who is 2-3 pack smoker what you going to sell him?

The turning point for me was UPGRADING to an eGo 650 mah with a CE2, good vapor, got my nic, happy camper after 40+ years of smoking. And I first learned about Ohm's Law in 1963, so it's never been about the science...

 

[BillyWJ]

When it comes the the New Members area the OP is speaking of, RBA suggestions should just be off limits. Let them, new vaper or experienced, get their five posts in and go to the appropriate area for more advanced, hobbyist vaping issues.

Let them learn to ride a bike and enjoy it a little before telling them they should be lacing their own wheels to get the best ride.

This. This is all I'm saying. Here in the general forum, if someone asks about upgrading, cool, it's fine. But we're talking about people with little or no experience with gear at all.

Like PBusardo says, everyone has their own journey. Let them take it. RDAs and RBAs are considered advanced gear for a reason.

It's also a matter of assuming that someone would LIKE a KayFun or Russian for all day use. It's a lot of vapor and flavor, and a lot of people will probably find that to be too much, or not to their liking - and I've seen plenty of posts from people who simply don't like the bulk of mods and mechs and such, they want a small, compact form, like an Ego or cigalike.

 

[beckdg]

So, your comfort level, experience, knowledge and such are exactly the same for everyone? Is that your point?

not at all. read that post over again. i posted what i'd suggest for someone who wants something that just works. that's not what i wanted. i don't conform to your ideal. you don't have to conform to mine. however, i won't be making threads attempting to tell everyone to conform to mine, either.

 

[beckdg]

HAHA..first response.

and a fine response it was. thank you, suspectK.

 

[sneakerpimp]

anybody can learn, just because they are new doesn't mean they are ......ed.

a short isn't going to blow your head off

+1

lighten up there OP, ur calling us a bunch of idiots.

 

[BillyWJ]

I'm surprised to hear this coming from a Californian.

I live here, I'm an import, I'm not a cloud chaser. It's cool and all, but I don't really see it (Clouuuuuuuds, maaaaaaaaan) as anything more than a stupid human trick. (Props to Dave Letterman)

I'm not even against RDAs in any way, I own one. But I know if I'd started out with one, I'd still be smoking out in the parking lot at midnight.

 

[Ref Minor]

It's about appropriateness, finding out what someone is capable of. Asking questions and actually listening to the answers. Too often someone posts telling people they have $50 and severe arthritis and people jump in to recommend a Provari and an RBA to build coils on.

 

[BillyWJ]

not at all. read that post over again. i posted what i'd suggest for someone who wants something that just works. that's not what i wanted. i don't conform to your ideal. you don't have to conform to mine. however, i won't be making threads attempting to tell everyone to conform to mine, either.

So, your issue is you think you're being told what to do and think, and not the issue itself?

 

[AegisPrime]

I smoked for 40 yrs 2-3 pack a day until RDAs came around I was just one step away everyday going back to analogs. Mostly cause or the inefficent carts and atomizers. For a serious smoker you are setting him up for failure putting him in a ego with protank.

Sorry, I have to disagree - I'm glad you found something that helped you quit, but I quit cigarettes entirely with a cigalike - I switched to better gear purely for financial reasons (rebuilding heads/DIY mixing).

Most smokers I know that are interested in vaping want the simplest, most reliable solution possible - they'd struggle even with a BCC.